I'm still holding out hope that the Manderly's bring some pie as a gift to Ramsay but I'm just not sure what will be in the pie now that there's no Frey love with the Boltons. Maybe some of his 20 goodmen will be in the pie.

Quick Tower of Joy Recap:

Kit Harrington says "Sorry"....lol.

http://mashable.com/2016/05/01/kit-harington-reacts-game-of-thrones/#X81RhR6vdaq4

An interesting thought on Tyrion also being a Targaryen (not my theory, but read it on some random YouTube comment... But I went back to verify and it's true)...

When Jorah sees Dany the fire with her three dragons... The placement of each dragon seems strategic. One was on her shoulder (Drogon)... That will be the one she flies. The second is her holding the dragon like a baby and nursing it--Jon Snow, her nephew. And the third is by her leg climbing on her knee... Which represents her half brother/dwarf.

Seems credible... GRRM and the show writers LOVE their symbolism (dire wolves anyone??). What do y'all think?

Hmm could be possible I guess.

quote:

---

The Roose death scence seemed poorly thought out by D&D and very short-sighted. I guess I'm supposed to believe Roose doesn't have any guards, loyalists, page, squire etc etc anywhere? Even the meister balks. A knife wound looks a helluva lot different then poison why didn't D&D just write the death scene as a poisoning?

Everything else was fantastic but this just seemed odd. If it's so easy to kill a lord of a major house then Westeros would be ruled by nothing but b@stards(literally speaking)!

---

I think you're overthinking this. For one thing, Roose didn't feel like he had to fear Ramsay. Second, in last week's episode Ramsay reminded the Maester that he had been afraid of Ramsay even when Ramsay was a child. Third, poison is a woman's weapon and not employed quickly. Ramsay was ready to seize the opportunity to kill Roose if the baby was a boy and a threat. That's it.

I think Tyrion is the Mad King's son. Tywin always knew it. And once alluded to it. Tyrion seemed quite confident entering the dragon liar. He seemed to know he was not in danger. IMO this confirms he is not Tywin's son.

quote:

---

I think Tyrion is the Mad King's son. Tywin always knew it. And once alluded

---

How so?

Melisandre definitely brought back Jon. After she says that phrase she was repeating during the "procedure" a couple of times, you see her stop and glance down and become more intent. I think she even says "please" a few moments later. To me that was her feeling something -- like she actually had a chance to bring him back -- almost like a "wait this might work...but why?"

I think Mel understanding that there is more to it all than just her own agenda/belief is critical here. I think she will be the driving force in helping Jon understand that he is back for a bigger purpose.

quote:

---

quote:

---

The Roose death scence seemed poorly thought out by D&D and very short-sighted. I guess I'm supposed to believe Roose doesn't have any guards, loyalists, page, squire etc etc anywhere? Even the meister balks. A knife wound looks a helluva lot different then poison why didn't D&D just write the death scene as a poisoning?

Everything else was fantastic but this just seemed odd. If it's so easy to kill a lord of a major house then Westeros would be ruled by nothing but b@stards(literally speaking)!

---

I think you're overthinking this. For one thing, Roose didn't feel like he had to fear Ramsay. Second, in last week's episode Ramsay reminded the Maester that he had been afraid of Ramsay even when Ramsay was a child. Third, poison is a woman's weapon and not employed quickly. Ramsay was ready to seize the opportunity to kill Roose if the baby was a boy and a threat. That's it.

---

Didn't Ramsay kill the eldest Domeric Bolton with poison?

Ramsey also didn't arrive at the dreadfort till he was in his teens.

quote:

---

quote:

---

quote:

---

The Roose death scence seemed poorly thought out by D&D and very short-sighted. I guess I'm supposed to believe Roose doesn't have any guards, loyalists, page, squire etc etc anywhere? Even the meister balks. A knife wound looks a helluva lot different then poison why didn't D&D just write the death scene as a poisoning?

Everything else was fantastic but this just seemed odd. If it's so easy to kill a lord of a major house then Westeros would be ruled by nothing but b@stards(literally speaking)!

---

I think you're overthinking this. For one thing, Roose didn't feel like he had to fear Ramsay. Second, in last week's episode Ramsay reminded the Maester that he had been afraid of Ramsay even when Ramsay was a child. Third, poison is a woman's weapon and not employed quickly. Ramsay was ready to seize the opportunity to kill Roose if the baby was a boy and a threat. That's it.

