pagerman @ work said:

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If a guy named Bob Smith or Mike Jones

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Who?!

Had to turn off the first part halfway through. Made me nauseous. Absolutely disgusting.

Boo Weekley said:

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pagerman @ work said:

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If a guy named Bob Smith or Mike Jones

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Who?!

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281-330-8004

COAg15 said:

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Had to turn off the first part halfway through. Made me nauseous. Absolutely disgusting.

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I sat on a jury for a pedo. Jurors got sick on multiple occasions. Horrible.

jock1020 said:

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The litmus test is would you trust your young son with this man given all that you have been told. I bet you switch to 100% believing the victims. The people that have a hard time believe this criminal was sick are either people who find themselves always being cynical, or people that can't believe a person that made a song that they liked from 30 years ago could be capable of such things, insurmountable evidence be damned.

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I agree with all of this except for the litmus test part. There's a lot of people in this world (like most of it) that I wouldn't trust with my kids... but I also don't think most of this world are pedophiles.

I had to shut it off when Safechuck started talking about the things he liked. I was a MJ fan like most kids my age in the 80's, but I don't think I could listen to him anymore after hearing that.

Just finished part 2. Absolutely disgusting what all the kids went through. So many families and lives affected. Awful.

Lt. Joe Bookman said:

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Boo Weekley said:

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pagerman @ work said:

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If a guy named Bob Smith or Mike Jones

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Who?!

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281-330-8004

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You rang?

ac04 said:

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60/40? wake the F up

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He's come a long way on this topic, so that's a pretty big deal.

Neverland Ranch needs to be nuked from orbit.

We're done as a society with this dude, right? No more Billie Jean. No Thriller. Definitely no Smooth Criminal. Done with him. I hope.

Art and the artist.

Brian Earl Spilner said:

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Art and the artist.

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I'm assuming you mean separating the art from the artist. I don't own an extensive MJ music collection, but I own a few songs that I loved. The year he died, I had Off The Wall playing heavily through my rotation.
I just don't think I can separate the two anymore. Maybe some people can, but after hearing what he did to those young boys made me sick to my stomach.

I know I can't. ****er was a monster.

It was more fun when Brian Earl Spilner spent the entirety of Breaking Bad arguing that Walter White was a good guy.

IJones23 said:

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Brian Earl Spilner said:

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Art and the artist.

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I'm assuming you mean separating the art from the artist. I don't own an extensive MJ music collection, but I own a few songs that I loved. The year he died, I had Off The Wall playing heavily through my rotation.
I just don't think I can separate the two anymore. Maybe some people can, but after hearing what he did to those young boys made me sick to my stomach.

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Gary Glitter is (rightfully) ostracized for his disgusting actions (ever hear Rock & Roll parr's 1 & 2 anymore? Why should Jackson be any different?

Or does our outrage and righteous indignation not apply to the super rich & famous?

Personally I'd like to see his ranch burned to the ground and the ashes quietly dumped offshore, the land sold and the proceeds given to charities for victims of pedophelia.

Not going to happen but a man can dream.

MW03 said:

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We're done as a society with this dude, right? No more Billie Jean. No Thriller. Definitely no Smooth Criminal. Done with him. I hope.

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Just listen to the Alien Ant Farm version. It is better anyways

Don't be a dick, dude.

Brian Earl Spilner said:

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Don't be a dick, dude.

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Are you 100% sure he's being a dick?

Fiance and I got through part 1... honestly don't think we can continue. Saw all we needed for ourselves. We spoke about what we remembered of the past trials and news... didn't really remember much. Not so much ostrich head in the sand, but were just busy with life.

As great as his music is, I don't want to hear it anymore. Kinda like Bill Cosby's great standup...

MW03 said:

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We're done as a society with this dude, right? No more Billie Jean. No Thriller. Definitely no Smooth Criminal. Done with him. I hope.

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Radio certainly isn't. Heard Billie Jean on the drive in this morning

I did read both participants in the documentary have pending lawsuits against Jackson's estate. Unfortunately that leaves open the possibility people will question their motives. I wish they weren't part of a lawsuit.

I wouldn't mind if Apple Music and Spotify took R. Kelly and MJ off of their streaming service.

What stuck out to me was just how manipulative, controlling, and possessive Jackson was with the boys. He would essentially have an actual short term relationship with each boy, get tired of them (or theyd get too old), then move on to the next one.

Also, interesting side note about one of the accusers in the documentary, Wade Robson. He was/is a famous choreographer from the 2000's. He had his own dance show on mtv, and was the main choreographer for N Sync and Britney Spears. Justin Timberlake's song 'Cry Me a River" is reported to be about Britney Spears cheating on him with Wade. I had no idea it was the same guy until part 2 when they showed him in a pic with N Sync. I remember watching N'Sync perform with Michael Jackson at an MTV Award Show, Im sure Wade was the one who set that up and made the connection.

Pretty crazy video of Wade on Jimmy Kimmel in 2003 denying being molested by Jackson. Both come across as huge ******bags, especially Jimmy lol.

Think what you want about the Australian guy. I happen to believe him, but whatever. The American dude still looks shook.

I was on a Federal Jury for a dirt bag that was setting up selling a couple of young girls. He was a groomer also. It's a subtle process and he was also up for possession and distribution of child porn. I watched about 20 minutes of this show and had to turn it off. From what I learned, MJ had all the classic signals with these kids and their families. Too creepy to watch, it's a honed craft.

His credibility is getting shredded on Twitter.
Feldman has come out saying he can no longer support Jackson. Not because he necessarily believes the allegations but because he's fighting to get states to change their statutory limits for child predators. I kinda think he's caving to the mob that likely attacked him with his initial tweet to defend Jackson. And he's working to protect children and this puts him in an awkward position.
I haven't watched this. And I won't. He's dead. What I don't understand is why Oprah is vocal about this now? Her voice was so much more powerful in 2005, IMO. I haven't watched anything she's done since 2008.
I saw there's an expensive-to-produce Jackson broadway play that was supposed to debut this weekend that's been put on hold. At least they're not tone deaf. I really wanted to see the Cirque du Soleil Jackson show. I've heard it's the best but they may get canceled as well. The article below is just to have some opinion of the other side.

https://medium.com/@justhoughts/leaving-neverland-debunked-in-10-minutes-or-less-35d2017469ba

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Winfrey is a presence suited to many kinds of difficult subjects, but especially this one: a survivor of childhood sexual abuse herself, the host opened the special by reminding viewers that she's dedicated 217 episodes of her show to the subject.

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I know she's a survivor. I watched her for years. But where was she in 2005? I can't remember how she covered his trial? This doesn't cover that or really help. But she did have 90 million viewers the first time she interviewed him.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/life/women-around-michael-jackson-have-changed-minds-singers-innocence/

There are multiple posters with usernames almost identical to yours, so apologoes of it was one of the other mazzags, but didnt you blame the victims in the #metoo movement last year for not coming forward sooner?

Not that I'm aware of but possibly. I'm female and I still don't understand how a decade+ of abuse went on without folks speaking up. I don't doubt the accusations against Weinstein at all. But so many kept silent for so long. I get he was powerful but even a druggie like Courtney Love spoke out against him. I guess she wasn't credible enough for the media?
Jackson was powerful too So when the 2005 trial happened, I figured that's it...he was done.