dermdoc said:

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Proposition Joe said:

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Godaddy domain.
Generic clipart.
Generic doctor name with no real background credentials given.
Speaking for "a number of doctors".
Political angle.
Bezos/Amazon angle.
NBA/China angle.
Claims that people are lazy or have an agenda - but somehow the writer is above that.
Anecdotal evidence cited with no actual sourcing.
Scientific evidence cited with no actual sourcing.

Yeesh. I think even a middle school periodical would say no to that. All it needs is a reference to a Geocities article.

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And your medical experience is...

I am not trying to be a deck. But it is so hard to read comments like yours and not respond. And fwiw, I still teach at Baylor College of Medicine/

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My medical experience is the equivalent of the Myspace poster guy who penned this Godaddy blog as far as you know. That's the thing about essentially anonymous pieces with no citations. How do you know if the #'s he's presenting are actually factual?

He's got an NBA conspiracy, an Amazon conspiracy... He really just needs the Bill Gates conspiracy for the trifecta.

As for you still teaching at Baylor College of Medicine - I have no doubt you have more medical knowledge than I do, especially in the field of dermatology. But you also have a number of posts from March that all but say this whole thing is no big deal at all and it's all about those Dems trying to get Trump. So to be quite frank while I acknowledge you know more than I do on the subject, based on posting history the medical doctors posting on TexAgs seem to know a lot more about you on the subject -- so I'm more likely to listen to them, especially since their posting history on the subject isn't doused in politics.

Proposition Joe said:

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Godaddy domain.
Generic clipart.
Generic doctor name with no real background credentials given.
Speaking for "a number of doctors".
Political angle.
Bezos/Amazon angle.
NBA/China angle.
Claims that people are lazy or have an agenda - but somehow the writer is above that.
Anecdotal evidence cited with no actual sourcing.
Scientific evidence cited with no actual sourcing.

Yeesh. I think even a middle school periodical would say no to that. All it needs is a reference to a Geocities article.

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Yup!

Proposition Joe said:

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dermdoc said:

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Proposition Joe said:

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Godaddy domain.
Generic clipart.
Generic doctor name with no real background credentials given.
Speaking for "a number of doctors".
Political angle.
Bezos/Amazon angle.
NBA/China angle.
Claims that people are lazy or have an agenda - but somehow the writer is above that.
Anecdotal evidence cited with no actual sourcing.
Scientific evidence cited with no actual sourcing.

Yeesh. I think even a middle school periodical would say no to that. All it needs is a reference to a Geocities article.

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And your medical experience is...

I am not trying to be a deck. But it is so hard to read comments like yours and not respond. And fwiw, I still teach at Baylor College of Medicine/

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But you also have a number of posts from March that all but say this whole thing is no big deal at all and it's all about those Dems trying to get Trump.

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Ehh not to seem like choosing sides, but he's absolutely right. Maybe not bigrob fanatic level, but you were absolutely flooding threads about how covid was a nothing issue and everyone was overreacting. Seemed very consistent seeing as how I was randomly opening threads here and there and your posts were pretty repetitive throughout.

WoMD said:

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Proposition Joe said:

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dermdoc said:

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Proposition Joe said:

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Godaddy domain.
Generic clipart.
Generic doctor name with no real background credentials given.
Speaking for "a number of doctors".
Political angle.
Bezos/Amazon angle.
NBA/China angle.
Claims that people are lazy or have an agenda - but somehow the writer is above that.
Anecdotal evidence cited with no actual sourcing.
Scientific evidence cited with no actual sourcing.

Yeesh. I think even a middle school periodical would say no to that. All it needs is a reference to a Geocities article.

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And your medical experience is...

I am not trying to be a deck. But it is so hard to read comments like yours and not respond. And fwiw, I still teach at Baylor College of Medicine/

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But you also have a number of posts from March that all but say this whole thing is no big deal at all and it's all about those Dems trying to get Trump.