---

Didn't Ramsay kill the eldest Domeric Bolton with poison?

Ramsey also didn't arrive at the dreadfort till he was in his teens.

---

Thats book Ramsey. Show Ramsey got to the Dreadfort as a younger child - that's when he became friends with the houndmaster's daughter.

i personally thought Roose's demise made total sense in the context of the story

Ramsay was Roose's biggest blind spot and his ultimate downfall. he intellectually knew Ramsay was a psycho and needed to be contained, but he legitimately thought he was the one person who could contain him, and the one person Ramsay actually did have some fear for - which may have been true at one point, but Ramsay's been steadily given more and more power, and for all his sadistic tendencies, he's not stupid. he knew Roose was over-confident about his hold on the north and he took advantage of that by siding with the Karstarks (and presumably other great Northern houses, as we'll learn soon)

i could easily see those lords making the same mistake in underestimating Ramsay. he simply won't be taken down by political backstabbing. i personally think (and dearly hope) that Theon takes him down because no other northern lord will be able to

quote:

---

My guess was that the gift for Ramsay is Rickon Stark and Asha. Weren't they heading to one of the large northern houses a couple seasons ago?

---

Ramsay was Roose's biggest blind spot and his ultimate downfall. he intellectually knew Ramsay was a psycho and needed to be contained, but he legitimately thought he was the one person who could contain him, and the one person Ramsay actually did have some fear for - which may have been true at one point, but Ramsay's been steadily given more and more power, and for all his sadistic tendencies, he's not stupid. he knew Roose was over-confident about his hold on the north and he took advantage of that by siding with the Karstarks (and presumably other great Northern houses, as we'll learn soon)

This too.

quote:

---

oh dur and Bran scene finally (even though it wasn't much, sets up for next week and more of this season)

curious what will be Meera's role going forward. oh and i love the redesign of the child of the forest from what they had in season 4, it looks less like a cute snow nymph and more of a darker creature

---

I liked the redesign a lot too. A hidden nugget in the statement about Meera is that the CotF said that Bran wouldn't be staying there forever. I really thought he would takeover for the three-eyed raven/crow, but maybe he really will warg into something (dragon?) but from close by instead of from the cave.

quote:

---

quote:

---

quote:

---

So What do you think it will mean for Jon now that he's possibly released from his oath?

---

No possible, he died and fulfilled his oath. He is a free agent to rain vengeance on the north.

---

I hope they move in this direction and he retakes Winterfel in episode 8 as mentioned above. But the only holdup is that Jon knows the true enemy and will never truly abandon the Wall and Watch.

---

But as the leader of the north (or by making Sansa the Wardeness), they could rally much more support to defend the wall.

quote:

---

Book Jamie could survive to the end. Obviously we haven't seen him react to the death of the daughter but besides that he has evolved far enough to survive whatever happens.

---

I think many believe he will kill Cersei by the end and die in the process. The prophecy about Cersie being killed by her little brother is assumed to be Tyrion, but Jamie is technically younger as well. That being said, book Jamie and book Cersei have a WAY different relationship than the show versions of their characters.

quote:

---

quote:

---

quote:

---

Other thoughts: Ned doesn't seem like the type to put such a bad beat down on someone to the point of loss of speech.

---

No, he's not the type. At least Adult Ned isn't. Could this be a life-altering formative event for Ned? Maybe it's a tragic accident. Maybe Benjen does it. Somebody is going to ring his bell hard and that will result in his condition.

---

My guess is if we see it in the book it will be Robert. Who knows about the show, but that seems like something Robert would do.

It is also possible Hodor gets hurt in some sort of accident. Maybe he is in the wrong place when the sister runs off or something with the tower of joy.

---

If he is a stable-boy, it's very likely that a horse simply kicked him in the head or something. It could kill someone smaller, but for him it just scrambled his mind.

quote:

---

Speaking of there being a major northern house in there with Roose and Ramsay...

Why would the Umbers get behind Bolton? I know it was Karstark in that scene, and their siding with Bolton is obvious. The Umbers, however, were loyal to Robb, and were also victims of the Red Wedding (which Bolton helped plan). If a previous post is correct in saying it's the Umbers telling Ramsay they brought a gift...why would they? Unless they are planning a secret attack?

Also, what blowback will Ramsay's actions create with the Freys?

