pantherag said:

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VaultingChemist said:

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If a school has enough Chromebooks for every student, how difficult is it to set up all the classes to be taught online?

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It's not that simple. Not every ISD is set up to conduct online classes. There are many families who do not have access to internet in their homes. There are many student who have accommodations for learning that cannot be met for online teaching. There are many more considerations than just making sure every student has access to a device.

These are the discussions we are having and there are no easy solutions.

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And as often happens, decisions made rarely take into consideration the differences in primary/middle/secondary campuses or even the differences in campuses at each of those levels...

ETA: AgLA06, exactly

AgLA06 said:

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What is better isolation. Kids in school 5 days a week or running the streets still socializing and pulling parents from work?

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Well, if they go to school, we know, 100%, that they will:
* Be in close contact with other kids for 8 hours a day, 5 days a week
* Be, in many cases, rotating in and out amongst different groups during that time
* Be in lunchrooms with hundreds at a time
* Be on busses with an even larger variety (across grades and even schools in some places)

If they don't, then some will still go out social if they:
* are able to drive or walk themselves to these places
* have parents who don't have control over them or allow them to do so

Given how empty people talked about theaters and the like being over the weekend, I highly doubt there will be a massive rush to cinemas & malls if kids are out.

And even if they do, a subset of a population is always, at worst, the same....meaning if every kid is at school, we know they are transmitting it if anyone has it. If they're not, at WORST it is the same.

I agree there is a hardship on the parents and that is a real burden and I'm not trying to minimize it.

I just think it is a stretch to assume the same level of social interaction if schools are closed.

FireAg said:

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pantherag,

Why are schools doing something that the CDC actually argues is ineffective? I'm so lost? People are running around screaming that the CDC says to close to the schools, and that's actually not what the CDC says AT ALL...

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Fire ... Gov Abbott made the decision to allow local ISD's make local decisions vs. a state wide mandate. So that's why your seeing some districts taking a different approach. I think in addition to the Gov's decision, local govt is taking into consideration population density and potential outbreak risk based on what's happening in your local area. I know our local county judge very well and I don't anticipate our local area enacting some of the strict guidelines that were announced by Austin today.

The CDC makes recommendations, but it's still up to the local govt to make local decisions.

pantherag said:

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VaultingChemist said:

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If a school has enough Chromebooks for every student, how difficult is it to set up all the classes to be taught online?

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It's not that simple. Not every ISD is set up to conduct online classes. There are many families who do not have access to internet in their homes. There are many student who have accommodations for learning that cannot be met for online teaching. There are many more considerations than just making sure every student has access to a device.

These are the discussions we are having and there are no easy solutions.

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This will be a major topic of discussion tomorrow at our jr. high and high schools. I saw on the local news station that one school is planning on using school buses to provide free wifi in some neighborhoods.

I have no problem letting local jurisdictions decide per se, but it seems like when one did it, it became monkey see-monkey do...regardless of other factors...

Not the same.

Much more controlled around the same kids every day. Smaller the school, more the controlled isolation compared to in public.

Really not needed on this thread

Charpie said:

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Really not needed on this thread

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Okay then. STAR tests and silly EOC tests don't matter one bit. Forget about them. Most other classes don't matter either. The ones I care about are the SAT's that have been cancelled, and how my kids are going to do their 6 AP exams. Of course, the whole country is in the same bind.

As far as online instruction, that's a joke, right? I have 6 kids in 3 different schools. Two are ESL, three have ARDs/504's, four are in Spanish Immersion. Well just hand them a Chromebook or a smart phone...coolio's.

JDCAG (NOT Colin) said:

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Well, if they go to school, we know, 100%, that they will:
* Be in close contact with other kids for 8 hours a day, 5 days a week
* Be, in many cases, rotating in and out amongst different groups during that time
* Be in lunchrooms with hundreds at a time
* Be on busses with an even larger variety (across grades and even schools in some places)

If they don't, then some will still go out social if they:
* are able to drive or walk themselves to these places
* have parents who don't have control over them or allow them to do so

I agree there is a hardship on the parents and that is a real burden and I'm not trying to minimize it.

I just think it is a stretch to assume the same level of social interaction if schools are closed.

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On Friday when Dallas instituted the ban on gatherings larger than 250 people, my wife's school with just over 1,000 students canceled lunch in the cafeteria and all kids ate in their classrooms. So, yes, there is some local control at work here.

In regard to theaters, AMC announced that they were limiting ticket sales to 1/2 capacity. A theater with larger than 500 seats was capped at 250 tickets.

Summer is roughly 10 weeks. Not advocating for it but schools take an early summer to get their ducks in a row and when "summer" starts the kids go back to school and somehow you transition either into a year round program or slowly get back on schedule.

