Guidon Bearer

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joehey
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11:31p, 5/11/18
There has been some discussion across the Quad lately surrounding the position of Guidon Bearer. Apparently (extreme rumor, I have no clue if this is true or not) the Commandant and the CTO's are trying to get away from the "old meaning" of the Guidon and the Guidon Bearer. Right now, I see two sides to the argument:

1) The Guidon should be treated as the most sacred object within the unit, and the GB holds a unique position of prestige above the other pissheads and is the biggest badass who can smoke the crap out of fish and run the fastest and push the most and stuff like that.

2) The culture of only allowing the GB touch the Guidon is stupid and he really isn't supposed to be a super badass smoke-your-balls-off pisshead, but he's the leader of his class and within the outfit as a whole.


Given this discussion, I have a question for old cadets. What was the Guidon culture like back in Old Army? (i.e. Was the Guidon a leader, was he just really good at PT, etc.)

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HollywoodBQ
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12:46a, 5/12/18
AG
Class of '92 B-Company, it was like this.
Most redass fish got picked to be guidon bearer. That guy would usually go on to be 1SG and then Company Commander.

But, there was a guidon candidacy as there was a clerk candidacy. Each group had about 5 guys and one of my buddies was picked for both.

I'm a terrible runner so I had no hope of being picked for guidon bearer. But, as a guidon candidate, I was allowed to touch the guidon.

The guidon used to be kept in the closet before they remodeled the dorms but afterwards, the closets weren't tall enough. So, the guidon bearer would lock them to the rack.

In our case, our class's second guidon bearer was roomates with the Corps Bugler who was pretty ******d out as a cadet. The Corps Bugler guy kept touching the guidon - pretty much just to piss us off.

So, me and another guidon candidate who retires from the Army in August after 25 years, built a box to put the guidon in so other folks couldn't touch it. Imagine a six foot + four sided wooden box that fit the guidon inside. The guidon bearer took it home and got out his wood-burning tool and carved B-Company StreetFighters into the case.

When I met up with the B-Company cadets who were the ODs for the Colorado game in Boulder where we got our butts kicked - circa 2005, they told me that our guidon case was now called the sarco****us. I chuckled. Especially since I've been to Tutankhamen's tomb in The Valley of The Kings.

Anyway, for things like Bloody Cross, you needed more than one guidon bearer.

Also, when my buddies had drum and bugle corps, I had to carry the guidon because I was the only reedsucker who was a guidon candidate.

The guidon candidacy had a lot more than just extra inspections and PT. We had additional guidon cush we had to memorize.
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bigtruckguy3500
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7:53a, 5/12/18
It seems kinda dumb to me to pick a guidon solely on their PT ability. Because then, as I saw multiple times, you get guidons that fail out either halfway through the year, or don't come back as butts.

From my understanding, "back in the day" probably in the 70's, maybe earlier, guidon used to just be a job. It wasn't necessarily a position of prestige like it is today, and it wasn't a sacred object that only the guidon or guidon candidates could touch. Don't know if that's at all true or not though.

Not sure when it changed, but the current system may be a hold over from the late 80's into the 90's when there was a bigger emphasis on just "being hard," if you will. Even if that mean't coming at the expense of academics, PT and general toughness was emphasized over school.

I think picking a well rounded cadet that can be a good leader and role model is probably more important than focusing just on PT. They certainly need to be able to PT, but they no longer even high port, so running with the guidon isn't that hard. It's the symbol of the unit, so it should be carried by someone that can represent that unit well.

At the end of the day, I think the unit should still decide who gets the post. But a culture shift to where we promote cadets that are strong physically, academically, and with good leadership skills is better than what we had when I was there.
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74OA
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12:29p, 5/12/18
AG
In my day, the gb was simply a sharp pisshead who did the best job handling the guidon during competitive tryouts and outfit runs. If you couldn't snap that baby around in high winds, for instance, you weren't going to be selected no matter how otherwise squared away you were. PT of itself had zero to do with it. As for being "sacred", of course no one in another outfit would dare touch another outfit's guidon without warfare ensuing and it was kept secure, but we all held it for the gb at one time or another when necessary.
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Trident 88
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7:09a, 5/13/18
AG
In my outfit, the guidon bearer was a sharp pisshead who handled the guidon the best during tryouts. They were judged most likely to do the best job and look good during march-ins. That's it.

