*** DC Extended Universe ***

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AggieLitigator
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Bruce Almighty said:

Mera (played by Amanda Heard)


She fine.
Brick Tamland
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He has a writer deal with WB (for DC movies) and DC comics. He's just not responsible for the overall direction and mapping out the universe anymore
Render
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AG
Questions for TC:

The DC and Dark Universe misfires got me thinking, are the people who run these studios fans of the IPs they own? Do they enjoy movies? Do they read their IP's materials (comics, novels, etc) in their spare time? I know that sounds silly, but I'm just wondering. I always assumed that if someone was in charge of a property, then they had a passion for the IP. But is it simply more a job for those people? I'm not hating on those people, just curious about the personalities in charge and dynamics of their job.

And in your experience, is Marvel's cinematic-universe success the big goal/zeitgeist among executives/management in Hollywood? Do studios consciously push away new ideas in favor of older stuff?

Additionally, is there a lot of people in the wings of Hollywood (such as yourself; people in the up-and-coming leadership generation of Hollywood) who are more willing to take creative risks and want to move away from the reboot-formula? Do you all chaff under the current leadership? Do you think that generation will change the creative arc of movies when they take charge in the next 20-30 years?

Sorry for all the questions, and thanks for your time in advance.
Forum Troll
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AG
GiveEmHellBill said:

p-townag said:

Crazy. Wasn't everybody over the moon when Geoff Johns took over? That turned out to be incredibly underwhelming and now he's already ousted.
Was he ousted or did he just give up and go back to the comics side (and kept the Green Lantern movie)?
My understanding is he is going back more of a creative role (writing, which is where he belongs) and not all the executive type stuff
bearamedic99
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Render said:

Questions for TC:

The DC and Dark Universe misfires got me thinking, are the people who run these studios fans of the IPs they own? Do they enjoy movies? Do they read their IP's materials (comics, novels, etc) in their spare time? I know that sounds silly, but I'm just wondering. I always assumed that if someone was in charge of a property, then they had a passion for the IP. But is it simply more a job for those people? I'm not hating on those people, just curious about the personalities in charge and dynamics of their job.

And in your experience, is Marvel's cinematic-universe success the big goal/zeitgeist among executives/management in Hollywood? Do studios consciously push away new ideas in favor of older stuff?

Additionally, is there a lot of people in the wings of Hollywood (such as yourself; people in the up-and-coming leadership generation of Hollywood) who are more willing to take creative risks and want to move away from the reboot-formula? Do you all chaff under the current leadership? Do you think that generation will change the creative arc of movies when they take charge in the next 20-30 years?

Sorry for all the questions, and thanks for your time in advance.


take it to the TCTTS thread
TCTTS
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Render said:

Questions for TC:

The DC and Dark Universe misfires got me thinking, are the people who run these studios fans of the IPs they own? Do they enjoy movies? Do they read their IP's materials (comics, novels, etc) in their spare time? I know that sounds silly, but I'm just wondering. I always assumed that if someone was in charge of a property, then they had a passion for the IP. But is it simply more a job for those people? I'm not hating on those people, just curious about the personalities in charge and dynamics of their job.
I can't speak for the DC and Dark Universe executives, in particular, but I will say that one of the major problems with the Hollywood system in general is that the execs - the gate keepers, the decision makers, the purse string holders, etc. - aren't nearly as knowledgeable about the fundamentals of storytelling as they should be. First and foremost, they're business people, as they should be, but I really do believe that there needs to be some kind of storytelling certification class one should have to take in order to be a studio exec or hands-on financier. No different than being certified as a real estate agent. Granted, there are plenty of extremely passionate and knowledgeable execs when it comes to storytelling, but by and large, I'd say at least half of the studio-level notes across Hollywood on any given day are counterproductive, asinine, and useless. Too often, exec influence over a story is simply a bunch of less knowledgeable people than the writer or director trying to justify their jobs, which is why projects are often whittled down to the lowest common denominator.

All of this is to say that I would be genuinely surprised if more than a quarter of, say, WB execs genuinely care about the IP they're shepherding on a level beyond, "Will this make money for us?" / "How can we sell this in a way that ensures I get to keep my job?" Batman is product to them. Superman is a product. For the same reasons a huge chunk of execs don't understand / bother to learn storytelling, a huge chunk of execs don't truly understand/value/love the IP they're overseeing. And yes, ideally, these execs would be just as passionate about the IP as we are. But as with most companies, how often are execs utterly passionate about what it is they're selling? Does an exec at, say, Pepsi, grow up LOVING Pepsi? No. Working at Pepsi is just a job for them, and they're going to do whatever it takes to keep that job, but it's not like they live, eat, and breathe Pepsi philosophy. So why would/should it be any different at Warner Bros.? (I'm asking rhetorically, and again, I wish it were different.) Besides, you'd be shocked at how many people - including execs - in the industry A) fell into their jobs, and B) hardly ever watch movies/TV.

