If Dany shows up with Dragons, Who wouldn't bow in the 7 kingdoms? The Cersei and maybe Ramsay, neither of which I expect to live make it that far. If she seems lenient/forgiving unlike her father I think just about everyone will bow, especially with the the threat of a dragon. As the video said earlier, Dragons have replaced gunpowder as the trump card to castles. I also expect the white walkers to have shown up by then as well, so the choice gets really simple at that point.
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Last: 8 yr ago by hunter2012
Fire and blood.
Well the Stark's aren't necessarily lovers of the Targaryens
Ask Haran about "minimal destruction". Dude got melted in his own castle.
To be fair he was Ironborn. They dumb.
I am a little disappointed that Benjen was a riding a regular horse instead of badass hart. Also in the books he is followed by a murder of crows.
I think a big storm wipes out most of Danaerys' army crossing to Westeros. Just some sort of feeling...
quote:
Well the Stark's aren't necessarily lovers of the Targaryens
Starks weren't crazy about Wildlings either, but every living Stark (and Stark/Targ) in Westeros feels differently now.
Unless Jon's revealed parentage and new "**** it, there is no god, and oaths mean nothing" attitude has him hellbent on the iron throne at all costs, I think he'd probably bow to Dany and her dragons like any other sensible person who doesn't want to be burnt living would.
quote:
Ask Haran about "minimal destruction". Dude got melted in his own castle.
That's just one castle on a massive continent
quote:
WWE might be the one form of entertainment to rival star wars in terms of money made
*I have no idea if this is close to accurate
This made me laugh. Refreshing honesty.
I feel like some of you are way misreading what the writers are trying to convey in that ending speech with Danny.
I don't think anything Danny has done is supposed to foreshadow a heel turn. I think they knew that not much happened in that episode and they needed a way to end on a high note, and show that Danny has control of her dragon and has a focus once she gets back to Mereen. There is nothing so far to suggest she will abandon the people she has freed. Danny has shown over and over again that she is a good person. Way too much is being read into that speech. She really didn't say anything different than her "I'm going to break the Wheel" speech. The Seven Kingdom's government is crap and sorely in need of a strong ruler/emperor. Part of Danny's entire arc is balancing her deep humanity with the cold realities of leadership. The growth you are seeing in her is growing into a person that can make the hard decisions that are necessary to bring about a greater good.
My guess is that if Tyrion's diplomacy did not end the hostilities permanently, then Danny will return to find Mereen under siege or threatened and ambush the forces with her force to turn the tide and end the hostilities. Things will be somewhat under control when she leaves on the ships to sail for Westeros.
Jon is going to be the unsung hero/sacrificial lamb in all of this. Danny will be who is left to rule in the aftermath. I don't expect Jon Snow to survive the series, and I also suspect at least one hated character will survive to the end, but other than that, I suspect a conventionally happy ending, despite all the "you don't know Martin" comments that get thrown around. (Several other major characters will die, but in the end there will be peace in Westeros and wise/benevolent leader on the throne).
I also don't get the feeling that Jon no longer respects oaths after his death. Rather, I think he feels as though he fulfilled his oath and he was betrayed by his brothers, to boot.
I don't think anything Danny has done is supposed to foreshadow a heel turn. I think they knew that not much happened in that episode and they needed a way to end on a high note, and show that Danny has control of her dragon and has a focus once she gets back to Mereen. There is nothing so far to suggest she will abandon the people she has freed. Danny has shown over and over again that she is a good person. Way too much is being read into that speech. She really didn't say anything different than her "I'm going to break the Wheel" speech. The Seven Kingdom's government is crap and sorely in need of a strong ruler/emperor. Part of Danny's entire arc is balancing her deep humanity with the cold realities of leadership. The growth you are seeing in her is growing into a person that can make the hard decisions that are necessary to bring about a greater good.
My guess is that if Tyrion's diplomacy did not end the hostilities permanently, then Danny will return to find Mereen under siege or threatened and ambush the forces with her force to turn the tide and end the hostilities. Things will be somewhat under control when she leaves on the ships to sail for Westeros.
