Honestly think many of you are overthinking this. In the first half the Spurs were unconscious, and in the second half they couldn't hit a wide open jumper to save their life. Just a normal return to mean that they win that game by 15+. It took all time half to half variance for that to happen. This wasn't a case of the Knicks doing something different, the Spurs just missed shots.

The Spurs could play that exact same game each of the next three and win all three. They just have to not miss nearly every open shot for two full quarters.

Guitarsoup said:

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FTAG 2000 said:

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Infection_Ag11 said:

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Dr. Not Yet Dr. Ag said:

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Yes, our lack of experience showed, but a large portion of this needs to be put on Mitch. Again, we had 6 free throws after getting into the bonus with 7 minutes left. The second Mitch sees us settling for jump shots a few possessions in a row, a timeout needs to be called and he needed to get on them about getting into the paint. We had a huge advantage and we didn't use it.

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Again, this is antiquated thinking. The data couldn't be more clear. Telling NBA caliber three point shooters to stop shooting open threes across large swaths of game time is coaching malpractice. It's literally like an offensive coordinator telling his offense to stop throwing the football for an entire quarter.

Every one making this point is just objectively, outrageously wrong. It's not debatable or a matter of opinion. You just flat out don't do that and no coach does.

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Na both third and fourth we were in bonus but kept hacking threes. That's dumb.

And if you're gonna shoot threes then run the clock down to three or less instead of with 15-20 on the clock. You gave them extra possessions in what was largely a math problem at that point.

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Did you watch it? We drove and were hacked and they refused to blow the whistle despite NYK getting in the bonus so early. We had a TON of **** that should have been called.

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The refs did seem to get caught up in the comeback in the second half. Lots of swallowed whistles.

Infection_Ag11 said:

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FTAG 2000 said:

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Infection_Ag11 said:

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Dr. Not Yet Dr. Ag said:

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Yes, our lack of experience showed, but a large portion of this needs to be put on Mitch. Again, we had 6 free throws after getting into the bonus with 7 minutes left. The second Mitch sees us settling for jump shots a few possessions in a row, a timeout needs to be called and he needed to get on them about getting into the paint. We had a huge advantage and we didn't use it.

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Again, this is antiquated thinking. The data couldn't be more clear. Telling NBA caliber three point shooters to stop shooting open threes across large swaths of game time is coaching malpractice. It's literally like an offensive coordinator telling his offense to stop throwing the football for an entire quarter.

Every one making this point is just objectively, outrageously wrong. It's not debatable or a matter of opinion. You just flat out don't do that and no coach does.

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Na both third and fourth we were in bonus but kept hacking threes. That's dumb.

And if you're gonna shoot threes then run the clock down to three or less instead of with 15-20 on the clock. You gave them extra possessions in what was largely a math problem at that point.

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You run your offense and take the open shots it generates. This ain't ****ing middle school in 1997, you don't dribble around to run clock and take whatever shot you get with 3 seconds on the clock.

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InfectionAg is 100% correct. There will be a lot of bellyaching in the next two days about 3 point shots, but the math is beyond clear. If you can't get a layup/dunk you should be shooting a 3 on each possession.

The assumption from casual fans is that instead of shooting a 3 their team could generate an easy 2 somehow, well unfortunately all defenses are built to keep you from getting those easy 2s. So for the most part, when fans demand less 3s, what they would end up with if the coach listened would be a bunch of middies that are statistically about the same percentage of a shot as a 3 is but you only get 2 points for it.

I'll say it for the millionth time, Wemby is not yet a low post monster... and he may never be. It's not that hard for defenses to force us to do a lot of our work from the perimeter and they are layering their coverage to force us to shoot 3s. I'd rather have an open Champ 3 over a wild Castle shot against a double team down low ALL day.

Wemby choked at the line but it was kind of a wash with Hart's missed bunny.

Really dumb play by Fox not killing clock.

Mitch should have been quicker on the timeouts. Try a little lineup change. Carter Bryant was a +6 in 5 minutes. Something. Instead of just watching. Blew a 99.6% win probability. Historic and likely PTSD-inducing choke job.

