Really interesting even if you don't care much for that time period.

Some things I learned outside of his main argument of course about Stuart and his relationship with some of his officers.

• The second largest city in the south at any given point was where ever the Union Army was currently camped
• NY City manufactured more than the entire south
• Confederate GDP was only 8% of the nations economy
• The souths largest gun maker made 30K weapons during the entire war where as the Springfield Armory made 15K weapons a month
• 22 million people in the north vs. 9 million in the south
• 4 million of the south's 9M were slaves

His comments on Stuarts command decisions being based on rivalries with two of his subordinates were very interesting. Especially the fact that he and one of them were both romantically involved with the same woman.

Thanks for posting that!

Haven't watched the video but JEB was married and not a philanderer, unless you count flirting. While there was a bit of a rivalry with Wade Hampton (Wade was not West Point and not a Virginian, he was also a happily married man too) their relationship did not affect their ability to work together on operations and in fact Stuart hand-picked him as his second in command. Of course, I'm assuming Wade is the so-called rival for some woman. That part of your post makes me dubious of what other things are said. All your bulleted points are right on though.

His wife was previously engaged to one of his subordinates.

It wasn't Wade Hamilton, it was "Grumble" somebody.

Grumble Jones, I would say they are overplaying things to say Flora played much of a role in their feuds. Jones pretty much disliked Stuart and Stuart did not reciprocate until Jones was unsubordinately disrespectful and was court martialed. Jones was one of the brigades of cavalry left with Lee during the Gettysburg Campaign leading Ewell's Corps into Pennsylvania. Jones was good on his own but a terrible subordinate, especially with Stuart, whom he never liked. Jones had little effect on any failure of Stuart's during the campaign. Unless you blame him for leaving Jones with Lee because Jones hated Stuart.

He assigned Robertson and Jones, 2/5 of his command, to guard the gaps into the Shenandoah and protect Lee's rear. De facto they were "left" with Lee when Stuart got cut off from Lee.

The Flora/Jones engagement story got me researching and I see no evidence of them having a romance. Stuart became engaged to her when she came home still a teenager from a northern girl's school, to the chagrin of her father Philip St. George Cooke. No evidence of a hint of romance with Jones.

Thank you. Excellent summary.

Never heard that about Robertson either. I based my look on Flora's love life and JEB seems to have been the only man in the serious love department for her. Sure would like to know his source, but I think on that exact point he is #fakehistory.

I was just going to post the above paragraph and leave it alone but decided to check with Eric Wittenberg, who is an eastern cavalry author/expert. He said he has heard of this War College guy and his making that claim but not being able to back it up. Eric has never found anything like that in any of his research.

Now Robertson was a guy Stuart detested as opposed to Jones, who he appreciated until he was insubordinate to the point Stuart couldn't take it any longer. Robertson was the biggest screw up in the Confederate cavalry department during the Gettysburg Campaign. He only briefly covered Lee's rear before abandoning the gaps into the valley and heading south. Pretty much was the end of his Confederate career, while Jones lived a little longer to fight for the south until his death leading a charge at Piedmont in the spring. His death day might have been his best day in the Confederate Army or second best to his performance at Brandy Station.

I also don't think Stuart intended just to leave Robertson and Jones with Lee, it just happened that way when the Union army separated Stuart and the other three brigades from Lee. Lee is just as much to blame for this event as he gave Stuart the discretion to move toward Washington, as he exercised that discretion, when he got cut off. If Lee had wanted all of Stuart's command to screen his movements he should not have given Stuart that discretion. It's like Ewell not capturing Culp's and Cemetery Hill, Lee gave him the discretion and he exercised it. The Lost Cause-ers did a good job of casting blame to all of Lee's subordinates and absolving the top man of all blame but as Eric Wittenberg's book title says there was Plenty of Blame to Go Around.

Too bad there is not a reference.

Robertson was stationed with and tight with her dad , Phillip St. George Cooke, in the pre-war army but that is the only fact that supports a chance for him to court her. Nesbitt's Scapegoat says that the army rumors talked about a romance as a way of saying that is why they did not like each other but that it was only rumor as far as he could tell.

