Yes but there are other options than Bauer who has been inconsistent in Japan for the past 2 seasons
Snell, Montgomery, Nola, etc
Snell, Montgomery, Nola, etc
***Official Houston Astros 2023-24 Offseason Thread*** [Staff Warning - OP]
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Last: 10 mo ago by Lonestar_Ag09
I sincerely hope the Astros do not get another starter and win 100 games because of this post alone.HarryRocket said:Farmer1906 said:Seems like a little much, here. Things went about as bad as they could and we still won the division and made the playoffs.HarryRocket said:
Imo, If we had Bauer this year we win the World Series.
That's what I care about.
If we don't add another legit starter to this club I don't think we make the playoffs in 2024.
I don't give a **** about his personality. If he's not in prison he can throw a baseball for all i care.
I'm basing this on projection. Name one Astros starter who isn't projecting down right now.
Verlander? Dude is old, he's not getting better
Javier? Nope.
Valdez? Nope
France? Inning eater but clock may have struck midnight
Garcia? Still hurt, who knows
Brown? Nope.
Urquidy? Maybe? But nope. was injured most of the season.
LMJ? I wouldn't rely on him to have a snack day for my kids soccer team
We need 1 starter to make the playoffs, 2 if we're being honest.
This staff requires a 6 man rotation with another in the pen who can start in a pinch.
This was also unicorn year. Every single contention team will be better in 24. If 23 is your measuring stick, 24 will come up short.
If we're willing to spend the cash, great. Bauer is bargain shopping so we can bullpen, another starter and a left fielder.
Beat40 said:I sincerely hope the Astros do not get another starter and win 100 games because of this post alone.HarryRocket said:Farmer1906 said:Seems like a little much, here. Things went about as bad as they could and we still won the division and made the playoffs.HarryRocket said:
Imo, If we had Bauer this year we win the World Series.
That's what I care about.
If we don't add another legit starter to this club I don't think we make the playoffs in 2024.
I don't give a **** about his personality. If he's not in prison he can throw a baseball for all i care.
I'm basing this on projection. Name one Astros starter who isn't projecting down right now.
Verlander? Dude is old, he's not getting better
Javier? Nope.
Valdez? Nope
France? Inning eater but clock may have struck midnight
Garcia? Still hurt, who knows
Brown? Nope.
Urquidy? Maybe? But nope. was injured most of the season.
LMJ? I wouldn't rely on him to have a snack day for my kids soccer team
We need 1 starter to make the playoffs, 2 if we're being honest.
This staff requires a 6 man rotation with another in the pen who can start in a pinch.
This was also unicorn year. Every single contention team will be better in 24. If 23 is your measuring stick, 24 will come up short.
Maybe they will. But argument remains. All starters are projecting down.
Bauer has only pitched one season in Japan. And those you listed are going to cost much more $$$ if I had to guess
I rather pay a bit more than have a narcissist clubhouse cancer on the team.AustinCountyAg said:
Bauer has only pitched one season in Japan. And those you listed are going to cost much more $$$ if I had to guess
To me we just need to add 3 pieces.
- a strong bullpen arm.
- a starter that can eat innings
- a strong bench bat or left fielder since Yordan will primarily DH
If we spend a lot on one guy, I'd like it to either be a Hader, Montgomery or Nola.
- a strong bullpen arm.
- a starter that can eat innings
- a strong bench bat or left fielder since Yordan will primarily DH
If we spend a lot on one guy, I'd like it to either be a Hader, Montgomery or Nola.
You seem pretty sure about all of that yet it's clear none of those things are 100%, not not even fully likely.
Framber was a top 15 pitcher in baseball. That's pretty good for a guy we want to dump on. No reason he can't be as good or better next year.
Javier was bad. Why is it unlikely he won't revert back to what he's been. He was pretty solid down the stretch u til the very last game.
JV is older. But he wasn't so good that that repeating his 2023 performance or getting close to it is far fetched. It's not like we're expecting 2022 JV.
Brown, France, Arrighetti, Gordon are all a year farther along in development.
I know you don't rely on LMJ but that doesn't mean he can't finally be healthy.
We have depth in Urquidy, Bielak, & Blanco. It's not like we're going to run out of arms to eat some innnings.
This terrible grip of starters were 8th in ERA & 16th in SIERA. Good not great. Yet better than the team that just won the WS. It didn't stop them.
Framber was a top 15 pitcher in baseball. That's pretty good for a guy we want to dump on. No reason he can't be as good or better next year.
