HiddenAg2 said:

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redd38 said:

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We're already at peak soccer, we can only go down from here. If we fall off the map like Portland then I'm all for bringing in someone new. But until that happens, if you're not enjoying the current soccer program then you're not going to enjoy it any more with a national championship.

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This just makes me sad. A&M is not at peak soccer. Peak soccer is Stanford, Florida St, Penn State, UCLA, Virginia, Duke. Those are programs competing for the national title every year. A&M is not. What you are implying is that A&M cannot and shouldn't expect to ever reach that level of success. I disagree. There is no reason why A&M cannot join that group. And of course I still enjoy the program at its current level, but I think there is still room for improvement. And A&M is not Portland. We have a sustainable infrastructure and advantages that will make it easier for any good coach to succeed here.

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You're reading comprehension is terrible for someone that likes writing so much.

HiddenAg2 said:

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What exactly is missing for us to be the next Florida State, Penn State, or UCLA?

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What exactly is missing for those teams to be the next Texas A&M? We have better facilities, more fans, better atmosphere, better access to the team. A national title would be great, but I wouldn't trade places with any of those teams to go to boring games to see a couple extra wins per year.

redd38 said:

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HiddenAg2 said:

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What exactly is missing for us to be the next Florida State, Penn State, or UCLA?

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What exactly is missing for those teams to be the next Texas A&M? We have better facilities, more fans, better atmosphere, better access to the team. A national title would be great, but I wouldn't trade places with any of those teams to go to boring games to see a couple extra wins per year.

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None of us want to say it because we are Aggies and we can be loyal to a fault.

I think the answer to the hiddenag question is implied in the redd38 answer.

We are prisoners of our program leaderships consistent Top 8-15 success. Hard to justify a change until you become resolved that a national championship is what matters.

policywonk98 said:

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None of us want to say it because we are Aggies and we can be loyal to a fault.

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Aggies should all understand the concept, A&M isn't academically ranked #1, but it's ranked high enough that in combination with other factors it's still the school we chose.

Coaching

It is coaching. If ,after 26 years, you have not been able to compete for national titles, then it gets to the question "What does coach G need to change in order to alter the outcomes ? "
Is it offensive mindset?
Is it adjusting your offense for the talent you have?
Are the players tenacious?

If Redd's "good is good enough" attitude is reflective of the overall soccer fanbase, then Gino is the perfect coach for our program.

But if you take the view that women's soccer is like every other team endeavor and that the status quo is never sustainable you should question the results that Coach G has been allowed to settle for. If you are not moving forward you are falling behind.

HiddenAg2 said:

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policywonk98 said:

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This year is not over. Like every year since 1993 I'm rooting for our team to get to the cup with a chance to bring it home, but I'm getting pretty impatient now that we are in an era where UNC is beatable and I've watched Stanford, Penn State, USC, UCLA, Florida State, Duke, Notre Dame, West Virginia, and Virgina all play for titles in the last 7-8 years when we've fielded some of our most talented teams in program history.

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I think this sums up where some of the fans are right now. It is frustrating but there is really nothing that can be done about it except hope that Coach G and Phil figure it out one day. They are locked into new contracts for a long time to come and no AD in the country would make a coaching change when you make 24 consecutive NCAA tournaments. As a non-revenue sport, there is no real pressure to win at an elite level. You only need to make the tournament on a consistent basis. Basically I look at Coach G as soccer's R.C. Slocum. Good coach with consistent winning at a Top 15-25 level, but really not able to win the big national match-ups in the tourney to enter the elite level and compete for national titles. And for a large contingent (majority) of fans that is perfectly fine. I do think that there will be one season in the next 10 years that we'll make a magical run to the title game but whether we win that game is 50/50 at best.

To be fair and to CDub06's point, no one really expected big things from this team in 2018 as it was seen as a rebuilding year. They surprised us early with some athletic play and the addition of Asdis really helped ease the loss of Harvey. But from what we've seen now, I do expect that this should be able to get a #2 seed and make a run in the tournament as it's more wide open this year than any year I can ever remember. Stanford is good but they are beatable in the right circumstances.

My biggest complaint is when you have unexpected losses in the 2nd round when you have borderline elite teams, there is no real accountability or follow-up from the coaches to the fans in form of at least acknowledging/apologizing for the loss and vowing to get better in the future. Maybe we aren't entitled to that but it would go a long way to soothe the fan base after crushing losses, especially the diehard fans. Other coaches at A&M do this routinely following difficult losses in the postseason to keep the fans engaged. The perception here is to just quickly move on to next season and forget what happened. It just rubs me the wrong way. Maybe I'm alone in that assessment.

