I think the pressure he may feel now is different. HBO won't pressure him a bit to finish the series but he also has to know that if he doesn't they will effectively do it for him. They own the rights to the show and they can take it however they like. In truth, if he didn't finish it gives them even greater freedom and more interest. Every season that passes will involve more shifts from where GRRM wants to take the books. If he wants the story to be his then he must make it so, regardless of the fact no one could actually write the end to the books (which seems odd as well btw).

I would think he wants to get it done so he can move on to truly enjoy the rest of his life.

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I would think he wants to get it done so he can move on to truly enjoy the rest of his life.

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I agree completely. I think at this point it's a matter of discipline - he has spent ten years really struggling over the story, because of the 5 year gap scrap and the Meereenese knot. In the meantime, probably to keep his creative juices flowing, he's worked on a lot of other projects and spent a lot of time traveling, at conventions, etc. Trouble is, it can be hard to go back to a highly disciplined writing style if you've gotten away from it. I struggle with it myself - I'm not a writer, but I am a free-lancer who works at my own pace. If I get off my usual schedule - long vacation, lots of personal stuff going on, etc - it is very difficult to get back to work, even when I KNOW I need to (in my case, no working means no money. No salaries here!) Even knowing that I need to get paid, I struggle with buckling down and starting the slog. I can imagine that GRRM, who is now richer than he ever dreamed and has received all the critical acclaim he could have ever imagined, is feeling something similar. He knows he HAS to buckle down, make some sacrifices and finish - but damn is it hard.

Yeah, I got the feling that in the last two books he lost a bit of his focus on many levels. Kinda like losing momentum to study for finals.

I'd rather wait longer for a more polished ending instead if a quick wrap up to finish the series. He did mention what a bi$ch it was writing the last books. Almost a obligation of sorts.


But then again, this is his magnus opus.

My main concern is he is 63 and isn't exactly a health nut and he needs to put some real work into this in order to get it done. It's hard to say if he will be able to write 10 years from now or even 5.

As for the pressure stuff, I also think he has admitted much of that was his own fault. He ended AFFC with an expectation the next book would be out soon and then he put out deadline after deadline that he missed horribly. The pressure clearly "clogged" him as well.

This time out he is making no promises and refuses to give any updates of meaning which I actually take as a good sign. I think he wants to be the "hero" and crank the book out much faster than most expected.

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I'm really hoping the next book opens with "As the tsunami receded, millions were dead, including all the annoying pointless sub-characters in Slavers Bay and most of the Iron Islands. And the Sand Snakes." Only, you know, written GRRM style.

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geez! there's a 5th one!?

I'm struggling to get going on Three right now... the whole Daenry story line has really become a beating for me. I'm pretty sure I could start just skipping her chapters and I'd be a lot happier with the books.

Nope, you'll wanna stick around. But it changes from chapter to chapter with her story line.

Some are great, others could be completely left out.

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Daenerys Targaryen, Jon Snow and Tyrion Lannister sat at the head of the council table in places of high honor. They had been sorely missed in the previous volume and were expected to do great things now that they had returned. Other major characters took up the rest of the seats on either side of them, while hundreds upon hundreds of side characters filled their own tables that crammed the great hall like fruits in a barrel. A cacophony of sounds and colors filled the room, so much that they could not tell one man from another. All the finery of Westeros and the lands beyond were present with all their sigils and banners and native tongues as they awaited the attack of the Others outside their walls. Winter was coming too, though reports differed on exactly when.

Daenerys stood up, her tokar billowing down like a sea of pearls on soft eastern fabric. "Lords, ladies, random no-name filler characters who I would soon forget in a minute or so, you know why we are all gathered here!"

They all answered in unison. "THE OTHERS! DRAGONS! WINTER! POLITICS! ENTERTAINMENT! WHOOP WHOOP!"

"Yes, that is indeed what you came here for," she giggled, as if it were a secret jest. "The Others are outside our door, winter is coming," she winked at Jon. "I have three dragons, and soon I will retake my father's throne! But before we get to all that riveting stuff, and since words are wind and hardly filling, we feast!"

Thousands of confused whispers greeted her announcement, as if they could not imagine feasting at a time like this. There's never a bad time to feast! she thought.