Javier was bad. Why is it unlikely he won't revert back to what he's been. He was pretty solid down the stretch u til the very last game.
JV is older. But he wasn't so good that that repeating his 2023 performance or getting close to it is far fetched. It's not like we're expecting 2022 JV.
Brown, France, Arrighetti, Gordon are all a year farther along in development.
I know you don't rely on LMJ but that doesn't mean he can't finally be healthy.
We have depth in Urquidy, Bielak, & Blanco. It's not like we're going to run out of arms to eat some innnings.
This terrible grip of starters were 8th in ERA & 16th in SIERA. Good not great. Yet better than the team that just won the WS. It didn't stop them.
You project every single contention team to be better in '24 and project every Astro player to be down in '24.HarryRocket said:Beat40 said:I sincerely hope the Astros do not get another starter and win 100 games because of this post alone.HarryRocket said:Farmer1906 said:Seems like a little much, here. Things went about as bad as they could and we still won the division and made the playoffs.HarryRocket said:
Imo, If we had Bauer this year we win the World Series.
That's what I care about.
If we don't add another legit starter to this club I don't think we make the playoffs in 2024.
I don't give a **** about his personality. If he's not in prison he can throw a baseball for all i care.
I'm basing this on projection. Name one Astros starter who isn't projecting down right now.
Verlander? Dude is old, he's not getting better
Javier? Nope.
Valdez? Nope
France? Inning eater but clock may have struck midnight
Garcia? Still hurt, who knows
Brown? Nope.
Urquidy? Maybe? But nope. was injured most of the season.
LMJ? I wouldn't rely on him to have a snack day for my kids soccer team
We need 1 starter to make the playoffs, 2 if we're being honest.
This staff requires a 6 man rotation with another in the pen who can start in a pinch.
This was also unicorn year. Every single contention team will be better in 24. If 23 is your measuring stick, 24 will come up short.
Maybe they will. But argument remains. All starters are projecting down.
The Rangers had several hitters have career years and you don't project them down. Several Astros guys have a down year in comparison to their past couple of years and you don't project them up.
In reality, it's going to be in the middle.
- JV will be fine. He will adjust his pitching this offseason I believe.
- Javier absolutely will be better next year. He figured out his mechanical issues at the ned of the season and I am confident he will carry it through next year.
- Valdez - I believe arm fatigue was more of the issue. He had a bad second half of 2023. I think he'll be closer to 2022 and the first half 2023 than second half 2023.
- France - I expect regression from him. Honestly not sure he's even going to be in the rotation in the second half of next year.
- Garcia - who knows.
- Brown - last year was his first full season. I've got him as the same, not projecting down. I actually think he will be better last year and have an ERA under 4.
- Urquidy - You guys really, really need to look at his career stats. He's easily a low end 3, high end 4 for his career. I think he'll be that next season too.
- LMJ - who klnows.
I guess I'm probably in the minority here but I have to 2023 Astros are the 11th best team in franchise history.
The one game away from making the World Series is misleading imo. You could argue results are all that matters and I can see that but when I look at the individuals in a buy or sell way, this is team yordan, Altuve, and some jags.
Edit: tis is a bit too much. There is talent here. But elite? I don't see elite outside of Altuve and yordan.
The one game away from making the World Series is misleading imo. You could argue results are all that matters and I can see that but when I look at the individuals in a buy or sell way, this is team yordan, Altuve, and some jags.
Edit: tis is a bit too much. There is talent here. But elite? I don't see elite outside of Altuve and yordan.
Farmer1906 said:
You seem pretty sure about all of that yet it's clear none of those things are 100%, not not even fully likely.
Framber was a top 15 pitcher in baseball. That's pretty good for a guy we want to dump on. No reason he can't be as good or better next year.
Javier was bad. Why is it unlikely he won't revert back to what he's been. He was pretty solid down the stretch u til the very last game.
JV is older. But he wasn't so good that that repeating his 2023 performance or getting close to it is far fetched. It's not like we're expecting 2022 JV.
Brown, France, Arrighetti, Gordon are all a year farther along in development.
I know you don't rely on LMJ but that doesn't mean he can't finally be healthy.
We have depth in Urquidy, Bielak, & Blanco. It's not like we're going to run out of arms to eat some innnings.
This terrible grip of starters were 8th in ERA & 16th in SIERA. Good not great. Yet better than the team that just won the WS. It didn't stop them.
You can certainly find optimism. And the great part is you don't have to hit on all, just a few. I get that. I just don't see it when I look at them individually. JV is the only proven guy as in several seasons of top tier performance.