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You have hated G since the early 2000s - especially when he called you out. Nothing has changed.

I cannot fathom the basis for the weekly anonymous diatribes against G and Phil. The folks who fund the majority of this program and who make an effort to do things like travel to away games and show support are very happy with the quality of PEOPLE attracted to this program and the performance of those PEOPLE on and off the field. The players, coaches and staff of Aggie Soccer are continually terrific representatives of the Aggie core values. They get good grades, serve their communities, demonstrate selfless service to their teammates and classmates, and go out of their way to show compassion and support to so many people around them. In addition, these PEOPLE make up the team that is in the small group of national powers in this sport literally every year. Wow, I'm so thankful for adult leadership at the TAMU Athletics Department administration and coaching level.

Carnwellag2 said:

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HiddenAg2 said:

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policywonk98 said:

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This year is not over. Like every year since 1993 I'm rooting for our team to get to the cup with a chance to bring it home, but I'm getting pretty impatient now that we are in an era where UNC is beatable and I've watched Stanford, Penn State, USC, UCLA, Florida State, Duke, Notre Dame, West Virginia, and Virgina all play for titles in the last 7-8 years when we've fielded some of our most talented teams in program history.

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I think this sums up where some of the fans are right now. It is frustrating but there is really nothing that can be done about it except hope that Coach G and Phil figure it out one day. They are locked into new contracts for a long time to come and no AD in the country would make a coaching change when you make 24 consecutive NCAA tournaments. As a non-revenue sport, there is no real pressure to win at an elite level. You only need to make the tournament on a consistent basis. Basically I look at Coach G as soccer's R.C. Slocum. Good coach with consistent winning at a Top 15-25 level, but really not able to win the big national match-ups in the tourney to enter the elite level and compete for national titles. And for a large contingent (majority) of fans that is perfectly fine. I do think that there will be one season in the next 10 years that we'll make a magical run to the title game but whether we win that game is 50/50 at best.

To be fair and to CDub06's point, no one really expected big things from this team in 2018 as it was seen as a rebuilding year. They surprised us early with some athletic play and the addition of Asdis really helped ease the loss of Harvey. But from what we've seen now, I do expect that this should be able to get a #2 seed and make a run in the tournament as it's more wide open this year than any year I can ever remember. Stanford is good but they are beatable in the right circumstances.

My biggest complaint is when you have unexpected losses in the 2nd round when you have borderline elite teams, there is no real accountability or follow-up from the coaches to the fans in form of at least acknowledging/apologizing for the loss and vowing to get better in the future. Maybe we aren't entitled to that but it would go a long way to soothe the fan base after crushing losses, especially the diehard fans. Other coaches at A&M do this routinely following difficult losses in the postseason to keep the fans engaged. The perception here is to just quickly move on to next season and forget what happened. It just rubs me the wrong way. Maybe I'm alone in that assessment.

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You have hated G since the early 2000s - especially when he called you out. Nothing has changed.

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Wrong. I don't hate Coach G at all. I actually like him personally, he is a good man. He is a good coach. My only point is that I'm not sure he is able to get A&M to a truly elite level and compete for national titles. No one is seriously advocating making a change. I actually think he can get there with a slight uptick in recruiting. We just have to figure out how to beat out UCLA, Stanford, UNC, Duke, and Virginia for a few of those elite prospects every year.

As far as calling me out, I haven't spoken to Coach G in about 7-8 years. The last time I had a conversation with him it was a friendly one. If he doesn't like me, that's fine. Doesn't bother me at all. I know he doesn't like any criticism at all, but I'm still going to give brief thoughts, both positive and negative, on games and where I believe the team is at and where it needs to improve. That's called being a fan. I actually believe I'm pretty supportive overall, especially as compared to some more recent posters on this board.

redd38 said:

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HiddenAg2 said:

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What exactly is missing for us to be the next Florida State, Penn State, or UCLA?

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What exactly is missing for those teams to be the next Texas A&M? We have better facilities, more fans, better atmosphere, better access to the team. A national title would be great, but I wouldn't trade places with any of those teams to go to boring games to see a couple extra wins per year.