Sucks as no one has plans made, etc but there is no way kids can be out 10 weeks plus summer.

FireAg said:

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pantherag,

Why are schools doing something that the CDC actually argues is ineffective? I'm so lost? People are running around screaming that the CDC says to close to the schools, and that's actually not what the CDC says AT ALL...

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Use your imagination: With school as usual, 100% of kids are in close proximity, sharing all bugs.

With schools out, kids (and staff) are much more limited in who they are exposed to. Some may still hang out, but many won't. The ones that do likely won't be as crammed together nor with as many others.

What we're seeing right now is a piecemeal, seat of the pants attempt at getting a handle on this thing. Italy tried some steps, but they weren't enough, so they closed the shops and restaurants. We're seeing escalating precautions here, too. They may escalate again, because kids (and adults) don't take the hint.

And again, schools must have staff. Sorry if you think concerns about personal safety are taking advantage of the system. For the last four years I have not missed more than one day of school. And have missed only a half day two of those years. Teaching is one of the few jobs where we are shamed for using the leave days we acrue. So teachers go to work sick and stressed and overloaded. I don't know of a single teacher at my large school that takes advantage of the sytem.

However at 71 I am high risk. I was exploring options for a way to keep my job and use the 8 weeks of leave I have built up (used all mine a few years ago when I had to have two hip surgeries the same year) to stay away from kids who don't wash their hands. Teachers circulate constantly, We no longer sit behind desks like in the really old days. Most of our subs are also elderly by age. Who is going to be there to actually run the schools? In my team, we have one veteran who has a technical disability and would be high risk due to health issues, a young teacher who is 34 weeks pg and going out soon on maternity leave, me, and two fantastic young teacher under 30. But there is no way they can handle their loads and the students the three of us who really shoudl not be there teach. I have g good numbe high risk students. Some with Sicle Cell, others who are diabetic, one with Lupus. Several others recovering from recent major surgery. These students probably should not be at school at all.

From my interpretation of the CDC statement, it doesn't say keeping students at home is ineffective. It states that keeping students at home for less than 8 weeks is ineffective. However, closing schools for 8 weeks or more would help control the spread of the disease.

I did not say "3rd Generation Ag who is 71 years old is taking advantage of the situation." I said if you think there aren't teachers taking advantage your kidding yourself. Teachers love a good day off. We all do. There's not many teacher's that don't hope for a cm of ice and then wonder why school was not cancelled. It's in our dna as humans. There is a lot of the teacher population that should not continue coming to campuses for reasons you eloquently outlined. There are others that suddenly have an undocumented super secret lung disorder.

I do not want to turn this into a back and forth and I apologize if my comments created that. I clearly said that I respect the heck out of teachers. They are the biggest resource in the world. At the end of the day we are all in this together and have to make the best decisions we can. The workforce and their willingness to work are a part of that decision.

I see schools opening in June & July to finish the year, off for August, and start back up in Sept after Labor Day.

That's gonna suck for summer football and band

Wonder how many people out there operate small businesses with 1-10 members of staff, most of whom are moms with kids who could be at home for 2-8 weeks if and when school districts and day care centers close? How in the world is work going to get done even if customers/clients continue to come in for regular assistance? How will these employers be able to make payroll? Hint, taking immediate credits against payroll taxes won't do the trick and, if you are borrowing, you're already losing money if the volume of business temporarily abates or if you do not have sufficient labor to get work done. I'm afraid that if this "crisis" isn't handled properly and very expeditiously, there are a whole lot of small businesses that may close and a lot of unemployed people looking for jobs.

State is removing the testing mandate as it applies to grade advancement and graduation. Districts apparently have the option of still administering the STAAR to their students if they want to gather that data, but there's no indication about how that will work in practice yet.

My druthers are that districts should continue to offer as much educational support to their students as possible - whether that's online or p&p activities and hard copy books that have to be picked up from the school campuses. Keep campuses closed and students away as long as necessary and adjust the educational expectations for the next three years to make up for lost instructional time this semester. Offer remediation resources during the summer (assuming the quarantine is lifted by then) to help out those students who may not have had access to online materials or capable adults to oversee their work while they're stuck at home.

aggierogue said:

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From my interpretation of the CDC statement, it doesn't say keeping students at home is ineffective. It states that keeping students at home for less than 8 weeks is ineffective. However, closing schools for 8 weeks or more would help control the spread of the disease.

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Nope. The school closure decision tree only starts with a confirmed case in school.

1. There is a role for school closure in response to school-based cases of COVID-19 for decontamination and contact
tracing (few days of closure), in response to significant absenteeism of staff and students (short to medium
length, i.e. 2-4 weeks of closure), or as part of a larger community mitigation strategy for jurisdictions with
substantial community spread* (medium to long length, i.e. 4-8 weeks or more of closure).