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Ehh not to seem like choosing sides, but he's absolutely right. Maybe not bigrob fanatic level, but you were absolutely flooding threads about how covid was a nothing issue and everyone was overreacting. Seemed very consistent seeing as how I was randomly opening threads here and there and your posts were pretty repetitive throughout.

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Cool. Give me some links. I never said what you and he are saying.

I believe I said that American hospitals would not be over run. And we would not not run out of vents. And that the death count would be between 50k-100k(still way too many), mortality rate would be between 0.3% and 0.5%, correct? And those quotes can be pulled up unlike your baseless accusations. Please correct me if I am wrong.

dermdoc said:

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WoMD said:

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Proposition Joe said:

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dermdoc said:

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Proposition Joe said:

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Godaddy domain.
Generic clipart.
Generic doctor name with no real background credentials given.
Speaking for "a number of doctors".
Political angle.
Bezos/Amazon angle.
NBA/China angle.
Claims that people are lazy or have an agenda - but somehow the writer is above that.
Anecdotal evidence cited with no actual sourcing.
Scientific evidence cited with no actual sourcing.

Yeesh. I think even a middle school periodical would say no to that. All it needs is a reference to a Geocities article.

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And your medical experience is...

I am not trying to be a deck. But it is so hard to read comments like yours and not respond. And fwiw, I still teach at Baylor College of Medicine/

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But you also have a number of posts from March that all but say this whole thing is no big deal at all and it's all about those Dems trying to get Trump.

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Ehh not to seem like choosing sides, but he's absolutely right. Maybe not bigrob fanatic level, but you were absolutely flooding threads about how covid was a nothing issue and everyone was overreacting. Seemed very consistent seeing as how I was randomly opening threads here and there and your posts were pretty repetitive throughout.

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Cool. Give me some links. I never said what you and he are saying.

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Eh makes no difference to me either way. Just saying what I remember reading over and over. Not worth my trouble to "prove it," but it was clear as day when I would read the politics board. I remember being confused, mostly because you're a doctor, which is why it stuck with me. But now that boards become such an out of control mess with everyone screaming the same thing, I have no idea if or when you changed your tune. Again, makes no difference to me if you deny it or not. Both these boards have become almost completely unreadable because of the polarized screaming about who is right.

WoMD said:

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dermdoc said:

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WoMD said:

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Proposition Joe said:

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dermdoc said:

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Proposition Joe said:

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Godaddy domain.
Generic clipart.
Generic doctor name with no real background credentials given.
Speaking for "a number of doctors".
Political angle.
Bezos/Amazon angle.
NBA/China angle.
Claims that people are lazy or have an agenda - but somehow the writer is above that.
Anecdotal evidence cited with no actual sourcing.
Scientific evidence cited with no actual sourcing.

Yeesh. I think even a middle school periodical would say no to that. All it needs is a reference to a Geocities article.

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And your medical experience is...

I am not trying to be a deck. But it is so hard to read comments like yours and not respond. And fwiw, I still teach at Baylor College of Medicine/

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But you also have a number of posts from March that all but say this whole thing is no big deal at all and it's all about those Dems trying to get Trump.

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Ehh not to seem like choosing sides, but he's absolutely right. Maybe not bigrob fanatic level, but you were absolutely flooding threads about how covid was a nothing issue and everyone was overreacting. Seemed very consistent seeing as how I was randomly opening threads here and there and your posts were pretty repetitive throughout.

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Cool. Give me some links. I never said what you and he are saying.

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Eh makes no difference to me either way. Just saying what I remember reading over and over. Not worth my trouble to "prove it," but it was clear as day when I would read the politics board. I remember being confused, mostly because you're a doctor, which is why it stuck with me. But now that boards become such an out of control mess with everyone screaming the same thing, I have no idea if or when you changed your tune. Again, makes no difference to me if you deny it or not. Both these boards have become almost completely unreadable because of the polarized screaming about who is right.