Quote:

And in your experience, is Marvel's cinematic-universe success the big goal/zeitgeist among executives/management in Hollywood? Do studios consciously push away new ideas in favor of older stuff?
It's mainly a case of the parent companies / shareholders saying, "Look at what Marvel is doing! Why can't we have that as well?" And then execs at, say, Sony, are forced to try and rush a universe out of whatever IP they own, as was the case with the ill-advised Amazing Spider-Man universe they were building with Andrew Garfield. It's not that the studios/execs want to do this, it's that they feel they have to.

Quote:

Additionally, is there a lot of people in the wings of Hollywood (such as yourself; people in the up-and-coming leadership generation of Hollywood) who are more willing to take creative risks and want to move away from the reboot-formula? Do you all chaff under the current leadership? Do you think that generation will change the creative arc of movies when they take charge in the next 20-30 years?
Most everyone I know in the business hates reboot culture, and of course we all say we'd take more creative risks if we were in charge. But it's important to understand that it's not just a current generation or a current type of mindset that is making these decisions. Maybe the culture will eventually change, maybe it won't, but the bottom line is, again, that all of decisions are predicated on survival. It's just people trying keep their jobs, and that survival instinct will never change. In other words, it's far more of a safe bet to gamble on a known property than it is to take a chance on something new. Because that's exactly what movie-making is: a gamble. Always and forever.

All that said, I take solace in this... as much as I loved the movie, Solo failing I think is really going to shake things up. It shows execs that nostalgia and familiarity don't won't always work, and I think the higher-ups are on high-alert now. Suddenly, IP may not be everything it's cracked up to be when it comes to blockbusters. Maybe audiences are finally speaking with their wallets in terms of wanting something new and original... or even just good... and maybe execs are finally listening.

Anyway, apologies if I rambled a bit too much, as I don't have all the answers, but tried to address your questions the best I could.
bearamedic99
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AG


Quote:

Anyway, apologies if I rambled a bit too much, as I don't have all the answers, but tried to address your questions the best I could.


That was not long. We've survived posts by ACUA.
Render
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Not at all, it was very insightful. Thanks again.
Brick Tamland
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Margot Robbie giving more details on Birds of Prey:

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/margot-robbie-looking-cast-diverse-actors-birds-prey-leads-confirms-harley-quinn-will-new-costume-exclusive-095417449.html

Says:
1. New costume
2. Excited about characters that don't have superpowers
3. Looking for diversity in the characters

Also, production to start in January
FL_Ag1998
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AG
Brick Tamland said:

Margot Robbie giving more details on Birds of Prey:

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/margot-robbie-looking-cast-diverse-actors-birds-prey-leads-confirms-harley-quinn-will-new-costume-exclusive-095417449.html

Says:
1. New costume
2. Excited about characters that don't have superpowers
3. Looking for diversity in the characters

Also, production to start in January


Goes without saying these days in Hollywood.
PatAg
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AG
FL_Ag1998 said:

Brick Tamland said:

Margot Robbie giving more details on Birds of Prey:

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/margot-robbie-looking-cast-diverse-actors-birds-prey-leads-confirms-harley-quinn-will-new-costume-exclusive-095417449.html

Says:
1. New costume
2. Excited about characters that don't have superpowers
3. Looking for diversity in the characters

Also, production to start in January


Goes without saying these days in Hollywood.
"Now the Harley Quinn actress has confirmed to Yahoo Movies, during an interview about her new movie Terminal, that she will be putting just as much effort into ensuring her co-leads are just as diverse.

"Yep, yes exactly, real life isn't so one specific image," Robbie said. "We've got to reflect that onscreen.""

There's nothing wrong with wanting to encourage diversity. There IS something wrong with putting it in front of creating a good story.

As far as Joker movies..I actually really like Leto as an actor, I wonder if there is any chance they just redesign the character and act like Suicide Squad didn't exist.
YouBet
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Thank god it will be diverse. This is what will offset all of the horrible decisions made thus far with the DCEU. It will at least ensure a 97% by critics on RT.
TCTTS
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It's official...

bearamedic99
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he will be a decent Joker. I'm curious about Todd Phillips directing it. Can we get a Mike Tyson cameo?
Definitely Not A Cop
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Question for someone watching JL for the first time, and I never really read the comics. Are the horses the Amazon ride super powerful and fast too?
maca1028
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TCTTS said:

It's official...



Does this mean no more Leto?
rhutton125
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I think it's always been independent of Leto. Leto's Morbius film might delay his Joker, though, and maybe based on the reactions of both... who knows. Maybe it gets scrapped in the end.
AgMarauder04
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maca1028 said:

TCTTS said:

It's official...



Does this mean no more Leto?
Only if there is a God.
Sex Panther
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maca1028 said:

TCTTS said:

It's official...



Does this mean no more Leto?

I don't think even DC knows
GiveEmHellBill
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Brian Earl Spilner
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What's the overall excitement level for Aquaman?