During PT, the pissheads took turns running with the guidon once/if the guidon bearer got tired. We were all allowed to touch it, as we should have been.
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mrad85
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In reply to Trident 88 • 12:35p, 5/15/18
AG
Trident 88 said:
In my outfit, the guidon bearer was a sharp pisshead who handled the guidon the best during tryouts. They were judged most likely to do the best job and look good during march-ins. That's it.

During PT, the pissheads took turns running with the guidon once/if the guidon bearer got tired. We were all allowed to touch it, as we should have been.

Pretty much the same with our guidon. Although, I never, ever recall our guidon bearer getting tired and having to hand it off. He was a sharp dude and a Running machine.
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Fly Army 97
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4:55a, 5/16/18
I had to visit most of the GB in the Corps during our try outs. It was really the first time during my time at A&M I got to see different view points on leadership. Some dudes talked to me about how they hold themselves to a certain standard and how they did it. Some smoked, me, but everyone invested in the time I spent going to visit. I still have the 3X5 card they all signed.

I wouldn't label the GB as the sharpest dude, since it was a volunteer. They were expected to be sharp and an example to fish when it came to being a basic cadet. In hindsight, we took it too seriously. Blasphemy...I know.

I never dropped it or handed it off ...that I can remember. High porting sucked in the winter. I could not feel my hands after a run.
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Wildman15
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In reply to HollywoodBQ • 5:46p, 5/16/18
AG
HollywoodBQ said:
Class of '92 B-Company, it was like this.
Most redass fish got picked to be guidon bearer. That guy would usually go on to be 1SG and then Company Commander.

But, there was a guidon candidacy as there was a clerk candidacy. Each group had about 5 guys and one of my buddies was picked for both.

I'm a terrible runner so I had no hope of being picked for guidon bearer. But, as a guidon candidate, I was allowed to touch the guidon.

The guidon used to be kept in the closet before they remodeled the dorms but afterwards, the closets weren't tall enough. So, the guidon bearer would lock them to the rack.

In our case, our class's second guidon bearer was roomates with the Corps Bugler who was pretty ******d out as a cadet. The Corps Bugler guy kept touching the guidon - pretty much just to piss us off.

So, me and another guidon candidate who retires from the Army in August after 25 years, built a box to put the guidon in so other folks couldn't touch it. Imagine a six foot + four sided wooden box that fit the guidon inside. The guidon bearer took it home and got out his wood-burning tool and carved B-Company StreetFighters into the case.

When I met up with the B-Company cadets who were the ODs for the Colorado game in Boulder where we got our butts kicked - circa 2005, they told me that our guidon case was now called the sarco****us. I chuckled. Especially since I've been to Tutankhamen's tomb in The Valley of The Kings.

Anyway, for things like Bloody Cross, you needed more than one guidon bearer.

Also, when my buddies had drum and bugle corps, I had to carry the guidon because I was the only reedsucker who was a guidon candidate.

The guidon candidacy had a lot more than just extra inspections and PT. We had additional guidon cush we had to memorize.

B-Batt '15. The guidon was pretty much treated the same way in my time as it was yours. Only the past and present guidon bearers could touch the guidon, as well as every Zip in the outfit.
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Ordhound04
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11:13p, 5/18/18
AG
In my day, 2000-2004, every outfit did things different.

In my outfit, it was the top fish who tried out for Guidon, only about 3 or 4 from my class of 11-12 tried out. All pissheads could touch, hold, or handle it, but only the Guidon bearer could carry it at all formations.

As a fish, touching the Guidon was a smoking at 1600 for the whole class. Butts and Zips who touched it, who were not former Guidon bearers got their head shaved. Butt year we pushed one of our buddies into the Guidon 2-3 times.
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CT'97
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In reply to Trident 88 • 8:47a, 5/19/18
AG
Trident 88 said:
In my outfit, the guidon bearer was a sharp pisshead who handled the guidon the best during tryouts. They were judged most likely to do the best job and look good during march-ins. That's it.