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No I never said what you think I said.

dermdoc said:

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oragator said:

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I honestly can't believe a doctor would put his name to some of the stuff on that page.
I'll leave it that.

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I would. As would almost all the docs I know.

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That's interesting because not a single doctor I know would espouse many of those beliefs...at least not publicly that is. I also have several physician friends in NYC that would likely fight you if you said any of that to their face after the amount of stress they have faced over the last month and a half. It is always doctors in non-hard hit areas that make ridiculous claims like the one in the "article" you posted or the Bakersfield urgent care doctors in the video being circulated. This virus has killed 54K in a single month despite massive, unprecedented efforts to reduce spread. It has killed large swaths of nursing home residents in facilities it has run rampant through, unlike anything I have ever seen with the flu. Floor beds were converted to ICU beds at several hospitals. Numerous healthcare workers have died from this or ended up on ventilators. This is not the flu. I agree that we need a plan to open back up, but we also should not be lackadaisical regarding the threat that this virus poses, and we should certainly not be spreading misinformation and conspiracy theories.

Dr. Not Yet Dr. Ag said:

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dermdoc said:

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oragator said:

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I honestly can't believe a doctor would put his name to some of the stuff on that page.
I'll leave it that.

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I would. As would almost all the docs I know.

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That's interesting because not a single doctor I know would espouse many of those beliefs...at least not publicly that is. I also have several physician friends in NYC that would likely fight you if you said any of that to their face after the amount of stress they have faced over the last month and a half. It is always doctors in non-hard hit areas that make ridiculous claims like the one in the "article" you posted or the Bakersfield urgent care doctors in the video being circulated. This virus has killed 54K in a single month despite massive, unprecedented efforts to reduce spread. It has killed large swaths of nursing home residents in facilities it has run rampant through, unlike anything I have ever seen with the flu. Floor beds were converted to ICU beds at several hospitals. Numerous healthcare workers have died from this or ended up on ventilators. This is not the flu. I agree that we need a plan to open back up, but we also should not be lackadaisical regarding the threat that this virus poses, and we should certainly not be spreading misinformation and conspiracy theories.

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Dr. Not Yet Dr. Ag said:

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dermdoc said:

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oragator said:

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I honestly can't believe a doctor would put his name to some of the stuff on that page.
I'll leave it that.

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I would. As would almost all the docs I know.

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That's interesting because not a single doctor I know would espouse many of those beliefs...at least not publicly that is. I also have several physician friends in NYC that would likely fight you if you said any of that to their face after the amount of stress they have faced over the last month and a half. It is always doctors in non-hard hit areas that make ridiculous claims like the one in the "article" you posted or the Bakersfield urgent care doctors in the video being circulated. This virus has killed 54K in a single month despite massive, unprecedented efforts to reduce spread. It has killed large swaths of nursing home residents in facilities it has run rampant through, unlike anything I have ever seen with the flu. Floor beds were converted to ICU beds at several hospitals. Numerous healthcare workers have died from this or ended up on ventilators. This is not the flu. I agree that we need a plan to open back up, but we also should not be lackadaisical regarding the threat that this virus poses, and we should certainly not be spreading misinformation and conspiracy theories.

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dermdoc said:

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Not really. I trust clinicians with experience. And whatever site does not change the article and it's info.

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You keep referring to the diary entry of one physician as an "article". It is at best a facebook post that no other physician who is actually on the front lines would take seriously, including many who post on this board. It is hard to know who actually wrote it, since there isn't much identifying information besides a name. Probably should've kept this one in your back pocket, doc. Not really appropriate for this board.

I Am A Critic said:

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This reads like something that old people forward to each other as truth and is then passed along as fact. I rank it up there with gangbangers driving without headlights and people having kidneys stolen and waking up in an ice bath.

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Lots of trolling in this thread.

