Embarrassed to ask this, but proper way to read a pin sheet.

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TXAGGIES
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2:41p, 9/3/24
We have all seen these in tournaments before. I always assumed the 7 and 12 were from the farthest point of the green left or right and closest (shortest front edge) of the green?

In the below colored picture, if the pin was closer to say, 25, would the 7 become 5 since at that depth the green is 5 paces? or would it still be 7 as that is from the widest point?
I feel like I should know this but question myself all the time.




T.I.A
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cablinaggie
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2:57p, 9/3/24
AG
underlined number on bottom left is total paces of green front to back. Halfway is 16 paces, so flag is -9 paces from the middle of the green (hence the -9).

"12" means 12 paces from right edge
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TXAGGIES
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2:59p, 9/3/24
I understand the 12 and 7, but more of a reference point to start those paces from.

12 paces from the right edge

meaning at that pin depth or from the farthest right point of the green?
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TXAGGIES
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3:07p, 9/3/24
said another way, should you always start with the depth number first, and at the point you have # of paces to the edge of the green?
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cablinaggie
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3:23p, 9/3/24
AG
I'm more worried about distance. If I know I'm 103 yards to the middle and depth is 32 that means I need to hit it at least 87 yards to get it on. That could be 3 different clubs depending on the conditions. As far as right and left measurements I only worry about those if there's a bunker or water on that side. I generally try to play to the middle of the green.
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TXAGGIES
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In reply to cablinaggie • 3:33p, 9/3/24
cablinaggie said:
I'm more worried about distance. If I know I'm 103 yards to the middle and depth is 32 that means I need to hit it at least 87 yards to get it on. That could be 3 different clubs depending on the conditions. As far as right and left measurements I only worry about those if there's a bunker or water on that side. I generally try to play to the middle of the green.
Understood, but I am trying to mark up a green book with the pin locations to look where the proper miss it, where is the uphill least "red", but trying to figure out where the pin would be as exact as possible.

with this hypothetical green below.

Lets say the Pin sheet shows 12 on, 10 to the left. Where is that pin. Is it 10 on from the front ride side of the green, just above the red shade and 10 yards from the left edge so almost the point where the yellow meet the orange? I am assuming each solid line is 5 yards.

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Poot
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3:35p, 9/3/24
I think I know what you're asking. The left/right # is from the edge of the green directly right or left of the hole location (not from the widest part of the green).
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TXAGGIES
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In reply to Poot • 3:38p, 9/3/24
Poot said:
I think I know what you're asking. The left/right # is from the edge of the green directly right or left of the hole location (not from the widest part of the green).
Yes, ok, so you must do depth first. Thanks.
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Poot
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In reply to TXAGGIES • 3:41p, 9/3/24
Correct. Depth 1st.
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AggieDruggist89
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4:21p, 9/3/24
AG
Hole #7:

  • Green is 32 yards deep
  • Pin is 7 yards from the front of the green
  • That's -9 yards from the Center
  • Pin is 12 yards from the right edge of the green


Hole #2

  • Green is 27 yards deep
  • Pin is 18 yards from the front of the green
  • The pin is 7 yards from the left edge of the green
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TXAGGIES
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In reply to AggieDruggist89 • 4:59p, 9/3/24
AggieDruggist89 said:
Hole #7:

  • Green is 32 yards deep
  • Pin is 7 yards from the front of the green
  • That's -9 yards from the Center
  • Pin is 12 yards from the right edge of the green


Hole #2

  • Green is 27 yards deep
  • Pin is 18 yards from the front of the green
  • The pin is 7 yards from the left edge of the green

Again I understand what they mean, it was more of where the the basis for front of the green when the green isn't a perfect circle.
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Poot
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5:44p, 9/3/24
The depth # is from the extreme front of the green (not how much green there is right on line. For instance, the pin could be 12 on but only 5 over a bunker.
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concac
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In reply to Poot • 6:22p, 9/3/24
AG
Poot said:
The depth # is from the extreme front of the green (not how much green there is right on line. For instance, the pin could be 12 on but only 5 over a bunker.



I'm assuming the total depth of the green is measured with the y axis where the two points intersect the green.

So let's assume the pin is located somewhere in the bottom right quadrant. So would you step off 7 paces from the point where the y axis intersects with the front of the green?
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TXAGGIES
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6:35p, 9/3/24
That's kinda what I am asking. Depending on that starting point the pin could be in different locations with similar pin sheet numbers
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Poot
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6:47p, 9/3/24
The starting point for depth is always the extreme front of the green.

I drew a yellow line on the bottom pic where all depths would be measured from.

So if the pin is on the right, you could have a 15 for the pin depth, but only have 7-8 paces of green over the bunker to the hole.
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TXAGGIES
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8:03p, 9/3/24
So hypothetically you could have a pin on the right which is 22 paces from the front but in reality only 6 paces on?
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Poot
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In reply to TXAGGIES • 7:33a, 9/4/24
TXAGGIES said:
So hypothetically you could have a pin on the right which is 22 paces from the front but in reality only 6 paces on?


Correct.
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southtexasgolfpro00
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8:30a, 9/4/24
AG
They are marked from the farthest front edge of the green and either farthest right or left edge of the green.
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TXAGGIES
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In reply to southtexasgolfpro00 • 8:32a, 9/4/24
southtexasgolfpro00 said:
They are marked from the farthest front edge of the green and either farthest right or left edge of the green.
If this is correct, I am good.
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southtexasgolfpro00
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In reply to TXAGGIES • 9:46a, 9/4/24
AG
This is how I have done mine at the club for years and that is how they've been done in all the events I have played in over the last 30ish years.
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TXAGGIES
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In reply to southtexasgolfpro00 • 9:56a, 9/4/24
southtexasgolfpro00 said:
This is how I have done mine at the club for years and that is how they've been done in all the events I have played in over the last 30ish years.