So the OP video was interesting as far as it went, then that guy handed off to another lecturer....and the video ended.

Is there a link to the next guy's talk?

Brief sidetrack here...if the confederates would have pressed to DC following first Manassas do you think the north would have pressed for peace then or would they have fled (moved the he government) and kept fighting?

Moved and kept fighting. They were already worried about Maryland seceding and leaving DC untenable

Madman said:

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• The second largest city in the south at any given point was where ever the Union Army was currently camped
• NY City manufactured more than the entire south
• Confederate GDP was only 8% of the nations economy
• The souths largest gun maker made 30K weapons during the entire war where as the Springfield Armory made 15K weapons a month
• 22 million people in the north vs. 9 million in the south
• 4 million of the south's 9M were slaves

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Yet it took four years to subjugate the south.

Must have more been to it than these numbers.

RC,

Can you help a brother out and describe who is in that group photo? Assuming former confederate soldiers...

If so, any idea who it is?

can't get enough of this...thanks...any more?

I will look later. They have many videos up but not organized well.

XUSCR said:

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RC,

Can you help a brother out and describe who is in that group photo? Assuming former confederate soldiers...

If so, any idea who it is?

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It was the 1918 Confederate Veterans reunion in Dallas. That is all the information describing the photo.

Rabid Cougar said:

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Madman said:

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• The second largest city in the south at any given point was where ever the Union Army was currently camped
• NY City manufactured more than the entire south
• Confederate GDP was only 8% of the nations economy
• The souths largest gun maker made 30K weapons during the entire war where as the Springfield Armory made 15K weapons a month
• 22 million people in the north vs. 9 million in the south
• 4 million of the south's 9M were slaves

---

Yet it took four years to subjugate the south.

Must have more been to it than these numbers.

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The North has to capture and hold vast amounts of typically underdeveloped territory. The Confederacy just had to keep existing.

AgBQ-00 said:

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Brief sidetrack here...if the confederates would have pressed to DC following first Manassas do you think the north would have pressed for peace then or would they have fled (moved the he government) and kept fighting?

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Washington wasn't undefended during the battle (though hardly a fortress). It's hard to imagine the Confederate army left after Bull Run successfully capturing and holding the city.

Dr. Watson said:

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AgBQ-00 said:

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Brief sidetrack here...if the confederates would have pressed to DC following first Manassas do you think the north would have pressed for peace then or would they have fled (moved the he government) and kept fighting?

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Washington wasn't undefended during the battle (though hardly a fortress). It's hard to imagine the Confederate army left after Bull Run successfully capturing and holding the city.

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Agreed, but the Rebels didn't necessarily need to go capture Washington DC in order to win the war. All they really needed was for the Union to grow so war weary that they no longer had the stomach for it. The president was already feeling the pressure. In my opinion a more interesting "what if" scenario would have been this: Had Lee not charged the Union center on day 3 at Gettysburg (resulting in the slaughter of Pickett's entire corps) and remained entrenched in the town, or even fallen back to more defend-able positions elsewhere in Pennsylvania (towards Harrisburg?), forcing the union to pursue them, what would the result have been? This would have allowed Lee to fight with a rested JEB Stuart's Cavalry and a fighting force of similar size. The Union may still have thrown so many numbers at them eventually and possibly cut off the supply lines that it probably wouldn't have mattered, but you never know what could have happened if the rebels had had a longer campaign fighting on Union ground. I cant imagine what stress Lincoln was under during this time (and Lee as well).

Dr. Watson said:

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AgBQ-00 said:

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Brief sidetrack here...if the confederates would have pressed to DC following first Manassas do you think the north would have pressed for peace then or would they have fled (moved the he government) and kept fighting?

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Washington wasn't undefended during the battle (though hardly a fortress). It's hard to imagine the Confederate army left after Bull Run successfully capturing and holding the city.

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Did they really need to hold?

The accounts I've read was of the Union Army and civilian spectators fleeing back to D.C. in a panic. One wonders if the CS Army had simply chased them through the streets of DC, then retreated to Virginia, what the political climate of the North would have been.