I'd also note that in the contemporary American mind, colonial America is probably a short blurb of time before the Revolutionary War. The fact is that it stretched for hundreds of years, and is easily neglected unless you target some reading to it. I want to know so much more about New England during those years, but damn if you don't come across a reference to witch burning in Salem at every turn.

The Lost Battalion of Tet, Breakout of the 2/12th CAV at Hue

Charles Krohn

VanZandt92 said:

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I'd also note that in the contemporary American mind, colonial America is probably a short blurb of time before the Revolutionary War. The fact is that it stretched for hundreds of years, and is easily neglected unless you target some reading to it. I want to know so much more about New England during those years, but damn if you don't come across a reference to witch burning in Salem at every turn.

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Funny enough, the Salem craze was at least partially due to King William's War. One of the earliest accusers was a survivor of the Maine frontier who lost most of her family and wound up accusing folks like Burroughs, the minister, who were from the same area in Maine and had survived.

For reading about early New England warfare I recommend "The Name of War" by Lepore, "The Skulking Way of War" by Malone, "The Pequot War" by Cave, "European and Native American Warfare," by Starkey, "The Red King's Rebellion," by Bourne, "Natives and Newcomers," by Axtell (especially the article called "The Moral Dilemmas of Scalping"), and Slotkin's masterpiece, "Regeneration Through Violence."

Ian Fleming's " Thrilling Cities " . Entertaining - didn't like Vienna or it's people ! Cheap room rates - course

it was written in 60s .

Dr. Watson said:

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VanZandt92 said:

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I'd also note that in the contemporary American mind, colonial America is probably a short blurb of time before the Revolutionary War. The fact is that it stretched for hundreds of years, and is easily neglected unless you target some reading to it. I want to know so much more about New England during those years, but damn if you don't come across a reference to witch burning in Salem at every turn.

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Funny enough, the Salem craze was at least partially due to King William's War. One of the earliest accusers was a survivor of the Maine frontier who lost most of her family and wound up accusing folks like Burroughs, the minister, who were from the same area in Maine and had survived.

For reading about early New England warfare I recommend "The Name of War" by Lepore, "The Skulking Way of War" by Malone, "The Pequot War" by Cave, "European and Native American Warfare," by Starkey, "The Red King's Rebellion," by Bourne, "Natives and Newcomers," by Axtell (especially the article called "The Moral Dilemmas of Scalping"), and Slotkin's masterpiece, "Regeneration Through Violence."

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I have read about the Pequot War because my ancestors were involved apparently. I haven't read a specific volume on it yet. So I've really just read stuff online about it. Again, the complexities of the interaction of English colonists and multiple tribes make these things difficult to discern.

One of my ancestors was killed in King Phillips War. His name was William Cahoon and he had actually become a prisoner of war under Olver Cromwell before being shipped to New England. He had started a life for himself in New England after buying himself out of indenture.

This is an article about the 1650 Scottish prisoners of Dunbar, of whom William Cahoon was one:

https://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/regionals/north/2017/01/13/mystery-solved-the-scottish-soldiers-who-came-saugus-and-those-they-left-behind/dBNRzFtHQBsZyWNH5Xe8LI/story.html

As I said, this man was later killed by Indians during King Phillip's war. His son in law was also involved in King Phillips War.

I read an article about scalping over the last few years but I don't know where I saw it. It was discussing how widespread it was, but damn if I remember what specific geographic region it was talking aboutl.

Ok yep The Rhetoric of Scalping during the Revolutionary era:

https://allthingsliberty.com/2016/09/rhetoric-practice-scalping/

BigJim49 AustinNowDallas said:

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Ian Fleming's " Thrilling Cities " . Entertaining - didn't like Vienna or it's people ! Cheap room rates - course

it was written in 60s .

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Hmmm

Read Father Patrick Desbois' 'The Holocaust by Bullets' during a long weekend in New York. It covers a french priest's mission to locate thousands of mass graves in Ukraine where about 1.5 million jews were shot by the Germans and local militias. He interviewed hundreds of locals who, contrary to popular belief in the East, witnessed mass executions out in the open with no attempt to hide their deeds.