Ellis Wyatt said:

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Lots of trolling in this thread.

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This was an actual line in the "article" dermdoc posted:

"Search NIH if you want to review these findings."

Staff can we nuke the thread or get it moved to the Politics board where it belongs?

No experience using it in this circumstance. We use it in the OR though mostly to guide treatment of coagulopathy in cardiac, transplant and trauma patients. There's some (crappy) evidence that a hypercoagulable result can predict thrombotic complications post cardiac surgery. I know some folks are using it for COVID but I don't have first or second hand knowledge. Just curious. Thanks for sharing your experience here. We haven't been hit that hard but people like you have helped us prepare.

Ribbed Paultz said:

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dermdoc said:

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Not really. I trust clinicians with experience. And whatever site does not change the article and it's info.

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You keep referring to the diary entry of one physician as an "article". It is at best a facebook post that no other physician who is actually on the front lines would take seriously, including many who post on this board. It is hard to know who actually wrote it, since there isn't much identifying information besides a name. Probably should've kept this one in your back pocket, doc. Not really appropriate for this board.

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Is it not appropriate because the opinions of this doctor don't fall inline with the opinions you want to hear from doctors?

You can't possibly know what all or even the majority of doctors on the "front lines" think. We have only heard anecdotal stories from a hand full of doctors on here and in the media.

It's funny because people have gone from whining about not hearing from doctors as much on this forum to whining that the opinions of dermdoc and other doctors aren't appropriate.

I'll say again. Every doc I know, who's taking care of these pts, either at my hospital or nationally interacting on social media, agrees that this virus is exponentially more deadly than seasonal flu. Take it FWIW. Not trying to be a Karen. But would love for some of the internet badasses who minimize this virus to see these people first hand.

SirLurksALot said:

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Ribbed Paultz said:

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dermdoc said:

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Not really. I trust clinicians with experience. And whatever site does not change the article and it's info.

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You keep referring to the diary entry of one physician as an "article". It is at best a facebook post that no other physician who is actually on the front lines would take seriously, including many who post on this board. It is hard to know who actually wrote it, since there isn't much identifying information besides a name. Probably should've kept this one in your back pocket, doc. Not really appropriate for this board.

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Is it not appropriate because the opinions of this doctor don't fall inline with the opinions you want to hear from doctors?

You can't possibly know what all or even the majority of doctors on the "front lines" think. We have only heard anecdotal stories from a hand full of doctors on here and in the media.

It's funny because people have gone from whining about not hearing from doctors as much on this forum to whining that the opinions of dermdoc and other doctors aren't appropriate.

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From Brandon's sticky at the top of this board:
"To be clear: This is not a place to post your opinion as fact or to post information not rooted in clear facts. This is not a place to have political arguments or to detail your opinions about how well or poorly the government is handling the issue. This is not a place to rant about media conspiracies. This is not a place to critique other people for their level of concern or efforts to prepare. There are forums for (some of) those conversations, but they don't belong here."

The "article" dermdoc posted is basically a bunch of OPINIONS from doctors who don't appear to have worked on the front lines (they don't claim it and they don't post any relevant identifying information other than one generic name which may or may not be real). Also, it rants about media conspiracies. Ergo, not appropriate for this board.

I agree with you that it's a travesty more doctors are not posting on this board anymore.

Ribbed Paultz said:

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SirLurksALot said:

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Ribbed Paultz said:

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dermdoc said:

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Not really. I trust clinicians with experience. And whatever site does not change the article and it's info.

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You keep referring to the diary entry of one physician as an "article". It is at best a facebook post that no other physician who is actually on the front lines would take seriously, including many who post on this board. It is hard to know who actually wrote it, since there isn't much identifying information besides a name. Probably should've kept this one in your back pocket, doc. Not really appropriate for this board.

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Is it not appropriate because the opinions of this doctor don't fall inline with the opinions you want to hear from doctors?