Jon is going to be the unsung hero/sacrificial lamb in all of this. Danny will be who is left to rule in the aftermath. I don't expect Jon Snow to survive the series, and I also suspect at least one hated character will survive to the end, but other than that, I suspect a conventionally happy ending, despite all the "you don't know Martin" comments that get thrown around. (Several other major characters will die, but in the end there will be peace in Westeros and wise/benevolent leader on the throne).
I also don't get the feeling that Jon no longer respects oaths after his death. Rather, I think he feels as though he fulfilled his oath and he was betrayed by his brothers, to boot.
quote:There has been some foreshadowing that this will happen in my opinion. Dany will survive the trip but not her Dothraki horde. They hate the water for a reason.
I think a big storm wipes out most of Danaerys' army crossing to Westeros. Just some sort of feeling...
That reason being dumb superstition?
agreed....except the part about Jons fate.
I have no doubt it will be Dany and Jon. If not married then Dany supreme leader and Jon has the north in loyalty to her and will be the hero of the battle vs. the WW/etc. Tyrion gets Casterly Rock as all the other Lannisters are dead anyway.
But yes, as fas as Dany's speech way too much is being read into it....it was simply a rah rah speech and dramatic use of the dragon to further inspire her new huge army. They've seen her walk out of fire and now ride a dragon. It was a let's roll speech. Honestly she didn't have a speech after walking out of fire, this was just needed. And partly dramatic episode theatrics.
She may not be the rule the peacetime governing type, but she probably learns from this that others can rule in her absence (like Tyrion) so appoint the right people and do what you do.
I have no doubt it will be Dany and Jon. If not married then Dany supreme leader and Jon has the north in loyalty to her and will be the hero of the battle vs. the WW/etc. Tyrion gets Casterly Rock as all the other Lannisters are dead anyway.
But yes, as fas as Dany's speech way too much is being read into it....it was simply a rah rah speech and dramatic use of the dragon to further inspire her new huge army. They've seen her walk out of fire and now ride a dragon. It was a let's roll speech. Honestly she didn't have a speech after walking out of fire, this was just needed. And partly dramatic episode theatrics.
She may not be the rule the peacetime governing type, but she probably learns from this that others can rule in her absence (like Tyrion) so appoint the right people and do what you do.
I'm hoping that Jon/Starks gain control/keep the north. Dany can have the South for all I care.
quote:Isn't that what is kind of weird about all of this? There's so much focus on the Stark kids that you want the Starks to still come out as "King of the North", but it really needs to be an "all or nothing" kind of thing for Dany taking over Westeros. Perhaps we end the story similar to Aegon and Dorne, where Dorne is just kind of given a free pass? But that would seem rather uninspiring IMO.
I'm hoping that Jon/Starks gain control/keep the north. Dany can have the South for all I care.
I could see it ending with Dany sitting on the throne, Sansa being good friends with Dany, Lady of Winterfell, and Warden of the North, and Jon goes back to the wall to spend the rest of his life hunting for any remaining WWs . There's just something about Jon's story that makes me think he'll never be satisfied sitting in a chair ruling over people and getting fat. I suppose that scenario would still satisfy you since Sansa is in charge (Warden) of the North?
Seeing as GRRM has gone on record as saying the ending will be bittersweet, I'm sort of bracing for an eventual struggle between Jon/Starks and Dany, and the audience will have to watch one of those two forces be destroyed.
quote:*Dany
I feel like some of you are way misreading what the writers are trying to convey in that ending speech with Danny.
I don't think anything Danny has done is supposed to foreshadow a heel turn. I think they knew that not much happened in that episode and they needed a way to end on a high note, and show that Danny has control of her dragon and has a focus once she gets back to Mereen. There is nothing so far to suggest she will abandon the people she has freed. Danny has shown over and over again that she is a good person. Way too much is being read into that speech. She really didn't say anything different than her "I'm going to break the Wheel" speech. The Seven Kingdom's government is crap and sorely in need of a strong ruler/emperor. Part of Danny's entire arc is balancing her deep humanity with the cold realities of leadership. The growth you are seeing in her is growing into a person that can make the hard decisions that are necessary to bring about a greater good.