---

The northern houses are at least playing as loyal right now, but I doubt they would ever bring Ramsay Rickon unless the show is changing that as well. In the books I believe some of the houses are even somewhat split (or at least appearing that way to get some on the inside and some on the outside).

quote:

---

Please, oh please let the Manderlys and Umbers start the revenge soon. Although, I don't know how easily the Karstarks will forgive and turn on Bolton. That guy in Winterfell was quick to back Ramsay in front of the maester.

---

I think this is definitely the direction they are going after bringing up the names of all of these houses. I think Ramsay starts to gather his power for the fight later in the season, but that we see that some of the northerners are actually fighting against him (they may even be with him until the battle actually starts).

quote:

---

Why is Davis all on in Jon Snow? Some random ******* Lod Commander be barely knows?

Am I forgetting something?

He was awfully loyal to stannis and now he's just "oh well, stannis is dead. I like this new guy Jon Snow!"

---

Not so strange, actually. I think Davos is a great judge of character. He actually has the heart of a king, too bad he can't rule. He saw something noble in Jon and those who rallied to him.

You noticed when the red witch came back the only person he asked about was Shirleen. I was soooo hoping he would defy Stanis and take her with him when he left.

Also, Davos isn't stupid, Stanis is dead, no longer beholden to him and/or matters what Stanis wouldve/couldve done, I think he probably thought Stanis was a **** to do to Shirleenwhan he did anyway (if he found out how she died).

Life is about the living, so Davos is moving on.

quote:

---

quote:

---

Book Jamie could survive to the end. Obviously we haven't seen him react to the death of the daughter but besides that he has evolved far enough to survive whatever happens.

---

I think many believe he will kill Cersei by the end and die in the process. The prophecy about Cersie being killed by her little brother is assumed to be Tyrion, but Jamie is technically younger as well. That being said, book Jamie and book Cersei have a WAY different relationship than the show versions of their characters.

---

agreed, Jaime is commonly thought of as the actual Valonqar that the witch woman warned Cersei about. i'm still waiting for their show relationship to start becoming more strained like it did in the books, though...if anything, it seems to have gotten stronger

They may be expanding that power, but there is a werewolf in the heart of winterfell, not just in their weir wood forest. Isn't that what they show in the opening sequence?

BTW, I still want Frey to get his for the wedding.

And I want the Sparrow weirdos to get theirs too.

http://gameofthrones.wikia.com/wiki/Weirwood

Pretty sure the tree in the opening sequence represents the Godswood.

Anyway, not saying it's good or bad, just noting a difference. Bran was seeing the past through his own body and he was able to move around. I believe in the book he saw Ned praying among other visions that went further back in time.

quote:

---

quote:

---

Please, oh please let the Manderlys and Umbers start the revenge soon. Although, I don't know how easily the Karstarks will forgive and turn on Bolton. That guy in Winterfell was quick to back Ramsay in front of the maester.

---

I think this is definitely the direction they are going after bringing up the names of all of these houses. I think Ramsay starts to gather his power for the fight later in the season, but that we see that some of the northerners are actually fighting against him (they may even be with him until the battle actually starts).

---

Plus a surprise stabbing in the back is much cheaper to shoot than a huge epic battle. Especially when we will probably be seeing one in the near future over in Slaver's Bay.

In the books he saw only events from the perspective of the tree.

quote:

---

quote:

---

quote:

---

Please, oh please let the Manderlys and Umbers start the revenge soon. Although, I don't know how easily the Karstarks will forgive and turn on Bolton. That guy in Winterfell was quick to back Ramsay in front of the maester.

---

I think this is definitely the direction they are going after bringing up the names of all of these houses. I think Ramsay starts to gather his power for the fight later in the season, but that we see that some of the northerners are actually fighting against him (they may even be with him until the battle actually starts).

---

Plus a surprise stabbing in the back is much cheaper to shoot than a huge epic battle. Especially when we will probably be seeing one in the near future over in Slaver's Bay.

---

we'll still get an epic battle in the north, i think that's been all but confirmed by press releases/trailers

quote:

---

Also I looked up the sigils in the episode 3 preview trailer, the Umbers show up with "a gift". Their castle, "the Last Hearth" is where Rickon and Osha were headed at the end of season 3.

Does not bode well...

In the book he's at the island of Skagos I believe.

---

Remember that the Umber's are some hardcore Stark loyalists. Maybe that gift is something that is gonna wipe that grin off Ramsey's face. Please.