How do we encourage current cadets to make this their Corps and stop trying to make it our Corps?

It seems to me that a lot of the issues stem from current cadets trying to make things "Old Army." Instead they end up bring back things that were done away with for a reason. Instead we need to encourage them to come up with new things that accomplish the same goals but aren't bad for them or the Corps as a whole.

NJ75AGfdt & bigtruckguy, thanks for clearing that up for me.

Found another good video of a platoon drill.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jtRuKmDMfXY&feature=related


I can't figure out if this the '95 team or the '98 team. I tried to get a good look at some of the faces at the end but couldn't tell.

I used to have a great video of the squad and platoon basic drills from our national title meet in Illinois. The platoon exhibition that year was just before the Marine Corps Silent Dril Team exhibition.

CT '97 that is the best way I have ever seen it stated.

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It seems to me that a lot of the issues stem from current cadets trying to make things "Old Army."

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It's mostly pissheads in my opinion. For some reason they all think that they are the guardians of Old Army, and that the Corps got weak as soon as they walked second pass.

And while some "Old Army" things were done away with, a lot just never existed except in Aggie myths and lore.

RAMF, I think that video is class of '98.

The FDT was in the front portion of "A Few Good Men" wearing marine uni's. Did the film industry fly the FDT to Washington and JAG Hq's to shoot the scene, or was it shot and transferred to the film? Anyone know?

OCEN99;
Anytime. That was an experience I will never do again, but was glad to do it!

HajiKii;
Peoples reputations are at stake...I agree with truck guy. This is not a place to speculate or type that much. One can argue I typed too much.

"It is better to trust in the LORD than to put confidence in man," Psalm 118:8.


[This message has been edited by NJ75AGfdt (edited 10/31/2011 4:46p).]

FDT was supposed to film that scene on the grounds of the Naval Academy. I believe the Naval Academy said no dice. I remember being told that they ended up filming on the grounds of a mental institution instead. I don't recall the details. But they were flown out to DC, put up in a hotel, I think AFFDTM was paid 10,000, and they were sent bayonets to practice with before going up there.

For those interested, here is a little bit of FDT history from a bunch of personal accounts from the 2007 reunion: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2563484/FDT%20History%20-%20REUNION%2007%20Compilation.pdf

Edit: I believe it was St. Elizabeth's Hospital in DC.

[This message has been edited by bigtruckguy3500 (edited 10/31/2011 8:28p).]

Thanx truckguy.

"It is better to trust in the LORD than to put confidence in man," Psalm 118:8.

I wasn't an fdt guy, but I always thought the RV's had sharper, crisper drill and way better looking uniforms. Fdt wasn't bad though.

^that has to be a troll.

Agreed. FDT was/is sharper at drill than RV's and this is coming from a former RV who didn't do FDT.

RV = Good Humor

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FDT was supposed to film that scene on the grounds of the Naval Academy. I believe the Naval Academy said no dice.

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I believe it was supposed to be filmed at the Barracks at 8th & I where the Marine Corps silent drill team is garrisoned but because of the ethically lapsed character of Col Jessup the Marine Corps would not allow it to be filmed at the barracks. I knew several of the AFFDTM that were in the opening scene of A Few Good Men. As I recall they said they were flown to D.C. by the producers of the movie, paid a stipend, and had food catered to the set.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IjLyz8OAj1s

EGA; you have your opinion. I can tell you FDT members used to look at the RV's as drill "wanna-bees" (they may still). They are the TX gov's ceremonial body guard. A Fish Drill Teamer or former drill teamer can pick apart RV's drill unmercifully. The main function of RV's is not to drill, but FDT's is to drill.

"It is better to trust in the LORD than to put confidence in man," Psalm 118:8.

[This message has been edited by NJ75AGfdt (edited 11/2/2011 6:29a).]

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ethically lapsed character of Col Jessup

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Ethically lapsed?