So on a green book, I could create a right angle at the low point of the green and farthest point right or left. Then take the paces on and left or right off those right angle lines and be pretty solid.
We got all 3 days in advance so planning out now!
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southtexasgolfpro00
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In reply to TXAGGIES • 10:41a, 9/4/24
AG
That is correct. 7 from the right could only mean 3 or 4 from the right edge depending on where the hole location is and 22 on could only mean 3 or 4 from the front depending on where the hole location is.

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Turf-Ag02
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10:48a, 9/4/24
AG
Most greens books have a point marked on the green where the "front" of the green is, such as this one does.
Gig ‘em and God bless
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TXAGGIES
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2:29p, 9/4/24
Ok. Final Question.

Looking at the heat map green, there is a P with a circle around it which is front edge.

So if the it showed 17 on (or -2 from center) and the pin was on the left edge of the blue shading on the right hand side of the green, would it show 6 from the right or some number to the extreme edge of the green?

I think it would show 17 and 6???


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southtexasgolfpro00
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4:00p, 9/4/24
AG
It would be 6 from the far-right side of the green.
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Poot
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In reply to southtexasgolfpro00 • 6:22p, 9/4/24
southtexasgolfpro00 said:
They are marked from the farthest front edge of the green and either farthest right or left edge of the green.


I don't think this is correct as far as the left/right. I always saw them with the left/right going 90* over to the edge of the green. (Unlike the front/back number)

Example… if the green is shaped like an hourglass (skinny in the middle, wider at the front and back), then it would tell you how much green you have directly right or left of the hole location (not from the wider points of the green in the front or back).

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Poot
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In reply to TXAGGIES • 6:26p, 9/4/24
The way I've always seen them, the left/right is not from the far edge. It tells you how far it is from the edge of the green at the particular depth.
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TXAGGIES
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In reply to Poot • 6:28p, 9/4/24
Poot said:
The way I've always seen them, the left/right is not from the far edge. It tells you how far it is from the edge of the green at the particular depth.

And this is why I asked the question.

I'll report back after my tournament. Maybe it depends on who makes the pin sheets
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AggieDruggist89
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10:21a, 9/5/24
AG
Aight.

I had to actually think about this as I never ever thought about it other than just clock it with my rangefinder.
But I had to draw this out.

IMO, Depth is the front most point of the green to the back most point of the green from the center of the fairway marked by A & B but measured vertically (looking from above the green) (Y axis) and not diagonally. Width even though is measured on x axis, the pin placement sheet doesn't use the widest points rather the edge of the green on the parallel line from the x axis. get it?

So pin placement X is 13 yards deep vertically from the front most edge of the green but only 5 yards right of the edge of the green. Pin placement Y is 7 yards deep (3 yards short of the center of the green (vertically) and 5 yards left of the edge of the green.

I just measure the pin then the front edge of the green (not the front most point) direct line of my ball flight to see what it takes to get the ball on the green.

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TXAGGIES
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In reply to AggieDruggist89 • 3:00p, 9/5/24
AggieDruggist89 said:
Aight.

I had to actually think about this as I never ever thought about it other than just clock it with my rangefinder.
But I had to draw this out.

IMO, Depth is the front most point of the green to the back most point of the green from the center of the fairway marked by A & B but measured vertically (looking from above the green) (Y axis) and not diagonally. Width even though is measured on x axis, the pin placement sheet doesn't use the widest points rather the edge of the green on the parallel line from the x axis. get it?

So pin placement X is 13 yards deep vertically from the front most edge of the green but only 5 yards right of the edge of the green. Pin placement Y is 7 yards deep (3 yards short of the center of the green (vertically) and 5 yards left of the edge of the green.

I just measure the pin then the front edge of the green (not the front most point) direct line of my ball flight to see what it takes to get the ball on the green.

Thats how I think it is as well, but others told me, its always extreme's.
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AggieDruggist89
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In reply to TXAGGIES • 3:46p, 9/5/24
AG
Consulting my pro. His dad is a journey man PGA and Champions Tour pro. So we agree on the depth. But the question is will the pin sheet show 12 yards from left or 7 yards from left.

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TXAGGIES
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4:02p, 9/5/24
Need to ask the journeyman caddie, they do all the work
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AggieDruggist89
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In reply to TXAGGIES • 4:02p, 9/5/24
AG
TXAGGIES said:
Need to ask the journeyman caddie, they do all the work


I did. Our Pro caddies for dad. Of course the first response from the group is a picture of a bear holding the pin.
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CapCity12thMan
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In reply to TXAGGIES • 6:46p, 9/5/24
AG
Left or right measurement is the pin high measurement to edge of green
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Poot
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In reply to AggieDruggist89 • 7:42p, 9/5/24
AggieDruggist89 said:
Aight.

I had to actually think about this as I never ever thought about it other than just clock it with my rangefinder.
But I had to draw this out.

IMO, Depth is the front most point of the green to the back most point of the green from the center of the fairway marked by A & B but measured vertically (looking from above the green) (Y axis) and not diagonally. Width even though is measured on x axis, the pin placement sheet doesn't use the widest points rather the edge of the green on the parallel line from the x axis. get it?

So pin placement X is 13 yards deep vertically from the front most edge of the green but only 5 yards right of the edge of the green. Pin placement Y is 7 yards deep (3 yards short of the center of the green (vertically) and 5 yards left of the edge of the green.

I just measure the pin then the front edge of the green (not the front most point) direct line of my ball flight to see what it takes to get the ball on the green.



This is correct.
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