I think Bronn only confirmed he put her on the boat but never really answered whether he saw the ship sail away. My inclination was always that she never really left King's Landing. If that's not the case, then I don't think we ever heard how she got back.

Teddy Perkins said:

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I think Bronn only confirmed he put her on the boat but never really answered whether he saw the ship sail away. My inclination was always that she never really left King's Landing. If that's not the case, then I don't think we ever heard how she got back.

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this OR..... she got on and they were sailing away but we never saw that Tywin and/or Cersei had the ship stopped and got her back.

it was definitely left open ended unfortunately.

i doubt Bronn sold him out more likely the sneaky Lannisters were either aware or prepared.

I haven't followed this thread so I don't know what's been talked about but going through a rewatch it hit me....could Gendry be Robert Baratheons and Cersei's 1st born and actual heir to to Robert Baratheon??

In the second episode Cersei says she had a black of hair child and that he died at birth, then Gendry two episodes later says his mother was golden of hair but died...then I read this..

https://winteriscoming.net/2017/03/04/speculation-cersei-lannister-gendrys-real-mother/

Ol Jock 99 said:

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Yup I don't see them going with a neat and tidy wrap up of the ending and throne.

Someone with a knowledge of primogeniture would have to answer whether it mattered. I guess as first born son he would have a better right than the Queen.

If he isn't legitimized, would Cersei hold the greatest right as a "Baratheon" widow, or would some long lost uncle or cousin have a better claim?

And does the fact that Jon = Aegon, the son of Raegar, give him a better claim than Dany, daughter of the King? And does that matter at all, since the Targs were wiped out and knocked off the throne by Robert?

And if Gendry was Robert's true heir, could Cersei have a similar usurper's right as a Lannister since she blew everyone up and took the throne?

Sine poena nulla lex.

Sine poena nulla lex.

This.

Yeah that's true, I forgot about that. But having more of those POVs would have been better. They should have explored growing peasant resentment at the grassroots level, instead of spending time on the Faith Militant and other useless plot-lines. Then, when the nobles need to recruit tons of peasant manpower against the white walkers, it would be an interesting situation. Oh well.

Not really. Sure, it told us the people around Westeros were upset, but it didn't show it. The poor in the capital were shown, but they only did anything of substance when they "shamed" Cersei during her naked walk. Imo, the show creators could have done something akin to the build-up to the French Revolution. Take inspiration from that: taxes + no political say + unending wars = political upheaval. The Brotherhood Without Banners could have been the driving force for huge change like that, but instead the Brotherhood just wonders around in the woods.

You're right that they didn't show everything. They did show the urchins rioting and attacking the royal caravan. They showed small council discussion of the masses. And the rise of the faith militant was clearly a manifestation of populist uprising. They stopped that storyline short by having Cersei and Maester Igor blow up the crypt and all the troublemakers in it.

It wasn't exactly a French Revolution, but closer to Savonarola and the bonfires of the vanities in Renaissance Italy with a mad monk raising the masses against the opulence of the aristocracy, until the aristocracy felt threatened enough to put an end to his shenanigans.

Render said:

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Not really. Sure, it told us the people around Westeros were upset, but it didn't show it. The poor in the capital were shown, but they only did anything of substance when they "shamed" Cersei during her naked walk. Imo, the show creators could have done something akin to the build-up to the French Revolution. Take inspiration from that: taxes + no political say + unending wars = political upheaval. The Brotherhood Without Banners could have been the driving force for huge change like that, but instead the Brotherhood just wonders around in the woods.

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I think it did enough to show upheaval at the capital. They had to balance screen time towards an upheaval to screen time towards the characters and plot lines we've been seeing develop for years. And when the other major story line is the white walker advancement, well I'm happy with what they focused on.

G Martin 87 said:

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Social Media Influencer said:

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I bet the last Ep will be titled "A Dream of Spring"

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And at the end of the dream Ned wakes up and says to Catlyn, "You know, it sure is nice living up here in the North where no one from King's Landing ever bothers us. Think I'll take Bran hunting this morning."

Fin.

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Ned and Cat, who've been living in a nice but small Boston brownstone for the past few years, walk into Bran's bedroom and find him staring into a snowglobe with a suspiciously familiar looking castle in it.

"It's all he ever looks at", complains Cat.

"Well," answers Ned thoughtfully, "at least he isn't climbing around on the roof anymore. Could have fallen and broken his neck."

Fin.

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I would seriously be looking for some people.... and not you George...the SHOW writers.

Some good points. We do seem to know more about everyday people in Essos and nothing much in Westros. In the North it almost seems like only Castles with no towns or villages. And it's weird how no one lives near any of the Castles except in Kings Landing.

Funny thing is I wouldn't be the least but surprised if GRRM has made his way to this board at least once in his life.

clinker03 said:

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So we are rewatching the series and got to Tyrion's trial. One, what a great acting job by Dinklage at the end there. So, so good.

