Instinct or an issue with people not being good dog owners?

6,909 Views | 63 Replies | Last: 1 mo ago by Gunny456
maroon barchetta
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Two pit bulls attack and kill their elderly neighbor.

What say you?

Bad owner?

Pit bulls doing what they were bred to do?

Both?

https://www.kbtx.com/2024/06/03/83-year-old-man-mauled-death-by-dogs-sheriffs-office-says/?tbref=hp
ARKY AGGIE
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AG
I say it is who trained the dogs. My cousins have pit bulls and they are not vicious.
BTHO bacon bits!!!
Eliminatus
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Always in for a good TA pitbull discussion
Claude!
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1. Bad dogs. Put them down.
2. Bad owners. Straight to jail.
vmiaptetr
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Claude! said:

1. Bad dogs. Put them down.
2. Bad owners. Straight to jail.



Teamwork makes the dream work.
Ginormus Ag
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Claude! said:

1. Bad dogs. Straight to jail.
2. Bad owners. Put them down.

FIFY
AggieArchitect04
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AggieArchitect04
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There are so many other more desirable breeds that if someone has a pit ball I immediately think of them as trash. They aren't cute animals so I have no idea why anyone would want one.
NoahAg
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Pit bulls and pit bull owners are trash. All of them.

"He da sweetest baby. Wouldn't hurt nobody."
"He never dun nuffin' like dat."

/Said every time a pit eats a toddler or old person
LupinusTexensis
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They were bred for dog fighting and killing small things. We don't get mad at a border collie for herding whatever living creature shares their space (I've seen them try to herd cats… hilarious), but there are some border collies who's instincts aren't as strong. I figure the "sweet" pit bulls are just those with weaker instincts. Most have that murderous nature bred in and it can be increased or decreased based on the owner.
concac
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There is no good reason to own a pit bull.

You hear people say about pit bulls that they're smart, gentle, obedient, blah, blah, blah. But so are other dog breeds and you don't hear stories on the daily about them killing the next door neighbor.
FIDO*98*
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It's instinct that can be trained to ignore, but they all have the potential to flip if something triggers that instinctive response. Responsible people don't own Pit Bulls.
Serious Lee
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you cant teach a dog to hunt, that wasnt bred to hunt. if it was bred to fight, you aint teaching it not to.
tandy miller
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lol here we gooooo
Lex
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In
Ags4DaWin
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ARKY AGGIE said:

I say it is who trained the dogs. My cousins have pit bulls and they have not attacked anyone...........






yet
.


FIFY
ARKY AGGIE
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Ags4DaWin said:

ARKY AGGIE said:

I say it is who trained the dogs. My cousins have pit bulls and they have not attacked anyone...........






yet
.


FIFY
That's your opinion, but it isn't mine.
BTHO bacon bits!!!
MouthBQ98
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They could breed it out of the breed but whatever breeders are selecting for in the breed standard seems to include the genetic predisposition to occasionally snd sometimes unpredictability carry out sustained attacks and they are built to do damage.

You'd think the breeders would be focusing intently on finding breed lines with no history of this and only breeding within those lines. If the behavior was bred into them, it can be bred out as it is with dozens of other breeds.
Lex
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Ethical and intentional breeding only happens with ethical and intentional people. 90% of the pit pups I see are "oops" litters. There's nothing intentional or ethical about that.
Ragnar Danneskjoldd
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My SIL dropped the "its how theyre raised" nonsense on me last week. Lord, beer me strength.
Jack Cheese
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ARKY AGGIE said:

I say it is who trained the dogs. My cousins have pit bulls and they are not vicious.

Yep. That's why you see so many golden retriever attacks and deaths - bad owners training them to do it.
Athanasius
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Breeding 80%
Nurture 15%
Instinct (situation most breeds would misbehave) 5%
fc2112
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They need to start charging the owners with crimes when this happens.
NoahAg
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ARKY AGGIE said:

I say it is who trained the dogs. My cousins have pit bulls and they are not vicious.
1. username checks out.
2. If your cousins have kids they'll eventually get eaten.
ARKY AGGIE
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NoahAg said:

ARKY AGGIE said:

I say it is who trained the dogs. My cousins have pit bulls and they are not vicious.
1. username checks out.
2. If your cousins have kids they'll eventually get eaten.
Her daughter is still alive, married, has a daughter and a pit bull. You aren't going to change my mind.
BTHO bacon bits!!!
NoahAg
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ARKY AGGIE said:

NoahAg said:

ARKY AGGIE said:

I say it is who trained the dogs. My cousins have pit bulls and they are not vicious.
1. username checks out.
2. If your cousins have kids they'll eventually get eaten.
Her daughter is still alive, married, has a daughter and a pit bull. You aren't going to change my mind.
White trash gonna white trash, I suppose. Check back when a neighbor/grandkid/old person gets mauled.
DannyDuberstein
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Only takes one momentary lapse to change someone's life forever. The vast majority of dog owners have quite a few shortcomings. It's not just the obviously crappy owners that are an issue
agnerd
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My family has owned around 10 over the years. 1 was the stereotypical bad dog, and it was bad from puppy all the way to a year old before it was given away. Just aggressive and too energetic. Proverbial screw-loose animal. It was eventually shot by the cops to noone's surprise.