Tyrion quipped next to her, "I would sooner have a wh0re feast on my-"

Servants brought it in the dishes then: bowls of venison swimming in butter and garlic, suckling pigs with apples in their mouths roasted to a light brown crisp, crunchy capons flavored with garlic and cloves stuffed with bits of bacon and vegetables, neeps fresh from the soil dabbed with butter and sweet and sour sauce, cakes and pies and pastries of chocolate and vanilla and fruit with icing molded to various different shapes that pleased the eyes as well as the tongue. They tucked into them, crumbs and sauces coating their beards and doublets. Even the ladies could not seem to get food stains off their dresses.

A serving man brought her barley stew with chopped carrots and greens on a loaf of hollowed flat bread. He was a short man with even shorter hair, parted in the middle with wisps of grey among the black. He had small, close-set eyes and a wide, flat nose that made him resemble the suckling pig on the table. His doublet was brown roughspun slashed with vair and velvet and bore the sigil of the house he served: a fierce gray troll on a field of green. The man was born Braavosi, but his mother took him and fled to Westeros when his father died from the pox, taking a job as a washerwoman for some minor lord. He did not like spicy foods, his favorite color was yellow, and he liked to walk along the shoreline as the sun descended into the sea.

They ate like this for hours, lustily and with abandon, while the Others banged outside. How rude! Perhaps they're hungry, Dany thought.

When they were done Dany wiped the grease from her chin and addressed the table. "That was an incredible feast. Let's have one again in a couple of pages. Jaime, what is our situation?"

"The Others have us surrounded, your grace," he reached for a goblet, which tipped over and spilled when he used his golden hand.

"I see. Ser Barristan, what do you suggest we do?" She turned to the knight.

"If I would be so bold your grace, I would suggest you take your dragons to battle. The Others are cold, fell creatures, and fear dragon fire."

"That sounds like a splendid idea, Ser Barristan! But I seem to have misplaced my dragons."

The old knight looked confused. "You...what?"

"Yes, I don't really know where they are," she shrugged. "No matter, I'll ride my boyfriend to battle. He's so handsome, with his forked beard and blue hair....on second thought, I think I'll ride him to bed. I'll leave the Others and retaking my father's throne to the rest of you." She hiked up her skirts and ran up the stairs to her bedchambers, singing DAARIO, OH DAARIO in a high pitched, Disney Channel voice.

The table was silent and befuddled when Ser Barristan cleared his throat uneasily. "I...suppose my queen and her dragons will not be joining us. Forgive her...she's still young...Lord Snow," he turned to Jon for rescue. "Will the Night's Watch avail us? Battling the Others is your province."

Jon looked up solemnly from his food, flexing his sword hand. "Wildlings."

"Excuse me?"

"Wildlings. I must deal with the wildlings."

Ser Barristan spoke slowly. "That sounds most...valiant, but...don't you think the Others are more important? They're right outside our-"

"YOU KNOW NOTHING, SER BARRISTAN!" Jon stood up suddenly, his face fierce. "None of you do!" He faced each member of the table in turn. "All of you are so concerned with your game of thrones and your dragons and this one is backstabbing that one while marrying this one, none of you have any inkling what's really happening! There are...so...many...WILDLINGS! So many! I don't know what to do with them all! Wildlings in my room, wildlings in my privy, wildlings in my soup, wildlings, wildlings, WILDLINGS! You don't think I would rather vanquish Others and wights, but how can I when I have to wade through WILDLINGS?!" Tears ran down his bearded face. "But do you care?! NO! It's because I'm a b@st@rd isn't it? WAAAAAHHHH!" He ran from the table, sobbing, his path impeded by a sea of wildlings.

"Why, isn't this a lively war council." The imp laughed.

Ser Barristan was at his wits end. Will no one do SOMETHING? "Lannister, while I am loathe to trust you, we could all use your cunning to navigate this impending battle."

Tyrion grinned, a terrifying sight without a nose. "I am flattered Ser Barristan, but I don't give a mummer's fart what happens to any of you. Maybe in the next book. But for now, all I want to do is to find where *****s go. Podrick, fetch me my armor and steed!"

His squire came out of nowhere, pulling a pig on a leash. He donned Tyrion in mail made of cardboard painted with crude, peeling designs, and placed a jester's cap on his head. The character assassination was not complete until the imp hopped onto the sow in a graceful tumble that would not have shamed a mummer, and galloped away as fast as those piggy legs could take him out of the castle, and out of the story...while stopping every now and then to ask passersby "Where do *****s go?".