Second - do we ever find out how Shae gets back to King's landing? The last we had heard about her was at Joffry's wedding when Bron swore to Tyrion that he watched her get on the boat and have it sail away. I don't think he was lying to Tyrion but could be wrong.

How/who got her off that boat and back to King's landing?

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Might be misremembering, but at the time of Joffrey's death, didn't Tywin say to basically shut down the city/harbor and no one was allowed to leave the city?

I assumed when they closed the harbor her ship was stopped and she was found

Hello there said:

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Funny thing is I wouldn't be the least but surprised if GRRM has made his way to this board at least once in his life.

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All his stuff is in our Cushing Library AND he's a big football fan...I bet he has!

Counterpoint said:

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Hello there said:

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Funny thing is I wouldn't be the least but surprised if GRRM has made his way to this board at least once in his life.

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All his stuff is in our Cushing Library AND he's a big football fan...I bet he has!

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Hes a Giants fan...not sure if he has a college team...

Tony Franklins Other Shoe said:

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Or....

Dany, Jon, Tyrion, and the Hound are walking around a small village and they see a White Walker kill a peasant. They just stand there and watch it happen when the Hound finally says "the stupid, weak **** had it coming". The are promptly arrested, put on trial, we get to see all the surviving main characters vouch for their greatness, but Judge Judy rules them guilty for not helping stop it and they get thrown in jail for 2 years.

Fin

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Blindside05 said:

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clinker03 said:

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So we are rewatching the series and got to Tyrion's trial. One, what a great acting job by Dinklage at the end there. So, so good.

Second - do we ever find out how Shae gets back to King's landing? The last we had heard about her was at Joffry's wedding when Bron swore to Tyrion that he watched her get on the boat and have it sail away. I don't think he was lying to Tyrion but could be wrong.

How/who got her off that boat and back to King's landing?

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Might be misremembering, but at the time of Joffrey's death, didn't Tywin say to basically shut down the city/harbor and no one was allowed to leave the city?

I assumed when they closed the harbor her ship was stopped and she was found

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Shae had already "left" the city well before Joffreys death. ("Left" is in quotes because we can't be sure she actually left the capital.)

Render said:

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Not really. Sure, it told us the people around Westeros were upset, but it didn't show it. The poor in the capital were shown, but they only did anything of substance when they "shamed" Cersei during her naked walk. Imo, the show creators could have done something akin to the build-up to the French Revolution. Take inspiration from that: taxes + no political say + unending wars = political upheaval. The Brotherhood Without Banners could have been the driving force for huge change like that, but instead the Brotherhood just wonders around in the woods.

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The Faith Militant was not a useless sub-plot/arc. It was the vehicle ultimately used for Cersei to fully take power. She killed all of her enemies in King's Landing in one blast of wildfire - the Faith, The High Sparrow, the Tyrells, and Kevin Lannister. And it made for one of the best "oh sh**" moments in the entire series. That episode is amazing.

And in the books, all the Brotherhood essentially did was wander the woods as well. I'll give you that one, just another GRRM rabbit hole. One of many that turned a three book series in to five, than seven, than ultimately he couldn't finish them.

But this story was never about the commoners or political upheaval and populace movements. It was about powerful individuals and families waging outright and political war against each other for power.

Wasn't she put on the boat the same day as the wedding though? There was a deleted scene where Bronn is taking her to the ship and says at the end as the wedding bells are tolling "Come on, I've got a wedding to get to".



Thanks for the responses - I am now thinking, based strictly on the show that it is a combination of these two things:

Quote:

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I think Bronn only confirmed he put her on the boat but never really answered whether he saw the ship sail away. My inclination was always that she never really left King's Landing. If that's not the case, then I don't think we ever heard how she got back.

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Quote:

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Might be misremembering, but at the time of Joffrey's death, didn't Tywin say to basically shut down the city/harbor and no one was allowed to leave the city?

I assumed when they closed the harbor her ship was stopped and she was found

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Bronn doesn't actually watch the ship sail away, but even if he did it wouldn't matter, because Tywin closed down the port hours later after Joffrey's death. We could debate all we want about the time it would take for the ship to set sail and leave the port, but that is never discussed on the show and ultimately doesn't matter.

Also, Tywin asked for Shae to be brought to his chambers at the breakfast that morning, so we can assume he had people looking for her. When the ships were stopped and searched for Sansa, they found Shae and brought her to him.

The only other explanation is that Bronn was already being paid by Tywin and/or Cersei and he never delivered her to the ship, but instead to Tywin. Thus the line "now go start drinking until it feels like you did the right thing" as an allusion to his guilt - but I think that leaves more up to the imagination - strictly show speaking.

Anyways, just my two cents after taking a dive down this rabbit hole. Thanks for the responses.

The only redeeming Shae quality was that she was a porn star in real life.