Have to figure out some sort of hybrid between letting Brunson beat you iso and doubling him leaving their shooters wide ass open. To their credit, they rarely missed down the stretch. Just way too long of a run of sloppy and unfocused ball with no killer instinct.

AggieEP said:

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Infection_Ag11 said:

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FTAG 2000 said:

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Infection_Ag11 said:

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Dr. Not Yet Dr. Ag said:

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Yes, our lack of experience showed, but a large portion of this needs to be put on Mitch. Again, we had 6 free throws after getting into the bonus with 7 minutes left. The second Mitch sees us settling for jump shots a few possessions in a row, a timeout needs to be called and he needed to get on them about getting into the paint. We had a huge advantage and we didn't use it.

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Again, this is antiquated thinking. The data couldn't be more clear. Telling NBA caliber three point shooters to stop shooting open threes across large swaths of game time is coaching malpractice. It's literally like an offensive coordinator telling his offense to stop throwing the football for an entire quarter.

Every one making this point is just objectively, outrageously wrong. It's not debatable or a matter of opinion. You just flat out don't do that and no coach does.

---

Na both third and fourth we were in bonus but kept hacking threes. That's dumb.

And if you're gonna shoot threes then run the clock down to three or less instead of with 15-20 on the clock. You gave them extra possessions in what was largely a math problem at that point.

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You run your offense and take the open shots it generates. This ain't ****ing middle school in 1997, you don't dribble around to run clock and take whatever shot you get with 3 seconds on the clock.

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InfectionAg is 100% correct. There will be a lot of bellyaching in the next two days about 3 point shots, but the math is beyond clear. If you can't get a layup/dunk you should be shooting a 3 on each possession.

The assumption from casual fans is that instead of shooting a 3 their team could generate an easy 2 somehow, well unfortunately all defenses are built to keep you from getting those easy 2s. So for the most part, when fans demand less 3s, what they would end up with if the coach listened would be a bunch of middies that are statistically about the same percentage of a shot as a 3 is but you only get 2 points for it.

I'll say it for the millionth time, Wemby is not yet a low post monster... and he may never be. It's not that hard for defenses to force us to do a lot of our work from the perimeter and they are layering their coverage to force us to shoot 3s. I'd rather have an open Champ 3 over a wild Castle shot against a double team down low ALL day.

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That's the problem. We never even attempted to drive. SO MANY possessions we made one pass and immediately shot a 3. Never once tried to get into the paint. Never once took more than 8 seconds off the clock.

Infection_Ag11 said:

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Dr. Not Yet Dr. Ag said:

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Yes, our lack of experience showed, but a large portion of this needs to be put on Mitch. Again, we had 6 free throws after getting into the bonus with 7 minutes left. The second Mitch sees us settling for jump shots a few possessions in a row, a timeout needs to be called and he needed to get on them about getting into the paint. We had a huge advantage and we didn't use it.

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Again, this is antiquated thinking. The data couldn't be more clear. Telling NBA caliber three point shooters to stop shooting open threes across large swaths of game time is coaching malpractice. It's literally like an offensive coordinator telling his offense to stop throwing the football for an entire quarter.

Every one making this point is just objectively, outrageously wrong. It's not debatable or a matter of opinion. You just flat out don't do that and no coach does.

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Summy, that you?

I'll be amazed if we do anything but come out and get blown out next game. Giving up a 29 point lead in a Finals game does mental and emotional damage to players.

Has Bryant even played in 2nd half in the Finals and why not try Barnes in 2nd half for KJ, veteran presence sorely missed .

If sports was just numbers and percentages, they wouldn't have to play the games. And how many playoff games have we lost when the 3-point shooting isn't there?

I agree that you can't give it up completely, but you have to find someone like Harper who's been good at getting to the basket and see what he can do. Putting the ball in the basket a few times in the best way to loosen up the shooters. The fans aren't the only ones feeling the pucker when the 3'a stop falling.

Just listened to Wemby's postgame presser and he seemed pissed/in shock. This may just be the gut punch that most NBA stars go through before reaching the mountaintop.