Not for the first time Ser Barristan wondered how he had ended up here. Was he the only one who remembered what really mattered? Surely he wasn't that old. "So, what does that leave us?" he addressed the rather emptier table. "Our most major characters are off dallying about like headless chickens, doing things no one cares about, ignoring what made our series so riveting in the first place..." He stopped, there were people missing. "Where are Bran and Davos?"

Cersei answered him. "I see them at the edge of my vision sometimes. They come and go so quickly that if you blink too fast you'll miss them. Its quite unnatural. I'd rather they stayed dea-" She gasped when Davos appeared beside her, but was gone again just as quick.

Barristan placed his head in his hands, never feeling so old as he did now. "Will NO ONE do something about the Others? Or just something INTERESTING! ANYTHING that we can do so I won't go mad?"

"...Osmund Kettleblack and Moonboy for all I know...," Jaime murmured.

"...Ser Meryn, Ser Ilyn, Queen Cersei...", prattled Arya.

Stannis gritted his teeth.

Victarion did something crazy or whatever.

"Why am I even in these books?" Asha called out, but was ignored.

Bran popped out from under the table, "I'm almost a man grown!" and was gone again.

"Seven save us," Barristan groaned, as the Others broke down the doors and swarmed into the castle. Barristan faced the readers. "Please, return to us in The Winds of Winter, spring 2020, if you still care." The old knight plopped his head on the table and went into a much needed sleep...

The plot slept with him.

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Read it. Seriously.

[This message has been edited by SuperAg05 (edited 5/1/2012 1:03p).]

Jon Snow=FitzChivalry Farseer

Dave,

Sadly there was a lot of truth in that.

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Jon Snow=FitzChivalry Farseer

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Most likely. It just seems SO derivative - it would surprise me if Martin copied that plot from Hobb exactly, but I don't see any other way if he's going to warg into Ghost and then end up back in his original body. And the Ghost-warging was pretty heavily foreshadowed in the prologue.

I really hate this plot turn. Jon basically gets to be: dead (unlikely), a wight, an unJon zombie, or get back in his original body via Ghost exactly like FitzChivalry did. I'm sure it will be interesting when it's written out but nothing about the future of this arc makes me even remotely intrigued.

SuperAg's post reminded me of one of the best book reviews of DWD

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He broke his fast with boiled neeps, and shivering stew, washed down with a flagon of Dornish ale. The grease from stewed salt pork clung to his gristly beard as he donned a slashed velvet doublet of purple satin, emblazoned with the crest of Ser Eddard Bauer. Over his smallclothes, he wore black pantaloons. He clambered into his Honda and began the short journey west, bearing northwards along the interstate. He turned left, edging his way past opposing traffic. If I look back, I am lost.

His office was a dull brown keep that sat astride the Crown Road. His desk was hidden behind a soundproofed beige cubicle and was lined with a faux wood finish. Reek, reek, it rhymes with teak.

He had finished A Dance with Dragons not a noonsday before and wondered if in truth he had finished the entire series. George R. R. Martin is so constipated from the fawnings of his lickspittles and self-indulgent side stories that he's not like to drop another turd of a novel anytime soon, if the last decade has told it true, he thought to himself.

He smirked at his own witticism. "It is known" he said aloud to himself.

To tell it true, he had enjoyed several parts of the novel. Jon Snow's first chapter was strong, as were the Bran and Davos chapters. He'd not expected that. Many of the early story arcs had glistened wetly with promise but of these Martin had written little and less as the book wore on. Of Dany's aimless navel-gazing, there'd been much and more. Asha and Victarion vied for the distinction of the most pointless Greyjoy POV. Ariane Martell had twisted her teats for naught, for her brother Quentyn's chapters proved to be as useless as nipples on a breastplate. Gods be good, he thought, the fat man teased us with Feast's Dorne chapters for.... this?

And Jaime... that had been the cruelest jape of all. Best that Martin had left out his sole chapter. Though, given the masturbatory excess of Dance's prose, Martin could have learned a thing or two from a man who'd had to make do without his sword hand.

The epilogue was a satisfying end to an unsavory meal, but even the most succulent lemoncake doesn't salvage a bland and unfilling meal of gruel. In truth, it should've been left in A Feast for Crows, along with Cersei's chapters. At least then at least one of the novels from the last ten years would've amounted to more than a mummer's farce.