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Obviously I'm talking about their soccer programs specifically. A&M does have better facilities, more fans, and a better atmosphere than those schools, which is exactly why I'm asking the question. The only way to move up from our current level is to elevate recruiting to the point where we can land 1-2 Top 30 prospects every year. We're not quite at that level yet. So we have to find a way to convince a few more kids to come to A&M instead of Penn State, Florida State, and UCLA, all similar big state schools who also don't have the scholarship advantages of being a private school like Stanford and Duke, which can offer additional money as we've documented in our own state with TCU in baseball.

Giggem said:

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I cannot fathom the basis for the weekly anonymous diatribes against G and Phil. The folks who fund the majority of this program and who make an effort to do things like travel to away games and show support are very happy with the quality of PEOPLE attracted to this program and the performance of those PEOPLE on and off the field. The players, coaches and staff of Aggie Soccer are continually terrific representatives of the Aggie core values. They get good grades, serve their communities, demonstrate selfless service to their teammates and classmates, and go out of their way to show compassion and support to so many people around them. In addition, these PEOPLE make up the team that is in the small group of national powers in this sport literally every year. Wow, I'm so thankful for adult leadership at the TAMU Athletics Department administration and coaching level.

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I want to make it clear that I am NOT one of these people. I think I write maybe one post a year in response to others about making a coaching change, usually saying it would never happen and we need to focus more on recruiting elite talent. I would not be in favor of a coaching change. If I were AD I would work with Coach G to give him whatever else he needs to compete with the elite schools in recruiting and facilities, etc.

I really, really hope that's true, Hidden. I also wish you'd uncloak and join up with us who know each other because we travel together, support each other, etc. I see consistent negativity and a consistent theme of "well, this team's gonna underperform again because of G" in your posts, Hidden. You express a view that a coaching change is THE critical key to winning a national championship. But you're enough of a sports fan to know it's much, much more complicated than that, and requires quite a bit of good fortune along the way (e.g., no key injuries, a favorable draw, great team chemistry, etc.). It's unsettling that because you post a lot and write long posts some people seem to think you're the definitive voice on Aggie Soccer. My wish is that you'll take that to heart and seek to inject some more positive energy into folks. This is a non-revenue sport made up of KIDS who are playing because they love the sport, not because they are looking to get rich on draft day. Call me a sunshine pumper if you want, but I'm gonna build them (and the coaches) up, not tear them down.

Sorry. I pushed the post button before typing. This thread started the night of the Mississippi game. Since then we scored 8 goals in 2 games and got back to #2 in the RPI which is where we were before the Arkansas game. Seems like the team realized we need to play better sooner. I think all of the posters on this thread see that we can play better because we want the players to reach their goal of winning twice at the College Cup.

I got off the TexAgs Forums about 5 yrs ago because of personal attacks and general lack of civility by some of the contributors. This tread has remained civil and seems to be an ongoing discussion. I've been a season ticket holder for many many yrs so I though I'd add some information.

I don't know if this has been discussed before but I it may be worth repeating. At a resent Tuesday night Soccer Show at Rudy's, Coach G talked a bit about the scholarship realities within Women's D1 Soccer programs. From Coach Gs explanation, public universities in Texas are under a disadvantage when compared to some other state schools and a significant disadvantage when compared to private schools such as Notre Dame and Stanford. I think he said all players at Georgia are on a full ride. Maybe someone else who was at that show can give more information and detail. The realities of scholarship athletes has a direct impact on getting to the elite level every year.

I believe in some SEC school states, a resident who gets a certain grade average in high school is able to get free tuition. This means that more athletic scholarship money is available for out of state players or players who don't have those high school grades. I think G has 14 scholarships to split amongst 22 to 25 players. This becomes a big factor in sports that have a lot of players on partial scholarships.

Yep, it's quite rare for one of our soccer players to have a full ride via an athletic scholarship. These kids are here because they want to play for Texas A&M, not because they've been offered more monetary support.

Giggem said:

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Yep, it's quite rare for one of our soccer players to have a full ride via an athletic scholarship. These kids are here because they want to play for Texas A&M, not because they've been offered more monetary support.

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Didn't know about the scholarship situation... interesting to wonder what else affects recruiting that is really not under a coach's control.

