***Official Houston Astros 2021-22 Offseason Thread***

564,051 Views | 6776 Replies | Last: 1 yr ago by AggiEE
EastCoastAgNc
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Farmer1906
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Ag4life80 said:

If Pena is the best defensive player in the Astro Organization, and he hits .260 w 15 -20 homers, is CC 30M a better player? Correa had his best year last year in a loaded lineup. He's going to get pitched around In Baltimore and the pressure is going to be on to produce on a cellar dwelling team. Not to mention, the Jays are set to dominate that division for the next 5 years. We're about to find out if it's really all about the ego of getting a bigger deal than Lindor.
No, but we can't think like that across the board. You want some players that are at or near the top of the league. If we find guys making okay money (value) and they're just slightly above average you're never going to win more titles. And it's extremely unlikely that was can just keep backfilling guys with our farm system. You have to pick and choose certain guys to keep for 2nd and 3rd contracts or go out and add big-time free agents/trade.
EastCoastAgNc
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Ag4life80
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I agree with your points, and I want to resign the guy, but to match that offer in length and dollars makes no logical sense for the value add. I'd rather use the money on extensions for Tucker and Alvarez. If Bregman has a big year, you've got that coming up. The Astros have done well using cap space at the trade deadline as well.
EastCoastAgNc
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W
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Byrce Harper has been a member of the Phillies for 3 years.

the Phillies haven't made the playoffs in those 3 years.

his deal is closer to a lose-lose...assuming winning is important
Deluxe
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Farmer1906 said:

Ag4life80 said:

If Pena is the best defensive player in the Astro Organization, and he hits .260 w 15 -20 homers, is CC 30M a better player? Correa had his best year last year in a loaded lineup. He's going to get pitched around In Baltimore and the pressure is going to be on to produce on a cellar dwelling team. Not to mention, the Jays are set to dominate that division for the next 5 years. We're about to find out if it's really all about the ego of getting a bigger deal than Lindor.
No, but we can't think like that across the board. You want some players that are at or near the top of the league. If we find guys making okay money (value) and they're just slightly above average you're never going to win more titles. And it's extremely unlikely that was can just keep backfilling guys with our farm system. You have to pick and choose certain guys to keep for 2nd and 3rd contracts or go out and add big-time free agents/trade.
Being a sustainable long term winner is such a delicate line to walk. You have to develop the stars, then make some very difficult decisions on which ones get paid and which ones walk. Massive kudos to the organization for the job they've done thus far.

Springer and Cole were relatively easy decisions to let walk given the offers they received on the open market. Altuve and Bregman extended early and essentially volunteered to stay. Correa is probably the first true "could go either way". I think there's a sustainable path to long term winning with or without him.

EastCoastAgNc
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Mathguy64
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Last 4 seasons:

47-115
54-108
25-32
52-110

Projected record for 2022: 52-110

Their team ERA last year was 5.84 with a WHIP of 1.48

Baltimore needs way more help than CC.
agproducer
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Off of Bielak.
Taxman90
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Yeah, for Baltimore this seems like the kind of move you make when you have a bunch of young talented guys almost ready to make that big leap to playoff contender. They have Mullins, Mountcastle, and Rutschman along with some older guys like Hays and Mancini on offense. But pitching has Means and pretty much nothing else although I'm sure their farm system has plenty of guys coming up.

The Porkchop Express
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W said:

Byrce Harper has been a member of the Phillies for 3 years.

the Phillies haven't made the playoffs in those 3 years.

his deal is closer to a lose-lose...assuming winning is important
The same can be said of Trout. He's been in one playoff series as a player and that was when he was 22 in 2014. He's going to make $37 million a year from now until 2030 when he's 38 and he hasn't played more than 140 games in a year since 2016. Last year he played fewer (36) than he did during the COVID year (53). Having the best player in baseball on a team that can't do **** doesn't mean much.
EastCoastAgNc
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EastCoastAgNc
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That's an interesting comment given how many guys we have as "starters"

Verlander
McCullers (IL)
Urquidy
Garcia
Framber
Jake O
Javier

How's that gonna work? Seems like someone's gonna go, and I hope it's Odo.
Fuzzy Dunlop
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Taxman90 said:

Yeah, for Baltimore this seems like the kind of move you make when you have a bunch of young talented guys almost ready to make that big leap to playoff contender. They have Mullins, Mountcastle, and Rutschman along with some older guys like Hays and Mancini on offense. But pitching has Means and pretty much nothing else although I'm sure their farm system has plenty of guys coming up.




Baltimore has 5 players on the Top 100 prospect list. C Adley Rutschman is #2 and SP Grayson Rodriguez is #6. The remaining 3 are #64, #66, and #90.

Along with Mountcasle and Mullins, they have a good young group of players. I could see them add some SP and trying for a run in a few years. The problem is that the AL East is a SOB. But, the Yankees are going to have to get younger at some point. The Rays stay young and Boston will typically be a contender. The Blue Jays are trying to build a monster right now.

I could see the Baltimore front office trying to sell CC on being the cornerstone of an up and coming team.
tjack16
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Orioles could be like the 2015 Astros in 2 years given all of their prospects and previous top 5 draft picks.

