Hacksaw Ridge

5,675 Views | 25 Replies | Last: 6 yr ago by Marauder Blue 6
74OA
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You may have seen trailers for the recently released movie, "Hacksaw Ridge", which recounts some of the WWII exploits of Desmond Doss. FYI, here's his bio. Be sure and read the MOH citation.

COURAGE
Cardiac Saturday
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Sounds like he was one tough s.o.b.
gigemhilo
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Saw the movie this weekend - It was a little "hollywood" as far as the battle scenes and character interactions and all, but the magnitude of what the guy did on the battlefield was well displayed. It's amazing to think about what he did - on his own and without a weapon - in an area what was considered enemy occupied.
74OA
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Yeah, from reading his Medal of Honor citation, I'd say Doss had a fairly hectic May in 1945.....
gigemhilo
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It had been a while since I had the read the citation. I wish they had shown what really happened when he was wounded instead of the hollywood version. I feel like that was a big part of the story.

Of course, I am not a movie director and I am sure it would be difficult to show all he did. But, still, I feel like they did a good job of displaying his gallantry to a level that more than deserves our respect and admiration.
gigemhilo
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Also, in the movie, they did not allude AT ALL to his service in the Philippine campaign. There he was also awarded to Bronze Stars.
libertyag
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Thanks for posting. He was definitely a man's man. Hard to believe he did all that and didn't get killed. Pretty remarkable.
Kugelfang52
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I heard that Mel Gibson goes overboard on the violence. Kind of ironic with the focus of the film.
EMY92
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Is it possible to go overboard on the violence when depicting battles against the Japanese on Pacific islands?
Kugelfang52
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EMY92 said:

Is it possible to go overboard on the violence when depicting battles against the Japanese on Pacific islands?
Certainly. Does a film need to continually depict violence in order to represent it? The film is about a pacifist and yet it revels in bloody violence...a bit ironic at best, right?
Stive
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I'd take the opposite stance and say that it drove home his message even more. If I were a pacifist and saw some of the horrific ways my friends were dying, or saw some of the things that the Japanese were doing to the wounded while clearing a field after battle, I'd be WAY more tempted to pick up a gun and "protect" myself. Instead, he stayed resolute to his beliefs and continued to do his duty, both to the military and to God.
aalan94
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Really? Mel Gibson? Overboard on violence? No way!
Rabid Cougar
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EMY92 said:

Is it possible to go overboard on the violence when depicting battles against the Japanese on Pacific islands?
Probably still not even close as what it really was. Same for the combat scenes in "The Pacific".
Kugelfang52
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Stive said:

I'd take the opposite stance and say that it drove home his message even more. If I were a pacifist and saw some of the horrific ways my friends were dying, or saw some of the things that the Japanese were doing to the wounded while clearing a field after battle, I'd be WAY more tempted to pick up a gun and "protect" myself. Instead, he stayed resolute to his beliefs and continued to do his duty, both to the military and to God.
Certainly a valid perspective. Given Gibson's historical love of violence, I don't know that it was intentional though.

That said, I am excited to see the film and hope it is a good one.
CanyonAg77
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Finally watching this (part way through) thanks to free HBO weekend and a DVR. Looks good so far. If you've seen it or about to see it, I recommend reading "History vs. Hollywood" to help you separate the real from the made up.

http://www.historyvshollywood.com/reelfaces/hacksaw-ridge/

It also contains video of the real Doss.

So, back to the movie, I'm watching the scenes where he reports to a rifle company, Very confusing. He leaves home from enlisting, on his way to boot camp, already wearing a khaki uniform. Then when he gets to his barracks, he's wearing green fatigues. They seem to be in basic training, but not. I figure it's all Hollywood, don't expect continuity or common sense.

But here's my real question about those scenes. I refer to where their new Sargent, played by Vince Vaughn, walks into the barracks and meets the new recruits. I want to know:

Did R. Lee Emery sue Vince Vaughn for copyright infringement?

