Title says it. I have a strong grip and my irons fly fine. My driver has become the lowest snap hook imaginable.

I've watched 2 school of golf episodes on eliminating a hook and I've done those drills with about 200 range ball so far. The driver is starting to straighten out, fly higher, and sometimes even fade/slice.

Bad thing is, when I grab an iron... my irons are starting to slice/fade pretty bad. If I go back to my stronger grip, the irons fly fine again.

So here's my major question. Is the driver such a different club that it requires a different grip/approach than the irons? Does my whole swing need revamping?


Here's a video. This drive was a waist high snap hook.


http://youtu.be/tq_JpO6Xxok


Also, one thing I am going to start trying to do on drives is to move my left thumb (I'm Left Handed) on top of the club. This forces my left hand to not be as involved. This feels like I lose a lot of control of the club though.

I had this exact issue a few years ago. Took a lesson from a friend (actual golf pro) for the problem. She told me my stance was getting to straight up for the driver. Bent over a little more and the problem was gone.

I had this problem too. i realized i had too much weight on my toes at address.

[This message has been edited by Harry Stone (edited 3/17/2014 10:41a).]

Kjodie - I too had the same issue with the driver recently. I was standing too close to the ball at address. As soon as I moved back about an inch or two from the ball, magic started to happen. No more snap hooks and better, longer ball flight.

Is the driver swing a completely different animal from an iron swing?

Pete - No, it's not completely different. But you've got to stand further away from the ball at address because the driver is so much longer than an iron. I can't speak for others, but I don't try and hit down on the ball like I do with an iron. I think about hitting thru the ball to sweep it off the tee.

Pete - After watching the video, it appears that your right shoulder is not square at address. I had the same problem with my left shoulder since I'm right handed. My left shoulder would be wide open and pointing left of the target line. This caused me to either block the shot right or pull hook it left. Correcting this helped straighten me out quite a bit.

It may seem very awkward at first, but try to align both shoulders with the target line. Your shoulders, hips, knees and feet should all be aligned with the target unless you are attempting to draw or fade the shot.

[This message has been edited by 93MarineHorn (edited 3/17/2014 11:46a).]

Thanks Marine!

Your welcome, Pete. If this doesn't help you should get a lesson. I would NOT watch videos or tv shows on Golf channel for specific swing advice. I would only take general advice from those types of instructional mediums. Specific advice may not work depending on several factors, and you could likely make things worse or cause problems in other areas of your game where none previously existed (like with your irons). Only an instructor can diagnose any flaws and give you the appropriate "fix". jmo

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I had this exact issue a few years ago. Took a lesson from a friend (actual golf pro) for the problem. She told me my stance was getting to straight up for the driver. Bent over a little more and the problem was gone.

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This was my problem on and off I recently realized. Bending just a tad bit more at the knees and tilting my back a little more as well and it has helped quite a bit. I finally noticed that at times i was standing almost straight up. Some of the habits we let creep in at random are weird.

A down-the-line video would show a lot more. If you post one of those, you might get some good advice.

Thanks. I will, but it will be tomorrow.

Pete,

My $.02 and worth what it cost you.

Your left hand appears to be cocked around behind the shaft at address. The thumbs should point back at your elbows here. Imagine a line down the center of your thumb nail up your thumb to your shoulder. There appears to be a layoff at the top of your backswing where you come off plane then work to get back on plane in your swing. It also appears to be that your clubhead is hitting down on your ball at impact (wil cause a lower trajectory). Many of these things can be fixed easily with a lesson from a PGA Professional.

I would practice a slower back swing concentrating on taking the club away low down the line forcing a more complete turn, and try to stay on plane through your backswing. Easier typed than put into motion, I know.

I am NOT a PGA pro nor do I teach, but that is what stands out to me in watching your swing video. Congrats for having the guts to post it and let random internet folks (me) try to help you.

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Pete,

My $.02 and worth what it cost you.

Your left hand appears to be cocked around behind the shaft at address. The thumbs should point back at your elbows here. Imagine a line down the center of your thumb nail up your thumb to your shoulder. There appears to be a layoff at the top of your backswing where you come off plane then work to get back on plane in your swing. It also appears to be that your clubhead is hitting down on your ball at impact (wil cause a lower trajectory). Many of these things can be fixed easily with a lesson from a PGA Professional.

I would practice a slower back swing concentrating on taking the club away low down the line forcing a more complete turn, and try to stay on plane through your backswing. Easier typed than put into motion, I know.

I am NOT a PGA pro nor do I teach, but that is what stands out to me in watching your swing video. Congrats for having the guts to post it and let random internet folks (me) try to help you.

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I like the thumb nail thought. That essentially should weaken my grip and help take the left hand out of the equation more which means less chance of flipping.

I'm also going to do the water bottle drill to help me take the club back down the line instead of so inside like I do.


Thanks for the response.

And I will be getting a lesson if this is not fixed soon. Just going to try and conquer it on my own first.

Pete, not to throw too many things at you...but you are too shallow at the top. Which will cause you to be steep on the way down. That's ok for irons, but not for the driver. Keep width between shaft and shoulder, then let it go.

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Keep width between shaft and shoulder, then let it go.

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I think I know what you're talking about, but can you expand on this?

okay pete. I've been looking at the tape and here is my assessment. your bottom half looks way to active. what I would try here is to widen your stance just a bit to start out with. this will help keep your body from reverse pivoting and thus not cause you to come down at such a steep angle. it will also give you a better foundation to torque your swing and give you more power. distribute your weight on your feet better at address. feel like you're on your heels but in reality you will be more on the balls of your feet. your narrow stance and reverse pivot is causing your right shoulder to dip and will make you feel as though your hitting down on the ball more like an iron. it is also causing your upper body to get WAY ahead of your legs. if you pause the video right at impact you'll notice your body is already out in front of the club. by widening your stance it will help you swing around your body more and stabilize the movement of your lower body through the swing and allow your whole body to work as one. also, step back a smidgen as well. your crowding the ball

[This message has been edited by Harry Stone (edited 3/18/2014 8:30a).]