All of the others have been great dogs. One black-sheep member of the family even tried to make his dogs "tough" but they were the sissiest dogs I've ever seen. Luckily he was too dumb to realize that if he spent virtually every minute of every day with his dogs that they just wouldn't develop that aggressive or violent tendency.

To me, pit bulls are like pistols. They are dangerous in the wrong hands, and I believe the owners should be held 100% accountable for negligent ownership. But I'm 100% against either being banned. Owner of the 2 dogs that killed the person should be charged with at least negligent homicide and maybe murder. I think you will fix most of the problem dogs if you actually hold owners responsible for their animals.
one safe place
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Don't allow them or similar breeds on my property. When a potential renter shows up and I ask about dogs, if they have any of these breeds then they are told they are not allowed. Those dogs have the track record they have for a reason. Doesn't mean all are bad animals, but enough are that there is no need to take the risk. Additionally, more than a few owners of these breeds of dogs are people you don't want to have to deal with either.
rwtxag83
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I got rid of an extremely hard headed male Dachsund after he came at ME. His whole life there was absolutely no question that he was the alpha and the king of the pack, but he always respected me, at least until that point. One day he grabbed hold of a piece of my hand, and shook his head HARD trying to tear me up, and when I saw that 'Come on! You want some more!', wild animal look in his eyes, I decided that minute that this crap is over right freaking now. I was not going to face the potential liability. BTW, I've had many dogs, and have had very great experiences training them up, but some are just beyond the limit.

Anybody who owns ANY dog with this kind of violent potential should be on the hook for criminal and civil liability. The problem with most Pit owners is they're frequently low rent scumbags who don't have anything you could actually sue them for.
Greater love hath no man than this....
Complete Idiot
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agnerd said:

My family has owned around 10 over the years. 1 was the stereotypical bad dog, and it was bad from puppy all the way to a year old before it was given away. Just aggressive and too energetic. Proverbial screw-loose animal. It was eventually shot by the cops to noone's surprise.

All of the others have been great dogs. One black-sheep member of the family even tried to make his dogs "tough" but they were the sissiest dogs I've ever seen. Luckily he was too dumb to realize that if he spent virtually every minute of every day with his dogs that they just wouldn't develop that aggressive or violent tendency.

To me, pit bulls are like pistols. They are dangerous in the wrong hands, and I believe the owners should be held 100% accountable for negligent ownership. But I'm 100% against either being banned. Owner of the 2 dogs that killed the person should be charged with at least negligent homicide and maybe murder. I think you will fix most of the problem dogs if you actually hold owners responsible for their animals.
I guess you could say dogs are like guns (I wouldn't), would you rather be shot with a large game rifle or a pellet gun?

I don't see why people take a banning, or castrating of all male dogs, as something horrible. Humans created the breed. Humans created the breed to have specific fighting characteristics, including high bite strength and tenacity (won't let go, won't stop an attack). It didn't exist in nature, we created it. For fighting. It doesn't fill an ecological niche and no harm will come to canines or the animal kingdom if a human creating species is ended by humans. People say owners are to blame, bad owners who do bring out and reward the fighting characteristics make these dogs vastly more dangerous. But the characteristics are there and you don't know when ANY dog might snap - out of fear, illness, who knows - but when it snaps it's like the large game rifle, when a schnauzer snaps it's like a pellet gun.

Other dogs are bred to be lap dogs, or hilariously and adorably malformed - like the English Bulldog, another breed that should be let come to an end out of compassion for dogs.

I'm aware the vast majority of Pit Bull related dogs have uneventful lives and loving owners. I'm also aware the vast majority of human deaths from dog attacks are tied to the Pit Bull breeds. What unique trait does the Pit Bull provide that other dogs won't provide, specific to be a loving family animal?
LupinusTexensis
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Dachshunds are bred to chase mean ass badgers down a hole and keep fighting them until their owner pulls them out by the tail. They're some of the meanest dogs around. They're just a kickable size vs a pit bull which is heavy muscle.
Tatem
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My basset hound bit my child yesterday

He's stubborn as can be and we have taken him to training.

I don't have an opinion on pits but this basset is a pita
ATX_AG_08
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This was an 83 year old man. These pits sensed his vulnerability and their genetic instinct kicked in, just like a lion or bear's instinct tells them to go after the weak and vulnerable out the pack of prey. It's been breed into them over thousands of years. This is one case where we can definitely "trust the science". The statistics also confirm this. Something like 70% of all dog related fatalities, from a breed that is around 5% of the dog population in the US.

Pit bull defenders are smoothed brained idiots. Trash breed with trash owners. This debate is so old and stupid.
Azeew
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ARKY AGGIE said:

I say it is who trained the dogs. My cousins have pit bulls and they are not vicious.


ARKY explains a lot
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