Soft Coach = Undisciplined Players

4,880 Views | 88 Replies | Last: 8 yr ago by EXCELL
FTAG 2000
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Aston04 said:

Aggies2009 said:

Aston04 said:

monkeyaround said:

That fact is that most of you don't have a clue what you're talking about. It's highly unlikely anybody around the team has said the players don't respect BK. The ones I know say the opposite. In other words, you're speculating based on nothing but your own bias against the man. If you don't like his coaching, fine. You're entitled to your opinion. But don't make stuff up that you have no first-hand knowledge about.


Their actions reflect exactly the opposite of what you claim. Over HALF the team has been suspended in multiple separate incidents--- several suspended multiple times. That speaks volume about the (lack of) respect for their coach and fellow teammates who do right (Davis & Wilson)...
That's the thing, though. It shows a lack of respect for things outside of basketball, namely law enforcement. The incidents happened outside of basketball, after all. To try and frame this as a "Kennedy" issue is just laughable and the latest attempt to grasp at straws since the team started winning.
Believe it or not- some coaches demand more respect from their kids than being caught by some university cop. I guarantee BCG's kids feared him more and as a correlation more often respected team rules. The upside is it also kept them out of trouble with the law.

It's like we are re-litigating the Sumlin era on this board. In regard to (lack of) discipline- This exactly what happened in our football program and I thought we all agreed it was a huge issue for Kevin. Apparently not.

Big difference - Sumlin didn't go to church with the local blue hairs.
Double Diamond
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Coaches are very much responsible for the behavior of their team. And frankly get fired often for having teams that run amuck with problems. It's called lack of institutional control. I'm not sure what's going on here, but the fact some act like it's not a problem, or concerning that the coach isn't getting through to over half the team is frighting.
Player To Be Named Later
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Am I the only one who had a HS football coach that put the fear of God in us that if we got in trouble we'd wish we were dead?

Heaven help us if we got caught drinking, etc.

This myth that coaches can't control their programs is just another way of whistling past the Kennedy graveyard
cevans_40
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Player To Be Named Later said:

Am I the only one who had a HS football coach that put the fear of God in us that if we got in trouble we'd wish we were dead?

Heaven help us if we got caught drinking, etc.

This myth that coaches can't control their programs is just another way of whistling past the Kennedy graveyard

Snowflakes don't understand this.
Aggies2009
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The Debt said:

Aggies2009 said:

It's also a law... They broke the law which has far greater consequences than anything Coach Kennedy could punish them with. If they were willing to risk jail time, there's really not a lot Kennedy could do, is there?

Wrong. These kids grow up in weed-culture. They know a misdemeanor here and there won't land them in prison.

BUT Kennedy is their pipe to hoop dreams. If these athletes want to do something other than sell insurance, they rely on making the most out of their basketball program.

Instead of blowing off steam in the gym, inching their way closer to the nba, they get a dimebag.
So now not only have you claimed that Kennedy can keep them in check despite them going above the law to do something, you now are telling me where the players grew up and how they think when making decisions. Wow. Your mind is obviously made up and you'll go through any mental gymnastics possible to stick to that gun. Good luck with that.
Aggies2009
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cevans_40 said:

Aggies2009 said:

Aston04 said:

monkeyaround said:

That fact is that most of you don't have a clue what you're talking about. It's highly unlikely anybody around the team has said the players don't respect BK. The ones I know say the opposite. In other words, you're speculating based on nothing but your own bias against the man. If you don't like his coaching, fine. You're entitled to your opinion. But don't make stuff up that you have no first-hand knowledge about.


Their actions reflect exactly the opposite of what you claim. Over HALF the team has been suspended in multiple separate incidents--- several suspended multiple times. That speaks volume about the (lack of) respect for their coach and fellow teammates who do right (Davis & Wilson)...
That's the thing, though. It shows a lack of respect for things outside of basketball, namely law enforcement. The incidents happened outside of basketball, after all. To try and frame this as a "Kennedy" issue is just laughable and the latest attempt to grasp at straws since the team started winning.