My guess is that if Tyrion's diplomacy did not end the hostilities permanently, then Danny will return to find Mereen under siege or threatened and ambush the forces with her force to turn the tide and end the hostilities. Things will be somewhat under control when she leaves on the ships to sail for Westeros.
Jon is going to be the unsung hero/sacrificial lamb in all of this. Danny will be who is left to rule in the aftermath. I don't expect Jon Snow to survive the series, and I also suspect at least one hated character will survive to the end, but other than that, I suspect a conventionally happy ending, despite all the "you don't know Martin" comments that get thrown around. (Several other major characters will die, but in the end there will be peace in Westeros and wise/benevolent leader on the throne).
I also don't get the feeling that Jon no longer respects oaths after his death. Rather, I think he feels as though he fulfilled his oath and he was betrayed by his brothers, to boot.
I completely agree with you on all accounts. I don't believe Jon has any desire to rule Winterfell or Westeros. The Starks are the first main characters introduced to us in the series and have always been seen as so. They've also suffered more than any other characters. Any little success they have is usually met with destructive follow-ups. If I had to choose between the two families, I'd rather the Starks win out in the end as well as Jon staying loyal to his family rather than what may be revealed to be different bloodlines. I could see it end where Dany takes Westeros, but leaves the North due to how much of a part they will play in the war against the WW. I'm not hugely invested in Dany's story because she has been given these mythical beasts that are basically viewed as all-powerful. She was badass in taking Slaver's Bay with her armies, but hasn't done a very good job of ruling them and then complains about how she deserves all of Westeros. I like her character, but she's not near the top for me.
quote:This. The first thing I thought when he showed up was, "bummer they didn't have enough in the budget to CGI a giant elk for him to be riding."
I am a little disappointed that Benjen was a riding a regular horse instead of badass hart. Also in the books he is followed by a murder of crows.
This is my Coldhands:
GRRM saying the end will be bittersweet means to me the good guys will win, but a loved or most beloved character(s) will die to make it happen. The question is,"What is winning?" Freedom or control over the masses?
I don't know GRRM very well, but he strikes me as narcissistic enough to realize with his apparent failing health, that he wants to be the one finishing the story (he's said as much) and he wants to "finish" the story. No current "evil" people escaping to revisit pain upon the world. Victory is obvious (or obvious to be impossible?)
What does GRRM want to "tell the world"? One kingdom is the way to peace. (In real life, pro-one world order)
Or splitting back into 7 equal and peaceful kingdoms is best. (In real life, pro- smaller, more localized government. )
I don't know GRRM very well, but he strikes me as narcissistic enough to realize with his apparent failing health, that he wants to be the one finishing the story (he's said as much) and he wants to "finish" the story. No current "evil" people escaping to revisit pain upon the world. Victory is obvious (or obvious to be impossible?)
What does GRRM want to "tell the world"? One kingdom is the way to peace. (In real life, pro-one world order)
Or splitting back into 7 equal and peaceful kingdoms is best. (In real life, pro- smaller, more localized government. )
quote:fixed it for me.
...Dany'...I like hercharactersweet cans, butshe's not near the top for me.her continually circling character arc is nauseating and tiresome
quote:quote:
Well the Stark's aren't necessarily lovers of the Targaryens
Starks weren't crazy about Wildlings either, but every living Stark (and Stark/Targ) in Westeros feels differently now.
Unless Jon's revealed parentage and new "**** it, there is no god, and oaths mean nothing" attitude has him hellbent on the iron throne at all costs, I think he'd probably bow to Dany and her dragons like any other sensible person who doesn't want to be burnt living would.