American Ulysses: A Life of Ulysses S. Grant by Ronald C. White. About 200 pages in, and pretty good so far. After this, I plan on reading Hamilton to see what the hype is all about.

Thanks. Finished The Fiery Trial last night. Have downloaded The Yankee Plague, The Templars, and Being Nixon so have to decide which to read.

Their Tattered Flags by Former Texas A&M Prexy Frank Vandiver . Very well written by a true Southern gentleman and a non-revisionist historian.

The Original AG 76 said:

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Their Tattered Flags by Former Texas A&M Prexy Frank Vandiver . Very well written by a true Southern gentleman and a non-revisionist historian.

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What exactly defines this in your mind? He holds to the Lost Cause?

Finished Richard Nixon by Farrell. A good book about a conflicted man.

Texas Blood by Hodge. Don't bother. The author losses his way about half way through it.

The Thin Light of Freedom. By Ayers. Great book. The authors takes a County in Va. and one in Penn. about the time of Gettysburg. Using diaries and primary sources he gives you a feel for what the people are thinking about the War, the armies, one another. It is a balanced approach. He carries the story through Reconstruction. I recommend it.

Up next are:
The Burr Conspriracy by Lewis
The Sword and the Shield by Andrew
Grey Wolf by Dunstan...just to see if it was possible for Hitler to make it to Argentina

In addition to Their Tattered Flags I'm also reading Rouge Heroes..A History of the SAS. Excellent so far. Very easy read and best book on the SAS I've read so far.
Highly recommend.
Rogue Heroes: The History of the SAS, Britain's Secret Special Forces Unit That Sabotaged the Nazis and Changed the Nature of War https://www.amazon.com/dp/1101904186?ref=yo_pop_ma_swf

Dr. Watson said:

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The Original AG 76 said:

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Their Tattered Flags by Former Texas A&M Prexy Frank Vandiver . Very well written by a true Southern gentleman and a non-revisionist historian.

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What exactly defines this in your mind? He holds to the Lost Cause?

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bump on this question. Can we address this civilly because I want to know.

Had a chance to meet Vandiver a couple of times and once discussed Their Tattered Flags with him. I always found his research to be very good and accurate. I would not get baited into an academic discussion about which historiography school he belonged to. By the by, I have added Yankee Plague to my reading list. Thanks

Aquin said:

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Had a chance to meet Vandiver a couple of times and once discussed Their Tattered Flags with him. I always found his research to be very good and accurate. I would not get baited into an academic discussion about which historiography school he belonged to. By the by, I have added Yankee Plague to my reading list. Thanks

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Thank you. I'm not a Civil War historian and only hit it peripherally, in part because of these discussions.

You won't be disappointed with Yankee Plague. I bought it on a whim after hearing a South Carolina podcast and it will probably be a book that I read more than once.

I got this one for Christmas. Lyman Draper was a famous historian who documented the 18th century

VanZandt92 said:

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Dr. Watson said:

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VanZandt92 said:

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I'd also note that in the contemporary American mind, colonial America is probably a short blurb of time before the Revolutionary War. The fact is that it stretched for hundreds of years, and is easily neglected unless you target some reading to it. I want to know so much more about New England during those years, but damn if you don't come across a reference to witch burning in Salem at every turn.

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Funny enough, the Salem craze was at least partially due to King William's War. One of the earliest accusers was a survivor of the Maine frontier who lost most of her family and wound up accusing folks like Burroughs, the minister, who were from the same area in Maine and had survived.

For reading about early New England warfare I recommend "The Name of War" by Lepore, "The Skulking Way of War" by Malone, "The Pequot War" by Cave, "European and Native American Warfare," by Starkey, "The Red King's Rebellion," by Bourne, "Natives and Newcomers," by Axtell (especially the article called "The Moral Dilemmas of Scalping"), and Slotkin's masterpiece, "Regeneration Through Violence."

