Was this not the exact situation we were trying to avoid when COVID first popped up last year?

https://www.yahoo.com/news/idaho-allows-hospitals-overwhelmed-covid-013952362.html

https://healthandwelfare.idaho.gov/news/idaho-expands-crisis-standards-care-statewide-due-surge-covid-19-patients-requiring-0

Quote:

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Amid a surge in new coronavirus cases and hospitalizations that are overwhelming medical facilities, the Idaho Department of Health and Wellness on Thursday announced that the state is experiencing a hospital resource crisis, and strained hospitals are allowed to ration health care.

Under crisis standards of care, hospitals are able to determine how to prioritize care based on patients doctors believe have the best chances of survival.

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I smell fake news.

ETA it looks like this just gives them flexibility to repurpose hospital rooms and transfer patients easier. I don't think it means hospitals are overrun and triage is imminent.

Kvetch said:

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I smell fake news.

ETA it looks like this just gives them flexibility to repurpose hospital rooms and transfer patients easier. I don't think it means hospitals are overrun and triage is imminent.

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You should probably check your smeller

"When crisis standards of care are in effect, people who need medical care may get care that is different from what they expect. For example, patients admitted to the hospital may find that hospital beds are not available or are in repurposed rooms (such as a conference room) or that needed equipment is not available. They may have to wait for a bed to open, or be moved to another hospital in or out of state that has the resources they need. Or they might not be prioritized for the limited resources that are available. In other words, someone who is otherwise healthy and would recover more rapidly may get treated or have access to a ventilator before someone who is not likely to recover.

The process to initiate crisis standards of care began when resources were limited to the point of affecting medical care. DHW Director Jeppesen convened the Crisis Standards of Care Activation Advisory Committee on Sept. 15, 2021, to review all the measures that were taken to provide care for the increased number of COVID-19 patients requiring hospitalization. The committee determined that the ability of all Idaho hospitals and healthcare systems to deliver the usual standard of care has been severely affected by the extraordinary influx of patients, and all contingency measures have been exhausted. The committee recommended to the director that crisis standards of care be activated statewide. Director Jeppesen issued his decision on Sept. 16, 2021, under the authority vested in him through the temporary rule."

Ah yes, Idaho. Of course, that bastion of fearmongering and government totalitarianism is faking the strain on their healthcare system. I'm sure that's the most likely scenario here

We still haven't found any takers in Texas for our intubated COVID patients. For perspective, I've never been denied a transfer for an intubated patient of any kind in the 10 years I've been working here. Not once. It's always been automatic until COVID came along. Now we get rejected 30-40 times per day. Apparently Idaho is no picnic now either

You sure about that? I mean we are taking about Idaho?

Or maybe this wasn't a good hire.

https://theweek.com/us/1004975/doctor-who-called-covid-19-vaccine-needle-rape-is-now-on-idahos-largest-regional-health

I was being sarcastic. People have been talking about California, NY and other states that share a political persuasion overblowing the pandemic. Obviously Idaho does not march in step with that group politically and is not the sort of place you would think would exaggerate

We were both being sarcastic

It's so hard to tell these days

Kvetch said:

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I smell fake news.

ETA it looks like this just gives them flexibility to repurpose hospital rooms and transfer patients easier. I don't think it means hospitals are overrun and triage is imminent.

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More fake news coming from the evil democrats that run the government of Idaho.

No, it's the media latching on to a single story without verifying sources.

It's not like that is a trend or anything...

Mississippi "misrepresents" Child COVID inpatients

Alabama "Doctor" tells dying wishes of covid patients

CNN: Healthy teenager dies of COVID (but not the diabetic coma he was in)

WTF are you talking about??

Quote:

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"Our hospitals and healthcare systems need our help. The best way to end crisis standards of care is for more people to get vaccinated. It dramatically reduces your chances of having to go to the hospital if you do get sick from COVID-19. In addition, please wear a mask indoors in public and outdoors when it's crowded to help slow the spread" said DHW Director Jeppesen. "The situation is dire we don't have enough resources to adequately treat the patients in our hospitals, whether you are there for COVID-19 or a heart attack or because of a car accident."

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Source: Idaho.gov

I posted an actual government statement straight from the source, knowing the news article in question would be labeled fake news.

Still labeled fake news, and from one of the most red states out there no less.

Since patients dying of Covid are reported to be denying they have Covid literally as they die, it should not surprise anyone that denial exists re overwhelmed hospitals too.

Misinformation has done its job and severely, severely damaged people.

Yeah, this is for real. I'm supposed to be working in Boise in a couple of weeks. Mayor seems ready to enforce restrictions. Not sure what's going to happen there.

And these standards aren't unique to COVID. This is established policy. I went to a public health conference several years back and remember them talking about emergency management and crisis standards of care and this exact scenario came up. It stuck with me.