You can't possibly know what all or even the majority of doctors on the "front lines" think. We have only heard anecdotal stories from a hand full of doctors on here and in the media.

It's funny because people have gone from whining about not hearing from doctors as much on this forum to whining that the opinions of dermdoc and other doctors aren't appropriate.

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From Brandon's sticky at the top of this board:
"To be clear: This is not a place to post your opinion as fact or to post information not rooted in clear facts. This is not a place to have political arguments or to detail your opinions about how well or poorly the government is handling the issue. This is not a place to rant about media conspiracies. This is not a place to critique other people for their level of concern or efforts to prepare. There are forums for (some of) those conversations, but they don't belong here."

The "article" dermdoc posted is basically a bunch of OPINIONS from doctors who don't appear to have worked on the front lines (they don't claim it and they don't post any relevant identifying information other than one generic name which may or may not be real). Also, it rants about media conspiracies. Ergo, not appropriate for this board.

I agree with you that it's a travesty more doctors are not posting on this board anymore.

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So opinions from doctors that you agree are ok, but opinions from doctors you don't agree with aren't ok because you think they don't work on the front lines?

This is an internet discussion forum. The vast majority of stuff posted here are opinions. If people didn't post opinions, this would just become an aggregator for news articles and daily updates to death and infectious stats. If you don't agree with opinions in this thread then don't read it. I don't know why some are on a crusade to remove opposing viewpoints they don't like.

Marcus Aurelius said:

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I'll say again. Every doc I know, who's taking care of these pts, either at my hospital or nationally interacting on social media, agrees that this virus is exponentially more deadly than seasonal flu. Take it FWIW. Not trying to be a Karen. But would love for some of the internet badasses who minimize this virus to see these people first hand.

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I have no doubt that you have witnessed some bad stuff over the last few months and that it has shaped how you view this virus. However, those cases should be viewed through the context of other data, Which, I'm sure you know.

The vast majority experience minor to no symptoms. Cone did a good job of breaking down the information out of New York. It's looking like there is a hospitalization rate of around 3% and half that if you're under 50. A significant portion of those have underlying conditions. It's hard for me to be too concerned about something that is producing those kind of numbers.

In defense of Dermdoc there was much unknown about COVID19. The reservoir has still been found and that has prevented the ability to derive a accurate denominator.

It did appear early on that COVID19 could have been less deadly than flu. Just remember if there were no vaccines flus would be much deadlier than what we see now.

This is the aspect in COVID19 discussion folks want to be in a "Well you said something different 3 weeks ago"!! After all this time the expert still speaks about that there is still much they still don't understand and the inability to predict how the COVID19 progression is going to spread.

Why jump on folks like Dermdoc because what they say then versus what they could be saying now? There is an extreme intolerance for a change of opinion based on updated information. The context of the biases are connected to whether one is being a Trump supporter. If you are Trump or Trump supporter, every word you speak is going to be scrutinized, change of position is not tolerated, and well just about any position taken will be dismissed.

As for those doctors in New York, I understand they are at ground zero for many deaths. You can hear in their voices they are tired. Many will have PTSD. I feel bad for them but NYC is not Texas. I heard a few of the NYC doctor being highly critical of other states trying to open. It was almost like they expected all of use to stay closed down in solidarity with NYC until they are able to open up. I am not going to hold that against them because they are in the thick of it. At the same time it doesn't gift them some special knowledge and understanding that the rest of us can not understand. That is unfortunate because the forces a "us" vs "them" conflict.

Yeah. I have "referral bias." Cant help it. Seeing them die with really no effective treatment does that. Chiming on this forum. I am no epidemiologist.

Marcus Aurelius said:

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Yeah. I have "referral bias." Cant help it. Seeing them die with really no effective treatment does that. Chiming on this forum. I am no epidemiologist.

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I appreciate your perspective and hope you continue to share your experiences. Hopefully things start to improve soon.