What is this? What's going on? He did his job!

I read the accounts. I drilled very close to one of the '75ers' mentioned. Another stated we won by 0.6 of a point out of a thousand. He wasn't kidding; 923.2 was our score, and the next one was 922.6. He also stated three weapons hit the floor; I remember 4 and we had not done our hardest throwing move yet when all weapons were in the air. We nailed that throw.

We won Nationals by "perfecting" the one part of our drill that always ate our lunch: The Ripple! The advisors told us that our Ripple that day was the best one they'd ever seen!

The drill meet was in the National Guard Armory, and the floor sounded "hollow." When we did a Ripple move, it rat-a-tat-tat-tatted on the floor in near perfect cadence!

"It is better to trust in the LORD than to put confidence in man," Psalm 118:8.


[This message has been edited by NJ75AGfdt (edited 11/2/2011 12:54p).]

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What is this? What's going on? He did his job!

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Well played.

The RVs have never been a drill team, they are, and always have been, the Governor's Honor Guard - not body guard.

Why not disband the Corps for the FDT hazing, mistakes, whatever? Or we could try something more military (we are training for the military, right?) and hold the guilty ones accountable or fire the senior adviser. Whomever made this decision is an idiot. There are always enough not guilty members who could be advisers to the team.

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it involves a pissed off ex-gf.

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100% accurate and the situation really pisses me off. I'm somewhat related to the matter and of course won't say why. Though, if I ever meet that *****, I'll go raging pisshead on her.

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This comes from my buddy, who isn't in FDT, but this is what he heard. (More hear-say.) One of the fish had a cable on his collar, and so one of the Hounds or some other guy out there with a lighter used it to burn it off. In the process they burned part of his face as well, to the point that it was significantly noticeable. Not sure if it was intentional, or even a true story.

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Also accurate, not hear-say. My understanding is that it was not intentional as they were preparing for a drill before a football game (or something like that).

JR69;
Thanx...forgot but reminded.

"It is better to trust in the LORD than to put confidence in man," Psalm 118:8.

It was classes of 94,93, and 92. They basically took the best from each class to for A Few Good Men.

The fish weren't ready. They drilled for a few weeks prior to going up.

CT97;
Been thinkin' about your statement making it our corps vs. theirs. From the FDT's POV, our advisors never did any of the info I described above. From class of '75 POV, the new cadets are not trying to copy us.

"It is better to trust in the LORD than to put confidence in man," Psalm 118:8.

Can someone tell me what type of drill they perform? What I mean, what service branch has the most influence to basic drill commands and marching style. Thanx.

"It is better to trust in the LORD than to put confidence in man," Psalm 118:8.

NJ75,

What CT97 is referring to is the current cadets have a huge misperception of what is, and what isn't, "Old Army." And most of the problem is in the middle leadership, the pissheads. The pissheads pass on their stupidity to the fish, and when the pissheads become whitebelts and become a little smarter, the new pissheads think the new whitebelts are just going soft. So the new pissheads have to do their job to keep old army alive and do stupid stuff. Not always true, but too often it is.

Also, FDT is largely influenced by the Marines these days. For Tulane they use the Marine drill manual, they are sponsored by the NROTC, and they somewhat try to emulate the silent drill team - precision drill and attention to detail that isn't necessarily fancy.

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and they somewhat try to emulate the silent drill team - precision drill and attention to detail that isn't necessarily fancy.

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That's a shame. FDT has a heritage that would allow them to be the drill that others would emulate. The Silent Drill Team is good but in many respects they play it safe and don't push the limits. That video of FDT in the early 1970s is drill at a level that no does in the 21st century.

Thanx for the info BigTruckGuy.

"It is better to trust in the LORD than to put confidence in man," Psalm 118:8.

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That's a shame. FDT has a heritage that would allow them to be the drill that others would emulate. The Silent Drill Team is good but in many respects they play it safe and don't push the limits. That video of FDT in the early 1970s is drill at a level that no does in the 21st century.