I assume this shortage is real. Quick google and in mid 2019 there were articles out of Idaho discussing nursing shortages. There was already an issue pre-COVID. This pandemic is just highlighting what many states were already facing. Needs to be figured out.

As a society we have yet to have a serious discussion about QALY, end of life care, and the trade offs in health care resources. Its an ugly feature that the old and unhealthy have been socialized to think they will get all the care they need. The biggest benefits of all of the health care seems to be soaked up by the few and all the relative costs are being borne by the many. Maybe another way to say it is that health care in the country has been privatizing the gains and socializing the losses. Money, time and human capital are the ultimate triage machine.

eta: its too bad too. 18 months ago we locked everyone down instead of simply isolating the old and unhealthy, who were most susceptible to the original strain of covid. The young and healthy now have covid-fatigue and BS-fatigue and the that is the group which seems most susceptible to this current strain of covid. If we had let virus run its course months before the delta strain would we be in this current situation necessitating triage? Unintended consequences abound

tysker said:

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Maybe another way to say it is that health care in the country has been privatizing the gains and socializing the losses. Money, time and human capital are the ultimate triage machine.

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Kinda feels the overwhelming majority of the economy is set up like this now.

Can attest to this. People with no quality of life, families demanding everything done.

Even during the pandemic we've had a ton of non-Covid patients come in who are essentially vegetables: trached, feeding tube, can't talk, wounds, infections, etc. Families refuse hospice because grandma's going to get better we just know it. Blood pressure starts dropping, heart rate goes down, grandma is about to pass away peacefully but family demands she go to ICU on levo and a vent. Huge cost and work burden for an inevitable outcome.

tysker said:

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As a society we have yet to have a serious discussion about QALY, end of life care, and the trade offs in health care resources. Its an ugly feature that the old and unhealthy have been socialized to think they will get all the care they need. The biggest benefits of all of the health care seems to be soaked up by the few and all the relative costs are being borne by the many. Maybe another way to say it is that health care in the country has been privatizing the gains and socializing the losses. Money, time and human capital are the ultimate triage machine.

eta: its too bad too. 18 months ago we locked everyone down instead of simply isolating the old and unhealthy, who were most susceptible to the original strain of covid. The young and healthy now have covid-fatigue and BS-fatigue and the that is the group which seems most susceptible to this current strain of covid. If we had let virus run its course months before the delta strain would we be in this current situation necessitating triage? Unintended consequences abound

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Because it's not realistically possible to isolate a demographic that tends to require more support that the average citizen. I mean what's your solution, throw all the olds in a bomb shelter with canned food, water, and electricity and tell them we'll take them out when we have a solution. It's just completely impractical given the status of nursing homes and multi-generation households... And that's before getting into assisted living or even independent living situations where they can't manage their own needs. It's a really popular take on Texags to pretend we can just shelter them from COVID and move on, but it's completely unrealistic fantasy.

Gordo14 said:

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tysker said:

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As a society we have yet to have a serious discussion about QALY, end of life care, and the trade offs in health care resources. Its an ugly feature that the old and unhealthy have been socialized to think they will get all the care they need. The biggest benefits of all of the health care seems to be soaked up by the few and all the relative costs are being borne by the many. Maybe another way to say it is that health care in the country has been privatizing the gains and socializing the losses. Money, time and human capital are the ultimate triage machine.

eta: its too bad too. 18 months ago we locked everyone down instead of simply isolating the old and unhealthy, who were most susceptible to the original strain of covid. The young and healthy now have covid-fatigue and BS-fatigue and the that is the group which seems most susceptible to this current strain of covid. If we had let virus run its course months before the delta strain would we be in this current situation necessitating triage? Unintended consequences abound

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Because it's not realistically possible to isolate a demographic that tends to require more support that the average citizen. I mean what's your solution, throw all the olds in a bomb shelter with canned food, water, and electricity and tell them we'll take them out when we have a solution. It's just completely impractical given the status of nursing homes and multi-generation households... And that's before getting into assisted living or even independent living situations where they can't manage their own needs. It's a really popular take on Texags to pretend we can just shelter them from COVID and move on, but it's completely unrealistic fantasy.

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Now your saying we cant shelter people from covid? It only took you 18 months to figure that out? We could we have started with an open and honest discussion about the demographics most at risk and let the public decide what works for itself. Instead a top down one size fits all solution was pressed upon us. Given we were still having outbreaks in nursing homes 12 months in so its unclear the path we took was all that great for the most medically vulnerable. But locking everything down created additional negative effects on our children and the economically vulnerable. And now currently the most vulnerable could very well be those that could have already been infected a year or more ago with a less deadly strain and built up greater personal and herd immunity.

All because we aren't willing to be honest about QALY, we won't have open end of life discussions, and healthcare costs are not necessarily paid by those who receive the most benefits.