He set down his copy of A Dance with Dragons with an unsatisfying thud. Words are wind, he mused. Speaking of which... He raised a leg and broke his word. It smelt of stale bacon grease and mashed neeps.

By then, his bladder was full to bursting from the morning's coffee, so he headed to the latrine before he pissed his smallclothes. Reek, reek, it rhymes with leak. Along the way, he passed the receptionist from the adjoining office. She was a pretty brown-haired thing, a woman of about four-and-twenty, fully flowered.

"Where do *****s go?", he asked her.

She slapped him.

He entered the men's bathroom and undid his breeches. The urinals were crofted from gleaming white porcelain and bore the seal of American Standard. Whilst it received his golden stream of the morning's piss, he contemplated how this was a metaphor for how Ser Martin had raised the leg and done the same to the continuity of A Song of Ice and Fire and the first three books.

He angrily composed an e-mail to Martin's editor whilst zipping up his breeches. He was only a man grown, unskilled in the ways of editing, but such was his wroth.

You know nothing, Anne Groell..

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While I think that's a bit harsh (DWD was much better than AFFC imo) I do agree with the criticism of Ann Groell. The content is there but the editing is rough. The elaborate descriptions of every meal are really annoying. I love all the side stories that add in history and content but I really don't give a **** for lengthy descriptions on how greasy the blood sausage is they are thinking of having for lunch.

Oh, and Daario will only have been worth reading about if he dies in some really nasty way after betraying Dany or something of the like. Can't stand that guy.

The story is all there and it is fantastic and the most frustrating thing is knowing it is all in GRRM's head but his editor is horrific at getting him to put it out there. My personal pet peeve was that there was no Sansa in DWD after she finally was getting interesting in AFFC and the same could be said for Jaime except we got the one chapter and yet we had tons of space devoted to traveling and meals and Quentin.

Between the last 2 books they probably could have cut 300 pages and everyone would have been happier.

Yep

300 per book.

That being said, after reading the series thru the last three months, I picked up a regular old techno thriller last week and never felt as tho I could read so fast and easily.

Didn't realize how much reading Martin slows you down.

So is Melisandr going to ally with the dragons in a fire kinda way?
And was the smoke monster just a massive queef?

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And was the smoke monster just a massive queef?

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it is known.

New Question..

How loyal is Lord Randyll Tarly and do you feel he could be a Targaryan loyalist in secret....

-He was a Loyalist who fought against Robert Baratheon during the rebellion and defeated him once on the battlefield.

-His wife is a Florent and they have a strong claim to the Gardner line of Highgarden and may want to get control back from the Tyrells

-Mace Tyrell has boasted of his voctories which are in reality Randyll Tarly's and maybe after years of putting up with this fat oaf he may feel the need to push him aside.

-Brightwater Keep was the home of House Florent and with control being given to Tyrell's son instead of Randyll Tarly it may have driven him to plot against Highgarden.

-When told of Aegon's landing he dismissed the severity of the threat causing Kevan Lannister to conclude Tarly may be more dangerous than Mace Tyrell.

No feel for Tarley at all.

But, now that you mention it, I do believe he goes Dragon.

As a matter or (not) fact, I think in the end, the Dragons (Dany) untied Westeros against thousand of wights and creepy things from north of the wall.

I've been re-reading ADWD the past few weeks... I can't imagine how this thing will all end up.

The Greyjoys have a new king & are seeking to join Dany and her Dragons. (Along with Tyrion and the Second Sons) This will be the huge Slaver's Bay battle left out. BTW, is anyone else hoping we see an actual Kraken make an appearance in the next book or tow?

The North appears to be re-uniting under Stannis; who with the Manderlys, various Hill Tribes, Wildings armed with Bravosi credit and are about to whip butt on Freys and Boltons. I hope the Bravosi send some swordsmen or faceless men (Arya?) to help the cause.

Aegon "Griff" Targarean has the Golden Company and Jon Connington taking the Stormlands by surprise. Headed to the never-conquered Storm's End. Varys backing is a wild card here.

I don't have a good feel for the Martells & Tyrells, but there are both making inroads on the small council.

The Lannister's appear to be on the ropes with the exception of Ser Robert Strong (FrankenGregor). All capable male leadership has been slaughtered with the exception of Jamie. The rise of the Faith Militant will be interesting.

Can't wait for the next book! I think it should go faster.... as storylines converge it will start to write itself IMO.