Some factors that might fit that:

• History: Some of the elite programs have been around in women's soccer longer than ours. There's a positive feedback in what is in their displays of team history.
• Conference opponents: my sense is that this took a big step upward when we moved to the SEC. Looking back at the history of Big12 women's soccer, most of the champs aren't even in the conference anymore (us and Nebraska).
• Academics: my totally anecdotal sense is that the non-revenue athletes are more serious about academics than the revenue athletes. Of HiddenAg2's list of elite teams, only Florida State is below us in the US news rankings. Add teams like UNC and Notre Dame and it gets worse.
• In-state vs out of state talent. I'm thinking we seem to have more high quality players from Texas than in some past years. Is that true? Looking at U17 players on Top Drawer Soccer, it seems like for its size our state doesn't put that many players on the roster.
• University branding/reputation. A lot of our traditions area associated with Agriculture or the military. I've been here long enough to appreciate the special nature of A&M (as Gates put it), but I'm not sure how appealing it is to HS recruits in women's soccer. I think the SEC network showing the atmosphere at Ellis field probably helps vs just seeing CTs in the crowd at Kyle on TV.
• What they see on the rest of campus during visits. The athletics facilities are going to be great, but how do they react to the rest of the campus. Do they see Heldenfels? BSBE? Does the fact that we have to have 20 minutes between classes because we're so spread out compare favorably to the campuses of our competitors? Does the industrial park architecture of W. Campus appeal to recruits?

Don't get me wrong. I love it here. But it took some getting used to. Are any of these major? Probably not. But the recruiting I've been involved in for faculty hires or grad students is similar. There's no single easy thing to point to, but a lot of things add up.

Also, none of this means we should settle long term for less than the best.

Just looking at the NCAA stats. We lead the nation in total goals with 42 and are 3rd in goals per game at 2.8. We haven't had any real blowout games with the most goals being 4 and we have done that 4 times.

You might include climate on your list. Some girls would probably rather play in a place where it isn't 100+ for much of the season/camp.

Gosh these all sound like things that any coach on campus could use to explain why he/she can't be expected to compete forr national championships. Does G get a bye because he's been here 26 years?

DogCompany74 said:

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Gosh these all sound like things that any coach on campus could use to explain why he/she can't be expected to compete forr national championships. Does G get a bye because he's been here 26 years?

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Yes, most non-revenue sports deal with the same issues. And as has been discussed G isn't getting a pass because of his tenure he earns his job every year. If there ever comes a year when that's not true then we can talk about giving him a pass based on tenure, but we haven't even had that opportunity yet.

Well let's keep reaching for those stars.

I'll tell Pat Henry he can take it easy. Quit sweating the little things Gary Blair. AD can sponsor workshops each summer featuring Coach G and Rob Childress talking about " Fishing for National Championshios - the big ones that got away." ( Or never even got a bite)

Big difference. Both Blair and Henry won national championships within five years of coming here. After 27 years it appears most on here just give Coach G a pass because of all of the " reasons" listed.

If we desire accuracy Blair came in 2003 and didn't win the NC until 2011. And still there are a bunch of posters calling for him to be fired.

Aggie1205 said:

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If we desire accuracy Blair came in 2003 and didn't win the NC until 2011. And still there are a bunch of posters calling for him to be fired.

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I'd say some posters. But this is a big site, there will always be the fire everyone posters. Ignore them and move on.

I would say many posters on this site have had issues with Blair's recruiting and roster mgt, some poster will translate that into fire the coach. But that's not an accurate statement.

BQ_90 said:

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Aggie1205 said:

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If we desire accuracy Blair came in 2003 and didn't win the NC until 2011. And still there are a bunch of posters calling for him to be fired.

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I'd say some posters. But this is a big site, there will always be the fire everyone posters. Ignore them and move on.

I would say many posters on this site have had issues with Blair's recruiting and roster mgt, some poster will translate that into fire the coach. But that's not an accurate statement.

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The Blair situation is different in that one of his former assistants at A&m who is an Ag has turned a much lesser school into a national contender in just a couple years while we have declined as blair is nearing retirement. We may have missed the opportunity to bring Vic home and we are not going to find a better coach when blair retires. I love blair but we are on the downslope after the peak.
G has seemingly plateaued one step or so from the top. The consistency is amazing, with some minor tweaks it seems a NC is attainable. We are definetely not trending down, and unlikely to get a better coach.
Anyone calling for a coaches head needs to name replacements.

but on this site any criticism of a coach means you want them fired. It's to the point of there are 2 sides with no middle ground, either you 100% koolaid drinker or fire the coach.

Fire ? Not necessarily. But every coach on campus needs to answer the question," What did you do to get us closer to a national championship?" In G's case 25+ years is sufficient time to be able to at least give a time frame.