Jon didn't break his oath. They're sworn into service until they die... which he did.
If Tommen dies ( and I think he does by the end of this season) who is next in line for the throne or is last episode a set up for the High Sparrow to take control when he does.
quote:They're killing off the wolves to save money, you aint getting no damn giant elk. You get zombies and dragons, that's it. And titties. And some dude's ballsac which for the life of me was probably the most bizarre thing they have ever done on the show. Why?
I am a little disappointed that Benjen was a riding a regular horse instead of badass hart. Also in the books he is followed by a murder of crows.
quote:But it would have been totally dope
They're killing off the wolves to save money, you aint getting no damn giant elk
quote:wordquote:But it would have been totally dope
They're killing off the wolves to save money, you aint getting no damn giant elk
quote:quote:fixed it for me.
...Dany'...I like hercharactersweet cans, butshe's not near the top for me.her continually circling character arc is nauseating and tiresome
To be fair, the show has the least to work with on her. Her story in the books (especially books 2 & 5) is maddeningly plodding and goes nowhere.
I don't know, I suppose the show has been set up to TELL us that she hasn't done a good job of running the cities, but I really feel like her troubles have been more a symptom of abolishing generations of slavery, rather than her own shortcomings as a ruler. Point being, even Tywin Lannister (or some other effective leader) would have trouble trying to manage the three cities after taking them over and changing the fundamental way they function.
Full disclosure, I'm not a book reader so perhaps there are more examples of her being a poor ruler in the books.
Full disclosure, I'm not a book reader so perhaps there are more examples of her being a poor ruler in the books.
quote:
If Tommen dies ( and I think he does by the end of this season) who is next in line for the throne or is last episode a set up for the High Sparrow to take control when he does.
Well Jaime only wasn't considered in line because he was Kingsguard right?
Could his removal of that position open the door for him to claim it?
I mean at least for Casterly Rock with Tywin dead and him out of the kingsguard he could claim CR.
And he has as decent a claim as any Baratheon brother ever had because it is not as if they inherited from their father - Robert was the usurper. It wasn't a Baratheon throne prior to that.
Otherwise there really isn't a male heir to stake a claim.
The High Sparrow will have Tommen assassinated with clues pointing at the Tyrells. Margaery will gleefully take the Iron Throne. Lannister vs Tyrell with the Faith Militant swooping in to pick up the pieces.
Company I-1, Ord-Ords '85 -12thFan and Websider-
If we're talking claims based on Baratheon lineage
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Something tells me Cersei's machinations get Margaery killed. And in his dispair, Tommen offs himself. I agree he doesnt finish out the season. But I dont think Margaery does either. Something has to set off the Tyrell v Lannister plot even more.
****Please note that this theory of mine is in no way attributable or in any way due to the spoiler link. These thoughts are my own***
****Please note that this theory of mine is in no way attributable or in any way due to the spoiler link. These thoughts are my own***
quote:Well, considering things usually go down the family line, the throne is now under the Baratheons. Which means Jaime is not in line b/c he's not Baratheon. It would fall to Margarey, and then any male heir if she were to have one. If not, she could remarry and the throne would then go her new husband, I think.quote:
If Tommen dies ( and I think he does by the end of this season) who is next in line for the throne or is last episode a set up for the High Sparrow to take control when he does.
Well Jaime only wasn't considered in line because he was Kingsguard right?
Could his removal of that position open the door for him to claim it?
I mean at least for Casterly Rock with Tywin dead and him out of the kingsguard he could claim CR.
And he has as decent a claim as any Baratheon brother ever had because it is not as if they inherited from their father - Robert was the usurper. It wasn't a Baratheon throne prior to that.
Otherwise there really isn't a male heir to stake a claim.
By the way, that seems about right. She's due for another wedding, anyway. 1st and 5th seasons are the only ones in which she didn't, right?
quote:There's not much of a versus plot, at the moment. They are all but close friends as long as the sparrows are around.
Something has to set off the Tyrell v Lannister plot even more.
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