You need at least two top tier pitchers to win. We have a bunch of mid plus guys.
Edit for my comment was a little harsh.HarryRocket said:
I guess I'm probably in the minority here but I have to 2023 Astros are the 11th best team in franchise history.
The one game away from making the World Series is misleading imo. You could argue results are all that matters and I can see that but when I look at the individuals in a buy or sell way, this is team yordan, Altuve, and some jags.
I think if we're going to spend money (or maybe big money), we should spend it on a LFer and/or a bullpen arm. Think maybe Soler and Hader type players. I'd add another SP if the money/trade is right. I do think we need some insurance in the rotation where we have alot of "ifs" - whether its injuries or performance.
I edited. You're right
Except the past 3 seasons Framber has been a top tier pitcher.HarryRocket said:Farmer1906 said:
You seem pretty sure about all of that yet it's clear none of those things are 100%, not not even fully likely.
Framber was a top 15 pitcher in baseball. That's pretty good for a guy we want to dump on. No reason he can't be as good or better next year.
Javier was bad. Why is it unlikely he won't revert back to what he's been. He was pretty solid down the stretch u til the very last game.
JV is older. But he wasn't so good that that repeating his 2023 performance or getting close to it is far fetched. It's not like we're expecting 2022 JV.
Brown, France, Arrighetti, Gordon are all a year farther along in development.
I know you don't rely on LMJ but that doesn't mean he can't finally be healthy.
We have depth in Urquidy, Bielak, & Blanco. It's not like we're going to run out of arms to eat some innnings.
This terrible grip of starters were 8th in ERA & 16th in SIERA. Good not great. Yet better than the team that just won the WS. It didn't stop them.
You can certainly find optimism. And the great part is you don't have to hit on all, just a few. I get that. I just don't see it when I look at them individually. JV is the only proven guy as in several seasons of top tier performance.
You need at least two top tier pitchers to win. We have a bunch of mid plus guys.
He started the year well.
My argument is this:
Given where we are in our run, how much we have to spend, and our needs,
We're the team that logically should take a flyer on Bauer. If he's a dick, you cut him. Or trade him.
We have to do something because we're projecting down right now. 24 Astros do not look better than the 23 Astros outside of Maldy and Dusty being gone. (Which is big) but the pitching staff concerns me.
Given where we are in our run, how much we have to spend, and our needs,
We're the team that logically should take a flyer on Bauer. If he's a dick, you cut him. Or trade him.
We have to do something because we're projecting down right now. 24 Astros do not look better than the 23 Astros outside of Maldy and Dusty being gone. (Which is big) but the pitching staff concerns me.
From 2020-2023 (4 seasons)HarryRocket said:Farmer1906 said:
You seem pretty sure about all of that yet it's clear none of those things are 100%, not not even fully likely.
Framber was a top 15 pitcher in baseball. That's pretty good for a guy we want to dump on. No reason he can't be as good or better next year.
Javier was bad. Why is it unlikely he won't revert back to what he's been. He was pretty solid down the stretch u til the very last game.
JV is older. But he wasn't so good that that repeating his 2023 performance or getting close to it is far fetched. It's not like we're expecting 2022 JV.
Brown, France, Arrighetti, Gordon are all a year farther along in development.
I know you don't rely on LMJ but that doesn't mean he can't finally be healthy.
We have depth in Urquidy, Bielak, & Blanco. It's not like we're going to run out of arms to eat some innnings.
This terrible grip of starters were 8th in ERA & 16th in SIERA. Good not great. Yet better than the team that just won the WS. It didn't stop them.
You can certainly find optimism. And the great part is you don't have to hit on all, just a few. I get that. I just don't see it when I look at them individually. JV is the only proven guy as in several seasons of top tier performance.
You need at least two top tier pitchers to win. We have a bunch of mid plus guys.
11th WAR
11th IP
18th ERA
21st FIP
12th xFIP
16th SIERA
Shrink to the 2 most recent seasons
7th WAR
5th IP
7th ERA
7th FIP
4th xFIP
6th SIERA
That is a legit top tier pitcher.
I am tired of everyone ****ting on the Framchise. 2024 is the year of La Grasa.
Health alone should be a reason to believe it'll be better.HarryRocket said:
My argument is this:
Given where we are in our run, how much we have to spend, and our needs,
We're the team that logically should take a flyer on Bauer. If he's a dick, you cut him. Or trade him.