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Three things have to change for FDT to return to that video of the 70's FDT.

1) The advisors need to get better & more focuesed at teaching, and focus less on making themselves look hard & intense infront of the fish
2) Outfits need to quit making their fish quit FDT
3) FDT needs more practice time

From what I observed your right on truck guy.

"It is better to trust in the LORD than to put confidence in man," Psalm 118:8.

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1) The advisors need to get better & more focuesed at teaching, and focus less on making themselves look hard & intense infront of the fish
2) Outfits need to quit making their fish quit FDT
3) FDT needs more practice time

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This ^^ is sensible and logical and correct.

However, there is this undercurrent, in from the 'college of military science' side of things, that seems more focused on hitting a 2100, 2200 member Corps. And, with more regard to the quantity than to the quality of those numbers (and any polka-dot, neuter, differently-able, native Antarcticans would be more than welcome).

Which is where we (especially 'we' here) see these odd-ball "kinder, gentler" corps [lower case 'c' on purpose] things cropping up.

To my thinking, it did not help things, when, the FDT was reformed, that the advisers were allowed to wear both cords AND ribbons. Call me old-fashioned (ok, Bob Masrhall and Woody Ratliff lived across the hall from me, fish year "old fashioned" but, in days of old, you had to earn that ribbon.

Letting the kids slide on these things is not the best idea.

The "institutional memory" of any college thing is short enough, around 7 years for FDT & the Corps. You bring in upperclassman advisors who have no actual memories of how things "used to be' and that's where things start to diverge.

And, in some fairness, the U could have done a better job with infrastructure. Like not maintaining the supply of drill rifles. Or the uniform machinations the U has committed in recent years.

But, I'm clearly biased.

capn--
Does or did the FDT still drill with Springfields 1903-A3's? That was our practice and drill weapon. I remember in our day a supply of these weapons was harder to find almost daily.

"It is better to trust in the LORD than to put confidence in man," Psalm 118:8.

[This message has been edited by NJ75AGfdt (edited 11/7/2011 12:57a).]

They still use 1903A3 Drill Rifles.

But, apparently--and this is hearsay, if from sources I believe--during the hiatus, the "good" ones for show wound up in other drilling units. And, the good ones for practice also wound up elsewhere.

This is also why the color guards do not all have matching rifles, too. Allegedly. One of the Color Guard units has M-1 Garand rifles.

Now, Drill rifles are available--DCM has them; 1903's and 1917's both--but, that would require someone in the procurement process to be swufter than recent events seems to indicate.

But, I'm biased in that, too. The "running shoe" 'rough-out' boots the cadets get with ACU's . . .

Couple quick points.

While I would agree that there is a big push for quantity at the moment, I don't think it is mutually exclusive of quality. It all comes down to training. I was talking to a buddy, and we both feel that we don't really hear good things coming out of the Corps (from cadets at least), except that it's big.

The first FDT fish class after reinstatement voted for the advisors to be able to wear the cord and ribbon.

Certain good rifles definitely went missing. And a certain saber named after a certain FDT member from '82 was also taken during that time and used by another unit.

FDT is definitely running into issues with rifles breaking. Especially practice rifles. They are currently held together with duct tape and electrical tape more so than actual parts. And there are a few parts of the show rifles that are running low, like upperhand guards. Although this may have changed in the few years since I've been out. But I doubt it. From the looks of things no one has any initiative any more to get anything done.

Taping or rigging practice weapons due to breakage is not new. We also had those issues. The advisors (to my recollection) fixed or worked on and made broken practice weapons workable and safe. We would not have drilled with an unsafe weapon. An unsafe weapon was retired and used to replace worn pieces on other weapons.

"It is better to trust in the LORD than to put confidence in man," Psalm 118:8.

[This message has been edited by NJ75AGfdt (edited 11/8/2011 6:02p).]