During PT, the pissheads took turns running with the guidon once/if the guidon bearer got tired. We were all allowed to touch it, as we should have been.
That changed as some point and it turned into a 1/2 semester long PT fest. Whoever was left standing was deemed most worthy and got the guidon. The pissheads did share it and it was carried by several classmates throughout run's and rarely at an morning or evening formation.
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AGGies0311
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3:06p, 5/21/18
Spider D's guidon, Slimp, was a badass.... I remember them being the hardest mother suckers on the quad.
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Rabid Cougar
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11:29a, 5/22/18
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S-2 '86. Only us Pissheads handled the Guide On. No one else was allowed to do so. The guide on bearer was the sharpest fish and had his sh8t squared away. He generally wasn't the best PT machine, but not far from the best. Selection was based upon a tryout with a guide on staff, a uniform inspection, an interview and then academic performance. You were not required to try out but strongly encouraged.

Guide On bearers went on to be First Sergeant and subsequently Company CO.
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DevilD77
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12:14p, 5/23/18
AG
During my time at A&M in my company, any fish could try out for guidon bearer. It was a rugged competition that eventually selected the fish who could best handle the stick while also being sharp as hell both in appearance and knowledge. My classes guidon bearer did not go on to be 1sgt or Commander but he did end up as guidon bearer for the Cav.

During fish year, after a function (march to chow, march in, review, etc where the guidon was present but the unit did not march back to the quad, the guidon bearer gave the guidon to the fish class to protect and to return it to the guidon bearer's hole. At chow this sucked because the guidon bearer would select a fish, stick the guidon in the back of that fish's chair and have the fish sit back securing the guidon in place. This made eating "square corners" all the more difficult because instead of being perched on the front of your chair and able to lean forward a little bit to protect from having food fall in your lap, you had to keep your back up against the chair back and bring the food over your lap. Also, if the guidon bearer wasn't in his hole when you got back, you and your buddies had to protect the guidon until he finally got back.

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Get Off My Lawn
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In reply to HollywoodBQ • 11:10p, 5/23/18
HollywoodBQ said:
Class of '92 B-Company, it was like this.
Most redass fish got picked to be guidon bearer. That guy would usually go on to be 1SG and then Company Commander.

But, there was a guidon candidacy as there was a clerk candidacy. Each group had about 5 guys and one of my buddies was picked for both.

I'm a terrible runner so I had no hope of being picked for guidon bearer. But, as a guidon candidate, I was allowed to touch the guidon.

The guidon used to be kept in the closet before they remodeled the dorms but afterwards, the closets weren't tall enough. So, the guidon bearer would lock them to the rack.

In our case, our class's second guidon bearer was roomates with the Corps Bugler who was pretty ******d out as a cadet. The Corps Bugler guy kept touching the guidon - pretty much just to piss us off.

So, me and another guidon candidate who retires from the Army in August after 25 years, built a box to put the guidon in so other folks couldn't touch it. Imagine a six foot + four sided wooden box that fit the guidon inside. The guidon bearer took it home and got out his wood-burning tool and carved B-Company StreetFighters into the case.

When I met up with the B-Company cadets who were the ODs for the Colorado game in Boulder where we got our butts kicked - circa 2005, they told me that our guidon case was now called the sarco****us. I chuckled. Especially since I've been to Tutankhamen's tomb in The Valley of The Kings.

Anyway, for things like Bloody Cross, you needed more than one guidon bearer.

Also, when my buddies had drum and bugle corps, I had to carry the guidon because I was the only reedsucker who was a guidon candidate.

The guidon candidacy had a lot more than just extra inspections and PT. We had additional guidon cush we had to memorize.

Two additions from a fellow Streetfighter:
A) it got a bit silly by '05 with fish being told that they couldn't look at the box and therefore backing into the room if they had cause to come by.
B) real men high ported (ehich i hear isnt allowed anymore) the whole way. Bloody cross. West campus band runs. If the unit could take the run, you took it too. Besides; the other pissheads should be busy rotating through the tougher to carry award flag(s).
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HollywoodBQ
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In reply to Get Off My Lawn • 5:34a, 5/24/18
AG
Get Off My Lawn said:
Two additions from a fellow Streetfighter:
A) it got a bit silly by '05 with fish being told that they couldn't look at the box and therefore backing into the room if they had cause to come by.
B) real men high ported (ehich i hear isnt allowed anymore) the whole way. Bloody cross. West campus band runs. If the unit could take the run, you took it too. Besides; the other pissheads should be busy rotating through the tougher to carry award flag(s).
Couldn't look at the box that I built. That's funny. Also dumb.

Award Flags - Ha! With my class's fish retention of 13/30 = 43%, we weren't going to win any awards.
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Aggie Infantry
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12:40p, 5/24/18
AG
Stick Dick
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