We have to do something because we're projecting down right now. 24 Astros do not look better than the 23 Astros outside of Maldy and Dusty being gone. (Which is big) but the pitching staff concerns me.
What are you basing the Astros projecting down next year? How do you know which performances from last year and 2022 and before 2022 are more likely for next year?HarryRocket said:
My argument is this:
Given where we are in our run, how much we have to spend, and our needs,
We're the team that logically should take a flyer on Bauer. If he's a dick, you cut him. Or trade him.
We have to do something because we're projecting down right now. 24 Astros do not look better than the 23 Astros outside of Maldy and Dusty being gone. (Which is big) but the pitching staff concerns me.
Then the Rangers are adding Degrom.
History of injury is concerning.
I'm coming from a standpoint of not leaving things to chance. That's why I sign Bauer. He's insurance for
So many uncertainties while we're in a historic run
History of injury is concerning.
I'm coming from a standpoint of not leaving things to chance. That's why I sign Bauer. He's insurance for
So many uncertainties while we're in a historic run
Beat40 said:What are you basing the Astros projecting down next year? How do you know which performances from last year and 2022 and before 2022 are more likely for next year?HarryRocket said:
My argument is this:
Given where we are in our run, how much we have to spend, and our needs,
We're the team that logically should take a flyer on Bauer. If he's a dick, you cut him. Or trade him.
We have to do something because we're projecting down right now. 24 Astros do not look better than the 23 Astros outside of Maldy and Dusty being gone. (Which is big) but the pitching staff concerns me.
Name one pitcher projected to have a better year in 24 than in 23. Whose stock is climbing?
I already did. From an earlier post:HarryRocket said:Beat40 said:What are you basing the Astros projecting down next year? How do you know which performances from last year and 2022 and before 2022 are more likely for next year?HarryRocket said:
My argument is this:
Given where we are in our run, how much we have to spend, and our needs,
We're the team that logically should take a flyer on Bauer. If he's a dick, you cut him. Or trade him.
We have to do something because we're projecting down right now. 24 Astros do not look better than the 23 Astros outside of Maldy and Dusty being gone. (Which is big) but the pitching staff concerns me.
Name one pitcher projected to have a better year in 24 than in 23. Whose stock is climbing?
In reality, it's going to be in the middle.
- JV will be fine. He will adjust his pitching this offseason I believe.
- Javier absolutely will be better next year. He figured out his mechanical issues at the ned of the season and I am confident he will carry it through next year.
- Valdez - I believe arm fatigue was more of the issue. He had a bad second half of 2023. I think he'll be closer to 2022 and the first half 2023 than second half 2023.
- France - I expect regression from him. Honestly not sure he's even going to be in the rotation in the second half of next year.
- Garcia - who knows.
- Brown - last year was his first full season. I've got him as the same, not projecting down. I actually think he will be better last year and have an ERA under 4.
- Urquidy - You guys really, really need to look at his career stats. He's easily a low end 3, high end 4 for his career. I think he'll be that next season too.
- LMJ - who klnows.
I understand you can be optimistic. I don't think what you posted was outrageous. It's glass half full. I can see it.
Maybe I should frame the question better…
What pitcher would be worth more in free agency this off season than last off season?
Maybe I should frame the question better…
What pitcher would be worth more in free agency this off season than last off season?
I still continue to be puzzled by the Hader talk. In this case, it is not just talking heads but 2015 has indicated he figures into our front office discussions.
He just doesn't seem like an Astros kind of signing. I don't see the Astros demoting Pressly from the closer role and I don't see Hader signing to be a setup man.
Hader is damn good but the ever dangerous mega-contract reliever (3-5 years at high AAV). Plus, while still good, the last 2 seasons he has not been as dominant as his early MIL stint.
It feels like someone like Jordan Hicks could be had as a flamethrowing RP for less money on fewer years.
I still we need 2 RP this offseason: one FA setup man, and a trade for another improvable under the radar arm.
He just doesn't seem like an Astros kind of signing. I don't see the Astros demoting Pressly from the closer role and I don't see Hader signing to be a setup man.
Hader is damn good but the ever dangerous mega-contract reliever (3-5 years at high AAV). Plus, while still good, the last 2 seasons he has not been as dominant as his early MIL stint.
It feels like someone like Jordan Hicks could be had as a flamethrowing RP for less money on fewer years.
I still we need 2 RP this offseason: one FA setup man, and a trade for another improvable under the radar arm.
JV will be good. Probably not an Ace but likely a 3.50 ERA type of guy.