I'm holding out hope that as far as the Lannisters go, Jaime and Tyrion will continue their rehabilitation from being a jack-ass and drunkard, respectively, and actually rise (along with perhaps Kevin) to turn around the image problem that the family has, .i.e. become decent leaders who are out for more than just power.

And I hated that Catlyn made a comeback as Stoneheart, or whatever her name is now. I hated her before as a non-zombie and don't expect to like her any better going forward. That b**ch can really screw stuff up quick for "the good guys" when she starts mettling.

Jon Snow can't die, he's one of the 3 heads of the dragon!

FL,

Did you read ADWD? Pretty sure Kevan is not going to save the Lannisters.

agree with hating Catlyn. she's easily the worst character.

OH CRAP! Sorry, totally forgetting the very end of the book! I guess it just blew me away so much I'm still having a hard time with it.

But speaking of the end and Varys, any good thoughts on the endgames of Varys and Littlefinger? Is Littlefinger simply after power? And Varys - I remember the story that Illyrio (sorry I don't have the books handy and suck at remembering the spelling of these names) shared about growing up with Varys, but is Varys simply after power as well? Does he simply enjoy playing puppetmaster to his benefit?

I can see Varys possibly believing in something more than himself, but I see Littlefinger being completely about himself and trying to overcome the feeling of inadequacy acquired during his youth.

[This message has been edited by FL_Ag1998 (edited 5/29/2012 8:52p).]

I think there is a Blackfyre connection with Varys/Illyrio/Aegon but I'm not sure where it is. Varys and LF are easily the two most dangerous characters in the books.

The Blackfyre angle is intriguing. I'm just trying to figure out why Varys and Connington would insist Little Griff is Aegon 6. Maybe he will be revealed as a Blackfyre later. That would make it easier to digest for Dany I marry a Blackfyre rather than her nephew.

I kinda like the idea of the Blackfyres being brought back into the story. If Aegon is a Blackfyre rather than Targaryen it would seal the bloodlines.

As a legitimate cadet branch of the Targaryens I don't see why the Blackfyre claim to the Iron Throne is any less legit than the Baratheon claim. Recall that Stannis has a legit claim from Aegon 5's daughter.

Maybe Aegon 6 will get stuck with Shireen?!?!

I also think Tarly will play a huge role soon. He is as ruthless as Tywin Lannister. Dude is a bad mofo.

Now that Tywin and Kevan Lannister are crows food Randyl Tarly will have a huge role to play when he is approached to command the Royal Army against the army of Aegon and his Allies. I can see Tarly switching sides if he feels that Aegon is legit and he will jockey for control of Highgarden against Mace Tyrell.

I am looking forward to seeing Victarion sailing the Iron Fleet into battle against the Slaver's fleet

Just read that paperback for A Dance w Dragons will be delayed till Mar 2013.......GRRRRRRRRRRRRRR.

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Just read that paperback for A Dance w Dragons will be delayed till Mar 2013.......GRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

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What is this bullsh_t!!?

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Now that Tywin and Kevan Lannister are crows food Randyl Tarly will have a huge role to play when he is approached to command the Royal Army against the army of Aegon and his Allies. I can see Tarly switching sides if he feels that Aegon is legit and he will jockey for control of Highgarden against Mace Tyrell.

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Would this bring Martell into fold also, as I seem to recall the Martells and Tyrells have some long standing conflict.

So we'll have:
Stannis (with Manderly/Karstark/Umber/various tribes) v Frey/Bolton in the north.

Lannister/Tyrell v Aegon/Martell/Tarly in the south

Dany v Slavers v Victarion in the east

Along with the madness that is sure to take place at the Wall and anything that happens with Bran and Arya and Sansa.

I almost forgot about Littlefinger attempting to control the Vale (and possibly the Riverlands). That dude is only out for power.

As for Varys, I think for whatever reason he is just loyal to the Targaryens.

1. Apparently ADWD was supposed to end with a Battle of Ice and a Battle of Fire, but the book wouldn't have been finished until early 2012. Groell wanted to capture the hype of the TV series and pushed those two battles to TWOW.

2. Varys is probably a Blackfyre...

3. Highgarden may be the friend in the reach...

I found some PDFs online for Tales of Dunk and Egg. Guess those will have to tide me over for a little longer.

Varys being a Blackfyre... now that's an interesting thought.