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Back on this in a way, it turns out I have a grandmother (however many greats) who was put on trial for being a witch in Massachusetts. This was a few decades before the Salem witch trials. My mother sat me down and had me read about it over the Christmas holiday. I 'll try and create a separate post in this regard when I get a chance. My mom is like a walking encyclopedia. You just have to ask the right questions and she will open up.

cmiller00 said:

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Thanks. Finished The Fiery Trial last night. Have downloaded The Yankee Plague, The Templars, and Being Nixon so have to decide which to read.

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I really enjoyed Being Nixon!

I think that after watching Darkest Hour I am going to hit his History of World War 2 again. I was lucky to pick up a full First Edition set 30 or 40 years ago and have read them off and on for decades. Make some good stuck inside fireplace reading.

Have any of you ever dabbled in the captivity narratives of America? I have two, but I keep running across them so maybe I should read some more.

VanZandt92 said:

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Have any of you ever dabbled in the captivity narratives of America? I have two, but I keep running across them so maybe I should read some more.

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I worked with a ton from New England during my thesis and dissertation work. What have you read?

I taught sections of Mary Rowlandson's narrative for 20 years.

Dr. Watson said:

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VanZandt92 said:

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Have any of you ever dabbled in the captivity narratives of America? I have two, but I keep running across them so maybe I should read some more.

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I worked with a ton from New England during my thesis and dissertation work. What have you read?

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Uh oh. I think I'm going to fail as mine aren't the classic captivity narratives. So sorry.

So I'm kin to Mary Draper Ingles, as I indicated on a different post. Her son signed my grandfather's will. This was the son that survived the captivity obviously.






Additionally, this is one of my favorite books of 2017, Hodge's Scout. This is about a lost patrol of the French and Indian War. It is truly a compelling book with a variety of stories throughout. The book attempts to follow every prisoner and their fate.

OldArmy71 said:

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I taught sections of Mary Rowlandson's narrative for 20 years.

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That is pretty neat. I am going to read that. I have seen a video about it. (sorry sometimes that is how I access things as I'm not a historian)


We were researching and came upon this person, part of our Massachusetts family: On 19 Sept, 1677 Hannah Dickinson Gillett Jennings was captured, with two of her Gillett children, by Indians. They were taken to Canada, rescued later by her heroic husband, Stephen Jennings and others by the payment of 200 pounds ransom. Hannah reached home in June 1678 with her two Gillett children and her new born Jennings daughter named Captivity Jennings.

This is the signature of Thomas Ingles I have on a will. Thomas was the son of Mary Draper Ingles and he was ransomed back years later after being fully acculturated to the Shawnee. Our understanding is that he wouldn't even sleep under a cabin roof for a while after returning. Unfortunately later in life the Shawnee came to his frontier home and kidnapped his family. They were killed during a rescue attempt.

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Just ignore my above posts if you aren't into 18th century history guys. I get a little carried away.

"Struggle for Command: Longstreet and the First Corps out west" By Alex Mendoza. Pretty good read, shows how dysfunctional the first corp became during Chattanooga and the Knoxville campaign.

That is some neat family history.

Another book we read in my high school junior AP English class was "A Woman of the People," a novel loosely based on the Cynthia Ann Parker captivity. It was the least literary of anything we read, but the kids always loved it.

It's about 19th century captivities in Texas rather than the 18th century, but "The Captured" by Scott Zesch is excellent.

The whole captivity thing has always been very sad to me. To be ripped away from your comfort and family (Mary Rowlandson turns her experience into a Puritan sermon) and then, after years perhaps in which you have married into the tribe, you are again ripped away from all you know.

Wiener!

You know what, at TAMU I took a literature class that was early American literature. What it ended up being was colonial era sermons, in large part. Sad to say I don't remember the details, but I may have read that Rowlandson sermon. I wish I had kept materials from that class. There are so many things I took for granted in those heady days.