My 90 home subdivision with an HOA has a fence requirement that all fencing should be black iron style and that no wood fencing is allowed. There is one home in the neighborhood that predated the HOA and the restrictions. That home has had a wooden fence for 15 years. When I was on the HOA board, the homeowner needed to replace some poles. At that time we reviewed what could be done to bring the fence into compliance and ultimately discovered there were no records of a "grandfathered" letter being sent to the homeowner. So the HOA decided that the fence could be repaired because it was significantly the same fence. However, now with the recent storms the homeowner has torn the entire fence down and intends to rebuild a brand new wood fence. I am no longer on the board. When the HOA President reached out to the homeowner, the homeowner stated he would build whatever he wanted to build and he doesn't give a rats a$$ about the HOA.

Should the owner be allowed to install a brand new wood fence or not?

Yes. The current homeowner is not the original owner, current owner signed documents at closing and has been paying dues.

I think this is an exercise in futility. I'd let it ride. He's rebuilding a fence that was previously accepted and agreed on.

Also, what is black iron style? Like you can see through it to your neighbors yard?

Enviroag02 said:

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Yes. The current homeowner is not the original owner, current owner signed documents at closing and has been paying dues.

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Why in the world did the current owner ever agree to do that, and I wonder what those documents actually say? Paying dues isn't good for the homeowner, but it's not the last word on the issue.

Similar issue as to why would you have to get HOA approval to repaint your house the same colors but that is a very typical requirement.

Stupid is as stupid does.

Since the fence was allowed to be repaired and replaced partially as wood fence I think he has a good argument for replacing entire thing with wood.

Also I'm interested to see how the dumbass fence "type" restrictions come into play regarding security, since many of the requirement fences don't do anything for security.

Thunderstruck xx said:

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Enviroag02 said:

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My 90 home subdivision with an HOA has a fence requirement that all fencing should be black iron style and that no wood fencing is allowed. There is one home in the neighborhood that predated the HOA and the restrictions. That home has had a wooden fence for 15 years. When I was on the HOA board, the homeowner needed to replace some poles. At that time we reviewed what could be done to bring the fence into compliance and ultimately discovered there were no records of a "grandfathered" letter being sent to the homeowner. So the HOA decided that the fence could be repaired because it was significantly the same fence. However, now with the recent storms the homeowner has torn the entire fence down and intends to rebuild a brand new wood fence. I am no longer on the board. When the HOA President reached out to the homeowner, the homeowner stated he would build whatever he wanted to build and he doesn't give a rats a$$ about the HOA.

Should the owner be allowed to install a brand new wood fence or not?

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So the HOA decided previously that the fence could be repaired to make it the same fence. It seems like a precedent was set that his fence is allowed. Now he is rebuilding the same fence, or you could say he is significantly repairing all of the same fence. It's obvious the fence was grandfathered in, and it's not his fault the HOA didn't keep a record of this.

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It's the Fence of Theseus.

Out of curious how does an existing home get absorbed by an HOA? Was there compensation? Paperwork?

If a home is built before an HOA is formed, does the exemption from the HOA follow with the property in perpetuity or does the home become subject to the HOA with new ownership if new ownership takes place after the HOA is formed? Also, does this interpretation change if the new owner signs the HOAs CCRs? The home is otherwise in compliance with all other restrictions.

1 - If a repair of "like & kind" was approved, then it's seems bad faith to deny a replace of "like and kind".
2 - To claim that by signing the CCR by a new owner THEN also waived any preexisting grandfathered projects on the property is a stretch. At a minimum it seems the HOA would have had to disclose that to them prior to closing. If they wanted to demo and replace with something other than like and kind, then maybe there is an argument that they have to abide by the CCR and that's a maybe.

Quote:

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If a home is built before an HOA is formed, does the exemption from the HOA follow with the property in perpetuity or does the home become subject to the HOA with new ownership if new ownership takes place after the HOA is formed?

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No, Flip your question in reverse and the same logic does not track.

If a home is built before When an HOA is formed, does the exemption inclusion from the HOA follow with the property in perpetuity or does the home become subject exempt to the HOA with new ownership if new ownership takes place after the HOA is formed?

Moral High Horse said:

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Out of curious how does an existing home get absorbed by an HOA? Was there compensation? Paperwork?

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Owner probably wanted access to HOA facilities like a park or pool or fitness center. HOAs can't be levied onto a property without the owner's consent. And if the owner didn't keep a copy of the grandfathering and it wasn't recorded in county records, it effectively doesn't exist.

[Do not keep trolling or thread derailing attempts going on this board by quoting the post. -Staff]

NOT a lawyer, only an Architect witness to residential developments reporting in

The developers try to sell lot at premium by establishing Deed Restrictions, enforced by their royal ACC to keep up appearances until lots are all sold, profits cashed in. What remains is no further interest in the property, so these DRs pass to homeowner to enforce in a group with property fees via lawyers in future ... sometimes a developer living there will serve on the HOA.

You stated
predated the HOA and the restrictions aka Deed Restrictions & ACC
which suggests the ACC/developers bought his surroundings and allowed his inclusion in the development with whatever gimmees, enhcements, protections there might be, not so obvious ... perhaps even a developer's house in-the-day.

Ergo it follows
No restrictions pre-genesis and beyond
Status quo to him & others inside the developement
Then grandfather, even squatter rights
Suggest no case would stand worth the money fight IF he simply replace that fence in like kind.
I vote no black fence but
IF he replaced the fence with something new/controverisal THEN some law money might be throw at each other getting it tweaked ... not that everyone will be happy thereafter and certainly poorer for it

OnlyForNow said:

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Similar issue as to why would you have to get HOA approval to repaint your house the same colors but that is a very typical requirement.

Stupid is as stupid does.

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Well written bylaws would allow any and all repairs of the same thing to be done without approval.

Our HOA bylaws require no approval for paint, roof, landscaping, windows, etc as long as you are repairing/replacing with the same thing/color/materials.

Ours were written by fools in the early 90s and have never been updated.

OnlyForNow said:

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Ours were written by fools in the early 90s and have never been updated.

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Don't get me wrong, ours were initially written poorly.

But we changed/reworded them to make it easier for homeowners.