I'm going to be putting in a flagstone patio in my back yard, and the ground is far from level. One corner (close to the house) is about 14-16" higher than the opposite corner (away from the house). The ground slopes down along the edge of the house, from one side to the other, and also away from the house towards the fence line.

Considering a moderately sloped patio to meet north of these slopes, I'm looking at needing to lower the high corner near the house by about 12" and it's adjacent corner near the house by 6". Since this is next to the house, I'm not about to just lower the entire grade. I'm planning on keeping a 3' span between the patio and house at the elevation it is currently at and covering it with 3" of pea gravel to eliminate erosion from the drip like of my roof. That means I'll need a retaining wall about 8" to 12" high between this span and the patio. I'm planning on doing this with 4"x6" dry stack limestone on top of a compacted DG base (going to overbuild the base of the patio for the wall) with gravel backfill for drainage. I'm planning to put weed block material between the block and gravel and between the gravel and soil to allow for permeation of water into the gravel for drainage without letting soil disperse into the gravel and clog it up.

My question is, should I try to include some kind of drainage piping, or should I allow for water to flow through the natural gaps in the wall onto the patio? I'm considering using topsoil to lock in the flagstones and planting garden thyme for contrast with the white stone I'm going to use, so erosion would be less of an issue. Water could also follow the natural slope of the undisturbed soil next to the house and to the other side of the yard.

Also, with such a short wall and only 2-3 courses (maybe 4 if I think the high corner needs to go up more to hold gravel), should I bother with soldiers? I'm planning on using solid blocks in the longest lengths I can get, so they'll be pretty heavy, (somewhere in the neighborhood of 75-85 pounds per linear foot, so maybe 150-180 lbs per block). I don't see them sliding around much.

Sould be fine. I've built gravity walls around my parents place. Slope change front to back of their house is upwards of 5 ft. Most of the taller walls were split into two walls up to 2.5ft tall, but there is a small section of 5ft wall near the stairs to the back porch. They're holding up just fine. The stones were diamond sawn limestone 6in x 8in by up to 2ft long. LIke you're using, some heavy blocks.

For your patio stones... Water seal the heck out of the bottoms and sides of the pavers. We built a limestone slab patio and truthfully, we should just tear it out and start over. The stones won't NOT get slimy.

Thanks for the tip! I'll be sure to seal them.

Started excavation today. Should have rented a bobcat or a dingo because my body is killing me. At least I saved the rental/delivery fees. I'll finish excavating and do base tomorrow. Hopefully flag stone and walls on Monday. Good thing I took this week off. Will post before and after pics.

Excavation took a little longer than expected, and I couldn't get DG delivered until today at 3:30. Only got half of it down since I was flying solo after picking my daughter up at daycare at 5:30. It's ok though. I did get a lot of the stone I'll need. I can get the rest down tomorrow after I compact what's there and trim out the first course or two of stone.

Just take your time and get the foundation base leveled and packed as best you can. Everything is established off the base and the better you do getting it level and properly packed, the easier and better the rest of the job will be and stay level throughout the installation process. It's the foundation that counts...everything else after that is gravy!

If you don't believe it, I'll be more than happy to show you 3 retaining walls that were done with level and properly packed bases and another retaining wall across the street that wasn't done in the same fashion by another contractor. Mine is as level as it was when originally installed 10 years later and the one across the street looks very wavy and it was done during the same time frame as mine, but by a contractor that just threw it together as quickly as possible not establishing a proper base...

I believe you. I just got done cleaning up after today. I laid down 4" of DG and compacted it with a plate compactor in 2" lifts with an 1/8"/1' slope for drainage. My wife said it was overkill for a patio, but I know it's necessary.

All of the surrounding stone sits on top of the first lift and is locked in by the second. I'm going to try to lay flag stones tomorrow and finish the walls, but it's supposed to rain tonight and tomorrow morning. That may have to wait until Thursday, but I'd like to finish this sooner rather than later because I go back to work and school next week. I won't have any time to work on this after this weekend, so it needs to get buttoned up pretty quick.

I'm going to back fill behind the walls to the level of the patio, then go up with gravel behind the wall. Water wouldn't have anywhere to go until it soaked into the surrounding soil if it got lower than that, so I figure that's a good way to coax it onto the patio and into the yard.

I've also considered drilling into the blocks and setting some 1/4" rebar in them with murder or something to lock them together. That might actually by overkill for something this small though. It's only a 10x12 patio...

Well, the walls are just about done, and I've got the flag stone laid out. All I need to do now is lay out a layer of sand, set the stones where I have then laid it, add soil between them, and plant elfin thyme in it. That should prevent soil loss while also adding a nice contrast to the white stone. I hear it even smells pretty good and is traffic tolerant.

I also need to tidy up next to the house. I'll be putting down some landscape fabric and putting white pea gravel over it. A lot of the work for this is done, but I need to finish up. I have to take tomorrow off to go see the in-laws, but I'm hoping Sunday will give me enough time to finish.

Almost done with this project. I just need to lay sand, then flagstones, then soil and plants. A few solid hours of work should do it. The gravel and walls around the house look great, and I'm really happy with how they turned out. I'm seriously considering adding a cedar post or two to hang some string lights from, but that's a project for later.

Got it. Here's what it looks like now.


You can see the flag stone laid out in the side yard. I need to do a little more some trimming on the walls, but those are just for looks and can wait.

I also need to get a bunch of rocks and crap out of my yard, as you can tell.


This was the area before we did much work to it. You can see the cement covered foam panels that were laid down as a "patio" stacked ok the background. There were also a bunch of random bricks, a railroad tie or two, and some treated 4x4's. There also used to be cast in place steps that are out of frame. Those were jackhammered out before the deck went in. You can also see where the skim coat on the foundation used to meet the ground and how much soil was lost. We built it back up to that point before adding the deck and patio.

I hope you remembered some sort of weed barrier or you'll be fighting weeds forever.

I did. Multi-layered in some places.