It shows a lack of disciple. Period. End of discussion. They are not a disciplined team, especially off of the court. I have played for coaches who demanded discipline on and off the field and I in have played for coaches who didn't. Guess which ones had more off field issues? This can't happen with the frequency it has and the coach be without fault.
Again, there's only so much a coach can do. What's he going to threaten them with that's worse than spending time in jail? If you want to make the claim that he's recruited players that have issues, I'll hear that more than it being his fault that college students in their late teens/early 20s screwed up.
Double Diamond
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Again why don't more coaches have half the team facing suspensions with one JR getting two in a season? And again don't tell me other coaches look the other way or schools.
Deputy Travis Junior
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None of us know enough about the inner workings of the program to definitively assign blame, but we have had way more suspensions and transfers than normal for years now.
FTAG 2000
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Aggies2009 said:

cevans_40 said:

Aggies2009 said:

Aston04 said:

monkeyaround said:

That fact is that most of you don't have a clue what you're talking about. It's highly unlikely anybody around the team has said the players don't respect BK. The ones I know say the opposite. In other words, you're speculating based on nothing but your own bias against the man. If you don't like his coaching, fine. You're entitled to your opinion. But don't make stuff up that you have no first-hand knowledge about.


Their actions reflect exactly the opposite of what you claim. Over HALF the team has been suspended in multiple separate incidents--- several suspended multiple times. That speaks volume about the (lack of) respect for their coach and fellow teammates who do right (Davis & Wilson)...
That's the thing, though. It shows a lack of respect for things outside of basketball, namely law enforcement. The incidents happened outside of basketball, after all. To try and frame this as a "Kennedy" issue is just laughable and the latest attempt to grasp at straws since the team started winning.

It shows a lack of disciple. Period. End of discussion. They are not a disciplined team, especially off of the court. I have played for coaches who demanded discipline on and off the field and I in have played for coaches who didn't. Guess which ones had more off field issues? This can't happen with the frequency it has and the coach be without fault.
Again, there's only so much a coach can do. What's he going to threaten them with that's worse than spending time in jail? If you want to make the claim that he's recruited players that have issues, I'll hear that more than it being his fault that college students in their late teens/early 20s screwed up.

Spoken like someone who has never played organized sports.

Plenty of ways for the coach to motivate and discipline his kids. But we all know BK runs soft practices as it is, so expecting him to instill discipline or any sort of fear of the coach is clearly too much to ask.

Much easier to blame the kids and defend the guy making $2.3 million a year to win and develop good young adults for life after school.
cevans_40
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Aggies2009 said:

cevans_40 said:

Aggies2009 said:

Aston04 said:

monkeyaround said:

That fact is that most of you don't have a clue what you're talking about. It's highly unlikely anybody around the team has said the players don't respect BK. The ones I know say the opposite. In other words, you're speculating based on nothing but your own bias against the man. If you don't like his coaching, fine. You're entitled to your opinion. But don't make stuff up that you have no first-hand knowledge about.


Their actions reflect exactly the opposite of what you claim. Over HALF the team has been suspended in multiple separate incidents--- several suspended multiple times. That speaks volume about the (lack of) respect for their coach and fellow teammates who do right (Davis & Wilson)...
That's the thing, though. It shows a lack of respect for things outside of basketball, namely law enforcement. The incidents happened outside of basketball, after all. To try and frame this as a "Kennedy" issue is just laughable and the latest attempt to grasp at straws since the team started winning.

It shows a lack of disciple. Period. End of discussion. They are not a disciplined team, especially off of the court. I have played for coaches who demanded discipline on and off the field and I in have played for coaches who didn't. Guess which ones had more off field issues? This can't happen with the frequency it has and the coach be without fault.
Again, there's only so much a coach can do. What's he going to threaten them with that's worse than spending time in jail? If you want to make the claim that he's recruited players that have issues, I'll hear that more than it being his fault that college students in their late teens/early 20s screwed up.

Maybe if it were 1 or 2 guys. This is a program-wide issue.
biobioprof
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Regarding the hypothesis that the environment is less permissive here than at other schools.

Remind me of what the suspension/arrest rates were under Turgeon and Gillespie.

edit to add: I honestly don't remember and I'm too lazy to look it up.
CynicalSam
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Aggies2009 said:

cevans_40 said:

Aggies2009 said:

Aston04 said:

monkeyaround said:

That fact is that most of you don't have a clue what you're talking about. It's highly unlikely anybody around the team has said the players don't respect BK. The ones I know say the opposite. In other words, you're speculating based on nothing but your own bias against the man. If you don't like his coaching, fine. You're entitled to your opinion. But don't make stuff up that you have no first-hand knowledge about.