I know it's hard to say before a frame of the movie is even seen, but I have a good feeling about this one for some reason. (I know that means ****all though.)
Brick Tamland
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I'm pretty pumped for it, as I seem to do for most CBMs. I think it will be a good movie. Great? Probably not.
Cinco Ranch Aggie
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I am looking forward to Aquaman.

Overall, I enjoyed Justice League for one reason - we finally got a big screen movie with all of these characters that I remembered fondly from watching Saturday morning cartoons back in the 70s, Super Friends, I think it was. But damn, a movie with these characters should have been so much better. The story was not compelling, Steppenwolf was poorly done but could have been such a better villain, and the movie was just so disjointed.

I suspected this would be the case back when they announced the DCU. DC clearly wanted to see the same success that Marvel did, but when they put out Batman V Superman rather than doing more stand alone to introduce lesser known characters, it was clear they were rushing to get to Justice League. They have some really great properties; they should have put in the time to make some good individual movies as Marvel did before giving us the big team-up outing.

Look at Thanos. Aside from Hulk and Cap, I had no real clue about any other Marvel characters growing up, and even when we first saw Thanos briefly at the end of the first Avengers, I had to find out who that guy was. Then Marvel set out to make many more movies, occasionally bringing Thanos in to these stories to remind us that there was this big bad guy lurking in the background. That culminated with Infinity War, which to me was akin to watching Return of the Jedi after all those years of anticipation, and it delivered across the board.

As a youngster, I knew who Darkseid was. IMO Darkseid is 100 times the villain that Thanos is. DC should have had a no-brainer instant hit by simply taking the time to do their films, and then unleash Darkseid on their cinematic universe. But they chose the quick and easy path, and I fear we may never see these characters reach their full potential.
Brick Tamland
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I'm hoping New Gods establishes Darkseid (but make the movie about Big Barda and Mister Miracle), and that DC can get on track for him being the MCU Thanos of the DCEU
TajMaballer
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I've been down on the DCEU, but I am excited about their line up currently. Aquaman, Shazam, and WW84 all have me hopeful.

The current Mister Miracle comic is one for the ages and has me ready for Ava's New Gods movie.

This year at Comic Con can be DC's year to show us that they have their **** together. I want to believe!
Ulrich
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What resources would you recommend for people to learn the crafts of storytelling and creating works of fiction?

I've done a little reading on my own time but it's haphazard and a lot of materials tend to focus on the "master class" daring structural approaches of a Woolf or Joyce rather than the apparently simple business of getting a good story across.
TCTTS
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Are you talking screenwriting or just storytelling in general? If it's the latter, the only one I've ever read is Jospeh Campbell's The Hero With a Thousand Faces. But that's not really craft. If you're talking screenwriting, though, I'd recommend Story by Robert McKee, Screenplay by Syd Field, and the Save the Cat series by Blake Snyder.
Ulrich
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I have Campbell, that is a really interesting read. I'll look into the others you mentioned.

Really any medium though. As a full time professional in a non-entertainment field it is rather unlikely that i will ever produce or direct a film, but I'm still really interested in the process and how it differs from writing fiction. I could see eventually trying to turn out a screenplay of one of my novels though.

Rereading your post, if there are any good pieces on directing that would be interesting as well. I'm sure there are plenty of autobiographies and "how to direct a great movie" by random copywriters but I bet most of them aren't great.
bearamedic99
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quite sidetrack, Ulrich- Which books do you recommend for aspiring novelists?
Ulrich
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bearamedic99 said:

quite sidetrack, Ulrich- Which books do you recommend for aspiring novelists?


Well, first of all I'm not holding myself up as a great novelist or anything, it's a hobby and I do it for myself right now.

Hero with a Thousand Faces is a good one. It's not so much about writing, but it has a ton of good commentary on what makes a satisfying story or why stories are satisfying. Aspects of the Novel by EM Forster and The Art of Fiction by John Gardner are probably the best known works on the subject. The Great Courses has a series of lectures on writing fiction that were really good, and I actually thought that the special features on LOTR had a lot of good tips for how to think about assembling a story. That's probably 30 minutes of material spread across 12 hours of features though. I've picked up a few things from random articles and from studying novels directly, too.
TCTTS
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rhutton125
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Joker's mom.

The character I've been waiting for in a DC film.
Ulrich
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A. Martha
B. I don't really think the Joker should have an origin story
Murder Hornet
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I'm convinced that no one at DC/WB likes their comic properties. The beauty of the Joker is that his origin is a mystery; acted brilliantly by Heath Ledger who told a different "origin story" every time.

If they really want to do it right, get Fincher or someone with a darker tone to direct and have it be several different POVs from Joker victims. Let the audience decide which was the actual origin.
YouBet
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Frances McDormand who is a 2 time Oscar winner and 5 times nominated is not a big enough name to play a tertiary character that never existed before?

Ok.
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