Oh. My. Gawd. Vaughn's scene was lifted almost verbatim from Full Metal Jacket. It was hard to watch with a straight face. It was like the director didn't give him any lines, he just handed him a DVD of FMJ, and said "Do what this guy does."


ABATTBQ87
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I enjoyed the movie; the ability to save wounded men, at night while avoiding the enemy was impressive.
Rabid Cougar
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CanyonAg77 said:

Finally watching this (part way through) thanks to free HBO weekend and a DVR. Looks good so far. If you've seen it or about to see it, I recommend reading "History vs. Hollywood" to help you separate the real from the made up.

http://www.historyvshollywood.com/reelfaces/hacksaw-ridge/

It also contains video of the real Doss.

So, back to the movie, I'm watching the scenes where he reports to a rifle company, Very confusing. He leaves home from enlisting, on his way to boot camp, already wearing a khaki uniform. Then when he gets to his barracks, he's wearing green fatigues. They seem to be in basic training, but not. I figure it's all Hollywood, don't expect continuity or common sense.

But here's my real question about those scenes. I refer to where their new Sargent, played by Vince Vaughn, walks into the barracks and meets the new recruits. I want to know:

Did R. Lee Emery sue Vince Vaughn for copyright infringement?

Oh. My. Gawd. Vaughn's scene was lifted almost verbatim from Full Metal Jacket. It was hard to watch with a straight face. It was like the director didn't give him any lines, he just handed him a DVD of FMJ, and said "Do what this guy does."



Is it possible to watch Vince Vaughn in any scene with a straight face? I kept waiting for him to say "ear muffs" the whole time.
Apache
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So who portrayed the better Drill Sergeant, Vince Vaughan or David Schwimmer (Band of Brothers?)

CanyonAg77
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Apache said:

So who portrayed the better Drill Sergeant, Vince Vaughan or David Schwimmer (Band of Brothers?)
Since Schwimmer's character was an officer, I'll have to go with Vince.
OldArmy71
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Saw this on HBO. Very intense. I didn't think it was that great a movie, but it is one heck of a story.

I did not really care for Vince Vaughn's portrayal. Did anyone else notice how large his head is? Every time I saw him in his steel pot, I did a double take. He looked as if he were wearing a kid's helmet.

Personal note: My grandfather was the medical officer on a troop ship off Okinawa and came very close to being killed by a kamikaze attack.
ABATTBQ87
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gigemhilo said:

Also, in the movie, they did not allude AT ALL to his service in the Philippine campaign. There he was also awarded to Bronze Stars.
Doss's Citation:

DOSS, DESMOND T.
Rank and organization:
Private First Class, U.S. Army, Medical Detachment, 307th Infantry, 77th Infantry Division.
Place and date: Near Urasoe Mura, Okinawa, Ryukyu Islands, 29 April-21 May 1945.
Entered service at: Lynchburg, Va. Birth: Lynchburg, Va. G.O. No.: 97, 1 November 1945.

Citation:
He was a company aid man when the 1st Battalion assaulted a jagged escarpment 400 feet high As our troops gained the summit, a heavy concentration of artillery, mortar and machinegun fire crashed into them, inflicting approximately 75 casualties and driving the others back. Pfc. Doss refused to seek cover and remained in the fire-swept area with the many stricken, carrying them 1 by 1 to the edge of the escarpment and there lowering them on a rope-supported litter down the face of a cliff to friendly hands.

On 2 May, he exposed himself to heavy rifle and mortar fire in rescuing a wounded man 200 yards forward of the lines on the same escarpment; and 2 days later he treated 4 men who had been cut down while assaulting a strongly defended cave, advancing through a shower of grenades to within 8 yards of enemy forces in a cave's mouth, where he dressed his comrades' wounds before making 4 separate trips under fire to evacuate them to safety.

