Operation Mincemeat

3,688 Views | 23 Replies | Last: 1 yr ago by BQ78
Tanya 93
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I never knew about this until my boyfriend Colin Firth started in a movie of the same name on Netflix.

I have now ordered 2 books about this because this is so freaking fascinating to me

Deceit and misleading clues at its finest.

Watch this. It is really, really good
whoop1995
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I heard about this some 20 years ago and yes fascinating operation. I want to say it was in a readers digest or something like that. To keep secrets like that for so long in all incredible.

The Germans had their own secrets as well. My grandpa told me stories about World War Two when he was close to dying and I about freaked out. The jist of the story was that a unit liberated or aided a pow camp that had money printing presses printing off fake currency from USA and England. An entire pow camp dedicated to printing fake money. Stacks of fake money and the presses were discovered. He didn't say if he was involved in the operation but only that he knew about it.

There is another story that I read about a longtime ago that a movie hasn't been made about where I believe the English forces are in Africa and need to fool Rommel as to the size and direction of their forces.

The English army then makes fake tanks out of wood and some out of inflatables. They make like 2000 fake inflatable and wooden tanks. They also recorded sounds and blasted them out of the tanks in order to make the deception more real.

Rommel and the German high command were busy with the fake armies and didn't notice the real deployment operation going on in Europe I think.

Deception everywhere on both sides - fascinating stuff that makes me always wonder what the same organizations are doing now within our own government.


CanyonAg77
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I think you are confusing. North Africa with the D-Day invasion of Normandy. An entire fake army, with inflatables, false radio traffic, etc was stationed across from Calais, to convince Rommel that the invasion would take place there.

To be fair, it's possible that similar things were tried in Africa
cavscout96
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Patton's Ghost Army
CanyonAg77
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And to the OP, I didn't recognize the name, but I remembered the operation when I googled. As with another poster, my first exposure was a Readers Digest book or article
BQ78
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The original movie and book were The Man Who Never Was from the 50s.

I think this Colin Firth film is at least the third version of the story from Hollywood.
danieljustin06
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The fake armies were for both. And there Nazis fell for it both times. World War Two channel on YouTube talked about the Africa campaign one recently.
CanyonAg77
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Thanks
Tanya 93
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BQ78 said:

The original movie and book were The Man Who Never Was from the 50s.

I think this Colin Firth film is at least the third version of the story from Hollywood.
Well it was swoon worthy and the only one I have seen


And I didn't know Ian Fleming was a Naval Officer
whoop1995
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CanyonAg77 said:

I think you are confusing. North Africa with the D-Day invasion of Normandy. An entire fake army, with inflatables, false radio traffic, etc was stationed across from Calais, to convince Rommel that the invasion would take place there.

To be fair, it's possible that similar things were tried in Africa
I read a book along time ago about it and heard the movie right to the book were bought by Tom cruise - it has been some years. Just looked it up but I have never seen it.
https://collider.com/benedict-cumberbatch-the-war-magician/

So I just did some research and we were both right!!!

http://www.historyofwar.org/articles/operation_bertram.html#google_vignette Did a little digging and this is in Africa

And

https://www.iwm.org.uk/history/d-days-parachuting-dummies-and-inflatable-tanks

It worked so well that d day they were also used - never knew about d day usage so thank you for the knowledge.


whoop1995
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Tanya 93 said:

BQ78 said:

The original movie and book were The Man Who Never Was from the 50s.

I think this Colin Firth film is at least the third version of the story from Hollywood.
Well it was swoon worthy and the only one I have seen


And I didn't know Ian Fleming was a Naval Officer
Yes the James Bond tie in threw me for a loop as well!!
whoop1995
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danieljustin06 said:

The fake armies were for both. And there Nazis fell for it both times. World War Two channel on YouTube talked about the Africa campaign one recently.
Sorry didn't see your earlier post. But have viewed the you tube channel and that was incredible at the the least.
BQ78
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Yeah but he wasn't as bad ass as Marshall Dillon (James Arness) who took a round in the leg as one of the first off a landing craft at Anzio. Or Charles Bronson who survived 25 missions as a tail gunner in a B-29 (received a Purple Heart) or Wayne Morris who was an ace in the war then came home and played one of the biggest cowards of movie history in Kubrick's "Paths of Glory."
Maximus_Meridius
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Or Jimmy Stewart, a B-24 pilot in the 445th Bomber group in Europe.
JABQ04
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Or Lee Marvin who was seriously wounded in Saipan and buried at Arlington.
USAFAg
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If interested in the deception part of WWII read "Bodyguard of Lies" by Anthony Cave Brown.