My prediction is they make the playoffs in 2023 or 2024
agproducer
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Yankees traded Voit to the Padres.
Mathguy64
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agproducer said:

Yankees traded Voit to the Padres.
Leaving the Padres with a massive lead weight in Eric Hosmer to unload.
Ag_07
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Do they really need to with the universal DH?
Deluxe
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EastCoastAgNc said:

That's an interesting comment given how many guys we have as "starters"

Verlander
McCullers (IL)
Urquidy
Garcia
Framber
Jake O
Javier

How's that gonna work? Seems like someone's gonna go, and I hope it's Odo.
Gotta get out of the mindset that we only need 5 starters. A full season requires 7-8 minimum, especially given that not many of our guys have track records of pitching over 150 innings in a season.
Mathguy64
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Ag_07 said:

Do they really need to with the universal DH?
95, 92, 128, 102

-0.1, -0.3, 0.9, 0.0

His wRC+ and fWAR the last 4 years. The only "good" numbers were during the COVID season. Heck of a DH. I wish them the best of luck. But I suspect a lot of NL teams are going to roll with this as their DH the first time out.

Beat40
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EastCoastAgNc said:


That's an interesting comment given how many guys we have as "starters"

Verlander
McCullers (IL)
Urquidy
Garcia
Framber
Jake O
Javier

How's that gonna work? Seems like someone's gonna go, and I hope it's Odo.


I think having 2 starters coming off TJ surgery and a flexor strain that isn't healing well, it seems like it would be prudent to have a 6th starter who can get 10 spot starts if needed.
EastCoastAgNc
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While not a great promise, at least he didn't bet a poop slap
Ag_07
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I didn't say he's be a good DH. Was just suggesting that there's room for both Hosmer and Voigt.

I don't know maybe Hosmer has some defensive advantages and he starts at 1B while Voigt DHs.
EastCoastAgNc
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Lonestar_Ag09
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EastCoastAgNc said:


That's an interesting comment given how many guys we have as "starters"

Verlander
McCullers (IL)
Urquidy
Garcia
Framber
Jake O
Javier

How's that gonna work? Seems like someone's gonna go, and I hope it's Odo.
Granted this is better than his BP video where he didnt bother to line up his camera between fence openings...but why wouldnt you pan a hair right and say it is Javier and Whitley...?
EastCoastAgNc
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What in the hell are the Reds doing? Do they even know?
EastCoastAgNc
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Deluxe said:

EastCoastAgNc said:

That's an interesting comment given how many guys we have as "starters"

Verlander
McCullers (IL)
Urquidy
Garcia
Framber
Jake O
Javier

How's that gonna work? Seems like someone's gonna go, and I hope it's Odo.
Gotta get out of the mindset that we only need 5 starters. A full season requires 7-8 minimum, especially given that not many of our guys have track records of pitching over 150 innings in a season.
In the past few years, the spot starts have tended to come from guys in the minors. Sending any one of the younger pitchers down to the minors to stay stretched out is a waste of their service time. Maybe they'll try a 6-man rotation out to help avoid the fatigue issues we saw in the postseason?
tjack16
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I'd be down with a 6 man rotation

Verlander
Valdez
Urquidy
Garcia
Javier
Odorizzi (replace him with LMJ when he returns)

Odorizzi can be our guy we go to if the starters struggle early
n_touch
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Marvin said:

Name another player that rejected 10/$350 for a shorter term deal. I'm seriously asking because I don't know of one offhand.

And Boras is not steering him because of the lost commission. That theory has taken on a life of its own. Agents don't get top dog clients by rejecting $350 million. Again, correct me if I'm forgetting someone. Anyone.


If it was all about the money and the offer was legit why as he not taken it? No way he wants to play there and they are just using that offer as a smokescreen. I hope all contending teams call his bluff and he ends up there, especially if the players union makes him. Will let all the players in the league know that it is not your choice during free agency any more.
Marvin
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n_touch said:

Marvin said:

Name another player that rejected 10/$350 for a shorter term deal. I'm seriously asking because I don't know of one offhand.

And Boras is not steering him because of the lost commission. That theory has taken on a life of its own. Agents don't get top dog clients by rejecting $350 million. Again, correct me if I'm forgetting someone. Anyone.


If it was all about the money and the offer was legit why as he not taken it? No way he wants to play there and they are just using that offer as a smokescreen. I hope all contending teams call his bluff and he ends up there, especially if the players union makes him. Will let all the players in the league know that it is not your choice during free agency any more.


I agree he probably doesn't want to play there, but I also contend there will be too much pressure to pass it up. Just my opinion based on history. We'll see soon enough…
I love Texas Aggie sports, but I love Texas A&M more.
tjack16
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Im assuming they are either working through details still, or Correa is seeking opt out options.
Teddy Perkins
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Marvin
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Astros v Cardinals is being broadcast on MLB Network.

Great to watch some baseball again!!!
I love Texas Aggie sports, but I love Texas A&M more.
Farmer1906
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EastCoastAgNc said:

Deluxe said:

EastCoastAgNc said:

That's an interesting comment given how many guys we have as "starters"

Verlander
McCullers (IL)
Urquidy
Garcia
Framber
Jake O
Javier

How's that gonna work? Seems like someone's gonna go, and I hope it's Odo.
Gotta get out of the mindset that we only need 5 starters. A full season requires 7-8 minimum, especially given that not many of our guys have track records of pitching over 150 innings in a season.
In the past few years, the spot starts have tended to come from guys in the minors. Sending any one of the younger pitchers down to the minors to stay stretched out is a waste of their service time. Maybe they'll try a 6-man rotation out to help avoid the fatigue issues we saw in the postseason?


These guys aren't going to stay heathy.

If the pitchers never miss a start and go 5-6 innings per game, they'll be at 160-190 innings each. That'll never happen.

You can have a plan to start one guy in the bullpen or do a 6 man rotation. It won't last long.
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