2. Available modeling data indicate that early, short to medium closures do not impact the epi curve of COVID-19 or available health care measures (e.g., hospitalizations). There may be some impact of much longer closures (8 weeks, 20 weeks) further into community spread, but that modelling also shows that other mitigation efforts (e.g., handwashing, home isolation) have more impact on both spread of disease and health care measures. In
other countries, those places who closed school (e.g., Hong Kong) have not had more success in reducing spread
than those that did not (e.g., Singapore).

3. In places where school closures are necessary, the anticipated academic and economic impacts and unintended
impacts on disease outcomes must be planned for and mitigated. Provision of academic support (e.g., tele-ed),
alternatives for school-based meals as well as other services (e.g., behavioral and mental health services) for
economically and physically vulnerable children, support for families for whom telework and paid sick leave is not
available, ensuring that high risk individuals continue to be protected must all be addressed. Special consideration
must be given for health care workers so that school closures do not impact their ability to work.

lunchbox said:

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JDCAG (NOT Colin) said:

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lunchbox said:

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BBRex said:

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I posted this on the Houston board, and I think it is relevant here:

I went last fall to a k-12 conference about technology in education, and most school districts are still caught up with the idea that every student needs a teacher trying to differentiate instruction for 28 kids with different educational needs. Technology could help k-12 education on a bunch of levels, not just emergencies like this, but I don't think there are any districts in Texas really ready to offer classes online at this scale.

Also, parents and community groups in economically disadvantaged areas will scream that their kids don't have access to the technology they need to work from home.

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As I said above K12 is 100% online and run by Huntsville ISD - those who are socioeconomically disadvantaged have their laptop, printer, etc. provided by the program. It IS possible...but you would have to convince everyone of it first.

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Gotta think a rollout of something like this will be much harder when
1) Every surrounding district not already doing this is trying to start doing it (seems like that would be millions and millions of machines needed across the state)
2) None of the teachers have been trained on this and there won't be any group training available for obvious reasons

Not saying it can't or shouldn't be done, just saying that this is probably about as disadvantageous a situation in which to try and roll something like this out.

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Yeah I was thinking you would take the several ISDs that are already doing it and roll kids to those programs...not create new programs. They are the experts and have been doing it for years. If you wanted to sign your kids up in the K12 program today, you could do it.

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The first post is spot on, Districts that don't utilize a learning management system are at least in discussions about adopting one. However, for large Districts most of these platforms will cost quite a bit of money to purchase and require months of coordination with the Districts IT and curriculum Departments. Then comes training to teachers, students, and parents (already mentioned). Every school/District is different and requires quite a great relative degree of customization. This could be done in the long term next time something like this happens but is not feasible in the short term. Also, as others have mentioned there are way more kids without access to internet. Our District is considering giving students who need internet a personal hotspot. The problem is how to distribute these limited devices to those who really need it. I am thinking a lot of Districts will have to revert to correspondence type instruction

Fleen said:

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pantherag said:

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VaultingChemist said:

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If a school has enough Chromebooks for every student, how difficult is it to set up all the classes to be taught online?

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It's not that simple. Not every ISD is set up to conduct online classes. There are many families who do not have access to internet in their homes. There are many student who have accommodations for learning that cannot be met for online teaching. There are many more considerations than just making sure every student has access to a device.

These are the discussions we are having and there are no easy solutions.

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And as often happens, decisions made rarely take into consideration the differences in primary/middle/secondary campuses or even the differences in campuses at each of those levels...

ETA: AgLA06, exactly

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There are no schools I know of that are 1:1 devices. Also to setup an online learning management system costs a lot of money. Google Classroom is great at some things is not a viable universal solution

option short side said:

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Fleen said:

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pantherag said:

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VaultingChemist said:

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If a school has enough Chromebooks for every student, how difficult is it to set up all the classes to be taught online?

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It's not that simple. Not every ISD is set up to conduct online classes. There are many families who do not have access to internet in their homes. There are many student who have accommodations for learning that cannot be met for online teaching. There are many more considerations than just making sure every student has access to a device.

These are the discussions we are having and there are no easy solutions.

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And as often happens, decisions made rarely take into consideration the differences in primary/middle/secondary campuses or even the differences in campuses at each of those levels...

ETA: AgLA06, exactly

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There are no schools I know of that are 1:1 devices. Also to setup an online learning management system costs a lot of money. Google Classroom is great at some things is not a viable universal solution

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Irving ISD Middle Schools are the only ones I know of. Every kid and teacher has a iPad with free data provided by verizon

https://www.irvingisd.net/Page/13585