Quote:

Bodyguard of Lies opens with an introduction to Ultra, the codename for decrypted signals intelligence. It goes on to document the origins of the London Controlling Section (LCS) and the work of Dudley Clarke in the Middle East. In late 1942, Allied high command in London became aware of Clarke's successes during the North African Campaign. Based on his theories of deception, the LCS was created under Colonel John Bevan and granted broad powers to plan deception strategy. The introduction finishes with a discussion of how the Allies evolved deception strategy prior to 1943, including the Double-Cross System (the Allied system of double agents). The second section of the book introduces the German intelligence forces, in particular Admiral Canaris and his Abwehr intelligence agency. Brown discusses early deceptions, such as those surrounding Operation Torch, conducted against the Germans, and how the Abwehr struggled to decipher the information it was being fed.

The third section of the book covers Allied deceptions during 1943, in particular Operation Mincemeat. Brown introduces Plan Jael, the early revision of Operation Bodyguard, and follows Bevan's work in creating the deception plan.[1] The fourth section covers the events of early 1944, leading up to the Normandy landings on 6 June. In particular, Brown discusses Operation Fortitude and the fictional First US Army Group, a key part of Bodyguard, calling it "the greatest charade in history".[5] The final section of the book covers events on and after D-Day, including physical deceptions carried out on the night of the invasion, and the continued impact of Bodyguard in the months after the landings.

12thFan/Websider Since 2003
DogCo84
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There's a pretty good documentary on Amazon Prime about the US Army's 23rd Headquarters Special Troops. Their formation/birth in 1944 and later combat activity in Europe.

The Ghost Army (2013)
Texarkanaag69
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Tanya 93 said:

I never knew about this until my boyfriend Colin Firth started in a movie of the same name on Netflix.

I have now ordered 2 books about this because this is so freaking fascinating to me

Deceit and misleading clues at its finest.

Watch this. It is really, really good
Just watched the movie on Netflix. I believe the Brits were trying to fool the Krauts about landing in Greece or Sicily. I'd never heard of it. But apparently it was a success, completely fooled 'em and was a BIG deal and remained classified for years after the war. I think Ian Fleming may have on that team.
TheSheik
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W.E.B. Griffin in one of his Men at War books
https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/411987.The_Double_Agents

has the Spies involved setting up a floating dead guys full of clues and misdirection
P.H. Dexippus
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Quote:

Operation Mincemeat took its cue from one of 12 detective novels written by Basil Thomson. Thomson, who had been head of the CID and a First World War spycatcher, was perhaps more convincing as a mystery writer than as a detective. He had cleared Mata Hari of espionage, and he attempted to smear the Irish patriot Roger Casement as a homosexual. But his Milliner's Hat Mystery provided the inspiration for what might be one of the most effective acts of deception in World War Two. 'The novel opens on a stormy night with the discovery of a dead man in a barn, carrying papers that identify him as "John Whitaker",' Macintyre writes. 'By dint of some distinctly plodding detective work, Inspector Richardson discovers that every document in the pockets of the dead man has been ingeniously forged: his visiting cards, his bills, and even his passport, on which the real name has been erased using a special ink remover, and a fake one substituted.' The idea of using a corpse to plant false clues lodged itself in the imagination of a young naval intelligence officer, Lieutenant Commander Ian Fleming.

In the first month of the war, Fleming and his chief at naval intelligence, Admiral Godfrey, compiled a list of possible deceptions they called the 'Trout Memo'.

More background:
https://www.lrb.co.uk/the-paper/v32/n14/charles-glass/whose-body
Martin Cash
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JABQ04 said:

Or Lee Marvin who was seriously wounded in Saipan the ass and buried at Arlington.
FIFY
The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but the heart of the fool to the left. Ecclesiastes 10:2
$240 Worth of Pudding
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Or Charles Durning who stormed Omaha beach in the first wave of D-Day (he was the second man off his landing craft…the first and third were killed) and fought in the Battle of The Bulge.
Injured by a mine in the Bocage, took a bayonet to the chest in The Ardennes and killed his attacker with a rock. Was captured and survived the Malmedy massacre.
Was awarded the Silver Star, Bronze Star, and three Purple Hearts. He is also buried in Arlington National Cemetery.
insulator_king
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BQ78 said:

The original movie and book were The Man Who Never Was from the 50s.

I think this Colin Firth film is at least the third version of the story from Hollywood.
Yes, I remember buying the book sometime around 6th grade from Scholastic Book Services.
Loved it, and re-read it multiple times.

I think it played a small part in influencing my desire to be in the military when I was older.
BQ78
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Me too, loved when the little 4 page catalog came from them so you could order books. Great prices for great books.

The month I got that book, I also got HG Welles' Time Machine.
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