On 5 May, he unhesitatingly braved enemy shelling and small arms fire to assist an artillery officer. He applied bandages, moved his patient to a spot that offered protection from small arms fire and, while artillery and mortar shells fell close by, painstakingly administered plasma. Later that day, when an American was severely wounded by fire from a cave, Pfc. Doss crawled to him where he had fallen 25 feet from the enemy position, rendered aid, and carried him 100 yards to safety while continually exposed to enemy fire.

On 21 May, in a night attack on high ground near Shuri, he remained in exposed territory while the rest of his company took cover, fearlessly risking the chance that he would be mistaken for an infiltrating Japanese and giving aid to the injured until he was himself seriously wounded in the legs by the explosion of a grenade. Rather than call another aid man from cover, he cared for his own injuries and waited 5 hours before litter bearers reached him and started carrying him to cover. The trio was caught in an enemy tank attack and Pfc. Doss, seeing a more critically wounded man nearby, crawled off the litter; and directed the bearers to give their first attention to the other man. Awaiting the litter bearers' return, he was again struck, this time suffering a compound fracture of 1 arm. With magnificent fortitude he bound a rifle stock to his shattered arm as a splint and then crawled 300 yards over rough terrain to the aid station. Through his outstanding bravery and unflinching determination in the face of desperately dangerous conditions Pfc. Doss saved the lives of many soldiers. His name became a symbol throughout the 77th Infantry Division for outstanding gallantry far above and beyond the call of duty.
ABATTBQ87
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Kugelfang52 said:

Stive said:

I'd take the opposite stance and say that it drove home his message even more. If I were a pacifist and saw some of the horrific ways my friends were dying, or saw some of the things that the Japanese were doing to the wounded while clearing a field after battle, I'd be WAY more tempted to pick up a gun and "protect" myself. Instead, he stayed resolute to his beliefs and continued to do his duty, both to the military and to God.
Certainly a valid perspective. Given Gibson's historical love of violence, I don't know that it was intentional though.

That said, I am excited to see the film and hope it is a good one.
History vs Hollywood: Hacksaw Ridge
Clem
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You know it is one of the greatest individual war stories ever told if they have to leave out true events because a movie audience won't believe it actually happened.
Cen-Tex
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The part when Smitty uses the top half of a dead GI as a shield while charging with his BAR w/one arm was a little over the top. The rifle weighed 16 lbs. My uncle was with the 77th and wounded on Okinawa. He mentioned the BAR being operated with two man teams.
JABQ04
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Was one man the AG on the BAR? Or ammo bearer? Wonder if two man teams were unique to particular units as I don't recall seeing that on diagrams of an Infantry squad before. Also wonder if it was due to the weapon operators size? In Iraq we had a SAW gunner, who was built like Michael Clark Duncan (of Armageddon and The Green Mile fame) who could wave that thing around and look like it was an M9. That dude was huge.
CanyonAg77
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Cen-Tex said:

The part when Smitty uses the top half of a dead GI as a shield while charging with his BAR w/one arm was a little over the top. The rifle weighed 16 lbs. My uncle was with the 77th and wounded on Okinawa. He mentioned the BAR being operated with two man teams.
John Basilone, USMC. Over the top, yes. Impossible, no.



Just finished the movie while exercising this morning. Lots of good parts, the best were interviews with the real Doss and his Captain at the end.

And yes, the blood and gore once they got to Hacksaw Ridge was more intense than Private Ryan. Mel Gibson is a great movie maker, but boy, does he have a screw loose.
Marauder Blue 6
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Cen-Tex said:

The part when Smitty uses the top half of a dead GI as a shield while charging with his BAR w/one arm was a little over the top. The rifle weighed 16 lbs. My uncle was with the 77th and wounded on Okinawa. He mentioned the BAR being operated with two man teams.
The 2nd person was nothing more than a mule to carry more magazines. 20 rds goes pretty quick at 600 rds/minute. Smitty was firing for suppression, not accuracy.
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