Framber should be solid as well.
Javier is the key though. If he bounces back we will be in a really good spot. He showed flashes of that until ALCS game 7.
After that it's just up to France to be solid, Urquidy to eat innings and McCullers to get mostly healthy
Framber should be solid as well.
Javier is the key though. If he bounces back we will be in a really good spot. He showed flashes of that until ALCS game 7.
After that it's just up to France to be solid, Urquidy to eat innings and McCullers to get mostly healthy
And possibly losing Montgomery. Scherzer is like JV in your scenario.HarryRocket said:
Then the Rangers are adding Degrom.
History of injury is concerning.
I'm coming from a standpoint of not leaving things to chance. That's why I sign Bauer. He's insurance for
So many uncertainties while we're in a historic run
Dunning and had a career year last year. Gray had the 4th best season of his career. You aren't projecting those two to be down next year.
need a crafty, veteran LH relief pitcher
I guess my point is I don't mind going to add another #2, but I don't think the Astros are necessarily projecting down to the point where I want to add an extreme clubhouse cancer and ****** like Bauer.HarryRocket said:
I understand you can be optimistic. I don't think what you posted was outrageous. It's glass half full. I can see it.
Maybe I should frame the question better…
What pitcher would be worth more in free agency this off season than last off season?
I already hated it when the Astros traded for Osuna.
tjack16 said:
JV will be good. Probably not an Ace but likely a 3.50 ERA type of guy.
Framber should be solid as well.
Javier is the key though. If he bounces back we will be in a really good spot. He showed flashes of that until ALCS game 7.
After that it's just up to France to be solid, Urquidy to eat innings and McCullers to get mostly healthy
This is my point.
JV should be good if given a month or so off and put in a 6 man rotation.
Expect either Framber or Javier to be good. Maybe one turns elite and the other is good, that's best case scenario.
Then you have inning eaters
That's a staff that need another top tier starter to win the World Series.
World Series teams are usually tough. 23 got people all twisted. This was not a normal year. It takes a monster team to win the World Series .
Why not cast as many nets as you can since you can't just afford to sign one?
Saw another site speculate the Brewers could trade Peralta. Maybe if we would take on Yelich's contract we wouldn't have to give up great prospects. Seems like the ultimate all in move if Crane is willing to go into luxury tax territory.
Beat40 said:I guess my point is I don't mind going to add another #2, but I don't think the Astros are necessarily projecting down to the point where I want to add an extreme clubhouse cancer and ****** like Bauer.HarryRocket said:
I understand you can be optimistic. I don't think what you posted was outrageous. It's glass half full. I can see it.
Maybe I should frame the question better…
What pitcher would be worth more in free agency this off season than last off season?
I already hated it when the Astros traded for Osuna.
See we can just disagree here because I love the thought of going full heel. Hate us!
Apply the same logic.HarryRocket said:
Then the Rangers are adding Degrom.
History of injury is concerning.
I'm coming from a standpoint of not leaving things to chance. That's why I sign Bauer. He's insurance for
So many uncertainties while we're in a historic run
deGrom 44 starts from 2020 to 2023.Quote:
LMJ? I wouldn't rely on him to have a snack day for my kids soccer team
McCullers 47 starts from 2020 to 2023.
Best case for deGrom is Aug 2024 with a chance he misses all of 2024.
It's like we have too many options.tjack16 said:
JV will be good. Probably not an Ace but likely a 3.50 ERA type of guy.
Framber should be solid as well.
Javier is the key though. If he bounces back we will be in a really good spot. He showed flashes of that until ALCS game 7.
After that it's just up to France to be solid, Urquidy to eat innings and McCullers to get mostly healthy
You forgot Brown. He's entering his age 25 season. xERA, FIP, & xFIP show he was probably better than his results. He's got a chance to be really good.
If high-ceiling guys like McCullers & Brown are your 4 & 5 then you have a good pitching staff.
Farmer1906 said:Apply the same logic.HarryRocket said:
Then the Rangers are adding Degrom.
History of injury is concerning.
I'm coming from a standpoint of not leaving things to chance. That's why I sign Bauer. He's insurance for
So many uncertainties while we're in a historic rundeGrom 44 starts from 2020 to 2023.Quote:
LMJ? I wouldn't rely on him to have a snack day for my kids soccer team
McCullers 47 starts from 2020 to 2023.
Best case for deGrom is Aug 2024 with a chance he misses all of 2024.
That's exactly why I mentioned DeGrom.
Relying on "getting healthy" is a risky game.
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