You should probably give Doris Burke a call, she'd love to talk to you about pounding it down low.

I had to listen to her and PJ Carlisimo for part of the game and they were whining about the 3s all game. Pretty sure they'd both be on board with bringing back the peach basket and extreme short shorts.

But seriously, it's not that easy to get layups, and if it was every team would shoot 100 layups per game. So generic complaints demanding "more 2s" ring hollow because it ignores the reality that most 2s are bad shots unless you can get all the way to the rim.

We were up 20 with under 10 to go. You simply need to not give open 3s, make sure to run screens and move the ball on offense and you should win 100% of the time. Instead, we went with a junk defense that doesn't work and a lineup that could not succeed. Play three more minutes with the guys out there and NY waves the white towel

Was looking forward to reading all the Knick ref-blaming on twitter for the next couple of days. Now I'll have to avoid the glazing of the greatest comeback in finals history.

jagged said:

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AggieEP said:

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Infection_Ag11 said:

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FTAG 2000 said:

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Infection_Ag11 said:

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Dr. Not Yet Dr. Ag said:

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Yes, our lack of experience showed, but a large portion of this needs to be put on Mitch. Again, we had 6 free throws after getting into the bonus with 7 minutes left. The second Mitch sees us settling for jump shots a few possessions in a row, a timeout needs to be called and he needed to get on them about getting into the paint. We had a huge advantage and we didn't use it.

---

Again, this is antiquated thinking. The data couldn't be more clear. Telling NBA caliber three point shooters to stop shooting open threes across large swaths of game time is coaching malpractice. It's literally like an offensive coordinator telling his offense to stop throwing the football for an entire quarter.

Every one making this point is just objectively, outrageously wrong. It's not debatable or a matter of opinion. You just flat out don't do that and no coach does.

---

Na both third and fourth we were in bonus but kept hacking threes. That's dumb.

And if you're gonna shoot threes then run the clock down to three or less instead of with 15-20 on the clock. You gave them extra possessions in what was largely a math problem at that point.

---

You run your offense and take the open shots it generates. This ain't ****ing middle school in 1997, you don't dribble around to run clock and take whatever shot you get with 3 seconds on the clock.

---

InfectionAg is 100% correct. There will be a lot of bellyaching in the next two days about 3 point shots, but the math is beyond clear. If you can't get a layup/dunk you should be shooting a 3 on each possession.

The assumption from casual fans is that instead of shooting a 3 their team could generate an easy 2 somehow, well unfortunately all defenses are built to keep you from getting those easy 2s. So for the most part, when fans demand less 3s, what they would end up with if the coach listened would be a bunch of middies that are statistically about the same percentage of a shot as a 3 is but you only get 2 points for it.

I'll say it for the millionth time, Wemby is not yet a low post monster... and he may never be. It's not that hard for defenses to force us to do a lot of our work from the perimeter and they are layering their coverage to force us to shoot 3s. I'd rather have an open Champ 3 over a wild Castle shot against a double team down low ALL day.

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the math and analytics are nice and all, but it's not typically considering a scenario where you have a 29 point lead. Or a 20 point lead with 9:30 to go.

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Yeah, when you're up 20 you shorten the game and limit possessions - run more clock on offense and try to get the line where your EV is higher than just chucking up 3s.

Mitch also coached them to that 29 point lead. You don't accidentally have the largest halftime lead for a road team in finals history.

Why would we change our offensive strategy after absolutely demolishing them in the first half?

The team still generated open looks for large stretches of the 2nd half but just couldn't make a shot as the pressure mounted. Obviously the coach can take some blame for not helping to get the team back focused and settled, and maybe a future version of Mitch uses his timeouts a bit differently to help calm the team and remind them to just relax and trust the work they've put in.

Has Bryant even played in 2nd half in the Finals and why not try Barnes in 2nd half for KJ, veteran presence sorely missed .

AggieEP said:

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Mitch also coached them to that 29 point lead. You don't accidentally have the largest halftime lead for a road team in finals history.

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LOL