Their actions reflect exactly the opposite of what you claim. Over HALF the team has been suspended in multiple separate incidents--- several suspended multiple times. That speaks volume about the (lack of) respect for their coach and fellow teammates who do right (Davis & Wilson)...
That's the thing, though. It shows a lack of respect for things outside of basketball, namely law enforcement. The incidents happened outside of basketball, after all. To try and frame this as a "Kennedy" issue is just laughable and the latest attempt to grasp at straws since the team started winning.

It shows a lack of disciple. Period. End of discussion. They are not a disciplined team, especially off of the court. I have played for coaches who demanded discipline on and off the field and I in have played for coaches who didn't. Guess which ones had more off field issues? This can't happen with the frequency it has and the coach be without fault.
Again, there's only so much a coach can do. What's he going to threaten them with that's worse than spending time in jail? If you want to make the claim that he's recruited players that have issues, I'll hear that more than it being his fault that college students in their late teens/early 20s screwed up.
The athletic department should have a risk management program to protect multi million $ programs. Do criminal background checks! Not knowing about outstanding warrants seems inexcusable to me given the domino effect it can have on a program. Anyone remember the 3 Aggie football players who all had outstanding warrants when they got stopped a few years back. Warning sign maybe? If the warrant had been taken care of, perhaps this isn't as severe. Also, having sessions with athletes to help guide them away from illegal activities or at least coach them on how to not get caught might be advisable.

http://www.kbtx.com/home/headlines/Three-Aggie-Football-Players-Arrested-On-Warrants-255551031.html
mncag
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I'm curious how many of our players had any kind of arrest or misdemeanors in high school or elsewhere. Meaning before they came here was there any indication

I'm sure there are lots of players who use pot. It just don't do it during the season maybe using pot and untimely turnovers have something in common
Aggies2009
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AG 2000' said:

Aggies2009 said:

cevans_40 said:

Aggies2009 said:

Aston04 said:

monkeyaround said:

That fact is that most of you don't have a clue what you're talking about. It's highly unlikely anybody around the team has said the players don't respect BK. The ones I know say the opposite. In other words, you're speculating based on nothing but your own bias against the man. If you don't like his coaching, fine. You're entitled to your opinion. But don't make stuff up that you have no first-hand knowledge about.


Their actions reflect exactly the opposite of what you claim. Over HALF the team has been suspended in multiple separate incidents--- several suspended multiple times. That speaks volume about the (lack of) respect for their coach and fellow teammates who do right (Davis & Wilson)...
That's the thing, though. It shows a lack of respect for things outside of basketball, namely law enforcement. The incidents happened outside of basketball, after all. To try and frame this as a "Kennedy" issue is just laughable and the latest attempt to grasp at straws since the team started winning.

It shows a lack of disciple. Period. End of discussion. They are not a disciplined team, especially off of the court. I have played for coaches who demanded discipline on and off the field and I in have played for coaches who didn't. Guess which ones had more off field issues? This can't happen with the frequency it has and the coach be without fault.
Again, there's only so much a coach can do. What's he going to threaten them with that's worse than spending time in jail? If you want to make the claim that he's recruited players that have issues, I'll hear that more than it being his fault that college students in their late teens/early 20s screwed up.

Spoken like someone who has never played organized sports.

Plenty of ways for the coach to motivate and discipline his kids. But we all know BK runs soft practices as it is, so expecting him to instill discipline or any sort of fear of the coach is clearly too much to ask.