[This message has been edited by Harry Stone (edited 3/18/2014 8:33a).]

with your strong grip and body out too far in front, it is causing your hands to flip over to early resulting in the duck hooks

This is what I think I see, although a down the line video would show a lot more...

I think the cause of your narrowness, to a large extent, is that your left elbow folds behind you REALLY quick on the backswing. There is no width from the beginning. So you likely get everything inside and stuck behind you. The shaft is probably pointing left of your target at the top. All of this is a recipe for snap hooks. It looks like you reroute the club back onto a higher plane on the downswing than your backswing, but this is tougher to do well and consistently with a driver than with irons.

I would focus on keeping your left arm straight as long as you can in the backswing. It will naturally fold at some point, so I seriously doubt you can over do this.

Don't try to hold off on your wrists hinging or slow your shoulder turn...just the folding of your left arm.

If you stop your swing with your right arm roughly parallel to the ground and your club roughly perpendicular, your left arm should still be fairly straight and your arms in front of your chest, not behind you.

by the way, with all the online lessons, good luck in making a natural swing without thinking about 10 different mechanics all at once.

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The thumbs should point back at your elbows here. Imagine a line down the center of your thumb nail up your thumb to your shoulder.

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I disagree with this advice. The pretty much unanimous school of thought is that "V" formed by the thumb and forefinger on each hand should point somewhere between your left ear and left shoulder (for a lefty).

Your grip is certainly somewhat stronger than it should be, but you'll run into more faults if you try to get your right thumb pointing at your right elbow/shoulder.

A weaker grip is much more likely to be flippy, in an attempt to square the face.

[This message has been edited by HouAggie (edited 3/18/2014 9:22a).]

Irish- when you get to the top of your backswing there should be some width between the shaft when parallel and the left shoulder. your right arm/shoulder should feel stretch. look at any pro at the top of theirs. I don't want to fill your head with 1,000+ things but just work on that. the driver swing is more of a sweeping motion, not a steep decent like the irons. I agree though, having a ton of opinions can be confusing. overall your swing looks pretty good, tempo and release are good. a hook is easier to fix than a slice. my guess is you have played tennis before...

irish-when I taught lefties I would always use tim Wilkinson as a reference. very simple easy swing to look at. youtube him and see what you think.

Guys don't worry about filling my head with 1,000 plus things! Haha.

I am a high school football coach, so I totally understand about over thinking. I just like to do a massive amount of research... Put it all together and boil it down to some key principles that I see repeat or overlap with each other. Seriously, the more opinions the better.

[This message has been edited by Tuco Salamanca (edited 3/18/2014 9:51a).]

Just watched Tim Wilkinson. That's awesome. I am going to try and get some good footage today to put up side by side with him.

Hit about 100 balls with a 8 iron with your feet together

irish-that's a great approach. as you know instructors/coaches can say 10,000 different things but unless the student understands on their own things wont get better. the best thing I can say is keep it simple, don't get too technical just try and get "your" body to understand where it needs to be. but overall I think it looks good!

OK. Here's a down the line video.

http://youtu.be/uG8S_zLHZXc

I'm starting to spray the ball more. I would say at the range today it was about 20% snap hooks, 20% low draws, 20% straight, 20% fades, and 20% big old high slices.

I think the fact that I'm spraying it everywhere now is a good sign... I hope...

I would suggest working on your hand position at the top of your swing.

You have that club face pretty closed all the way through the back swing.

Ask Hank Haney on twitter... He'll reply to you

First, good for you for taking the time to share video and subject yourself to scrutiny. Here's what I see: feet closed but shoulders open, at the top you're coming over it (club face closed and path is steep). I'd say move the ball back in your stance a little (which will fix your alignment) and try to get your hands above your shoulder at the stop (higher....you're too flat hence the over the top move). Last, your lower body is a little too active. Probably you're just trying to hit the ball too far if your iron trajectory is okay.

Your swing looks much better down the line that I gave you credit for. This is what I think is happening...

A closed clubface is playable (see Duval, DJohnson, ZJohnson, Azinger), but it involves a little compensation elsewhere. You have to make sure that the clubhead NEVER catches up to or overtakes the hands until well after impact. These guys accomplish that by turning fast through the ball and the handle of the club turning the corner left sharply after impact. In your case, the handle of the club would be going right quickly after impact. Yours doesn't really do this. With your driver, maybe you're trying to elevate the ball, but you seem to be throwing your hands at it and this causes a rapid rate of closure for the clubface.

If you want to keep your grip as is, you're going to need the clubhead to be a little more stable through impact. So I'd really focus on the handle of the club traveling low and right after impact, so the face doesn't shut as quickly. It has to be a hard body release and a very passive hands release. Does that make sense?

Figured I'd add a pic. Red is where you seem to be now. Clubface pointing way right after impact and your hands traveling too much down the line. They need to be traveling more along the green arrow, holding the face more square to your swing path.



My unprofessional $0.02.

[This message has been edited by HouAggie (edited 3/19/2014 8:36a).]

Uhhh.... was someone ever going to make the obvious point that he is standing on the wrong side of the ball? Seems like that is clearly the biggest area of concern in that swing.

HouAggie, I appreciate it.





I watched David Duvall's swing and I see exactly what you are talking about with the lines on the picture. Thanks again!