Much easier to blame the kids and defend the guy making $2.3 million a year to win and develop good young adults for life after school.
Ah yes. The good old "you've never played x" accusation. I love when that always comes out. And then to cite his salary as if that means we can always just blame him for whatever. I didn't think I'd illicit THAT response so soon.... I've played plenty of organized sports at a very high level. I've seen coaches "motivate" and "discipline" kids for getting out of line outside of the sport. And many times, I've seen players flat out quit rather than go through whatever punishment they have to serve. It just depends on the athlete. Some put their sport above all and will serve time, although they usually aren't the ones getting in trouble in the first place. And I've seen others who go out and get in trouble, never caring what their coach would do in spite of the coaches running tight ships. Why? Because they know that if they get in trouble with the law, their coach is the last thing on their mind. So again... I ask what Coach Kennedy could do that would be worse than the consequences of being arrested. What should he have done differently, specifically. Saying, "Be tougher" isn't specific. Tell me what he could/should have done, and what he didn't do, since you're an expert on what kind of practices he runs. There's plenty to criticize Coach Kennedy over.... Kids going out and doing stuff way from school/basketball is not one of them.
Double Diamond
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Turgeon and Gillispie swept things under the rug.
Muy
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Aggies2009 said:

AG 2000' said:

Aggies2009 said:

cevans_40 said:

Aggies2009 said:

Aston04 said:

monkeyaround said:

That fact is that most of you don't have a clue what you're talking about. It's highly unlikely anybody around the team has said the players don't respect BK. The ones I know say the opposite. In other words, you're speculating based on nothing but your own bias against the man. If you don't like his coaching, fine. You're entitled to your opinion. But don't make stuff up that you have no first-hand knowledge about.


Their actions reflect exactly the opposite of what you claim. Over HALF the team has been suspended in multiple separate incidents--- several suspended multiple times. That speaks volume about the (lack of) respect for their coach and fellow teammates who do right (Davis & Wilson)...
That's the thing, though. It shows a lack of respect for things outside of basketball, namely law enforcement. The incidents happened outside of basketball, after all. To try and frame this as a "Kennedy" issue is just laughable and the latest attempt to grasp at straws since the team started winning.

It shows a lack of disciple. Period. End of discussion. They are not a disciplined team, especially off of the court. I have played for coaches who demanded discipline on and off the field and I in have played for coaches who didn't. Guess which ones had more off field issues? This can't happen with the frequency it has and the coach be without fault.
Again, there's only so much a coach can do. What's he going to threaten them with that's worse than spending time in jail? If you want to make the claim that he's recruited players that have issues, I'll hear that more than it being his fault that college students in their late teens/early 20s screwed up.

Spoken like someone who has never played organized sports.

Plenty of ways for the coach to motivate and discipline his kids. But we all know BK runs soft practices as it is, so expecting him to instill discipline or any sort of fear of the coach is clearly too much to ask.

Much easier to blame the kids and defend the guy making $2.3 million a year to win and develop good young adults for life after school.
Ah yes. The good old "you've never played x" accusation. I love when that always comes out. And then to cite his salary as if that means we can always just blame him for whatever. I didn't think I'd illicit THAT response so soon.... I've played plenty of organized sports at a very high level. I've seen coaches "motivate" and "discipline" kids for getting out of line outside of the sport. And many times, I've seen players flat out quit rather than go through whatever punishment they have to serve. It just depends on the athlete. Some put their sport above all and will serve time, although they usually aren't the ones getting in trouble in the first place. And I've seen others who go out and get in trouble, never caring what their coach would do in spite of the coaches running tight ships. Why? Because they know that if they get in trouble with the law, their coach is the last thing on their mind. So again... I ask what Coach Kennedy could do that would be worse than the consequences of being arrested. What should he have done differently, specifically. Saying, "Be tougher" isn't specific. Tell me what he could/should have done, and what he didn't do, since you're an expert on what kind of practices he runs. There's plenty to criticize Coach Kennedy over.... Kids going out and doing stuff way from school/basketball is not one of them.


I agree that the coach's salary has nothing to do with this. It's basically saying "that coach is paid $3 Million a year so we expect him to have no off the court issues, but that guy is only paid $1 Million a year so he's allowed to have a bunch of thm".
Player To Be Named Later
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Double Diamond said:

Turgeon and Gillispie swept things under the rug.


Sounds like these suspensions are above Kennedy, so let's not pretend he's laying the law down himself. You think he'd personally suspend all these guys knowing a crappy season gets him canned?
cevans_40
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/facepalm
Double Diamond
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No doubt. Why weren't Gillispie and Turgeon having the AD suspend players?
EXCELL
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So do you think Duke sweeps issues under the carpet?

 
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