pn the History Channel.

@ 9:19pm there was a video of a helicopter pilot inside the helicopter and he was wearing a white helmet with a aTm on the back in maroon.

I was just about to post the same thing haha

During WWII an infantryman averaged 10 days of combat in one year

During Vietnam an infantryman averaged 240 days of combat in one year

[This message has been edited by ABATTBQ87 (edited 11/8/2011 9:36p).]

...but I thought they were all just pretend soldiers!

Abatt:

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During WWII an infantryman averaged 10 days of combat in one year

During Vietnam an infantryman averaged 240 days of combat in one year

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I saw that too and call BS, based on what differing definitions of combat for the two?

I thought the first tow parts were good but not as good as the World War II equivalent series. They seem to be reusing a lot of the stock footage in this one and it is already getting repetitive. But hey its history on History and that is a good thing.

BQ78, do you think that the helicopter pilot is a BQ, due to the treble cleft used for the "&" between A & M?

Bet you're right it doesn't look like an ampersand but rather a treble clef. Back in that day a block T with the treble clef was the band logo, ala Band Sweaters thruogh the ages (although my dad's is maroon on white versus white on maroon as ours are).

quote:

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I saw that too and call BS, based on what differing definitions of combat for the two?

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Just a thought...is it possible that with a much smaller active military in the late 60's/early 70's that this moved the "average" up quite a bit? During Vietnam, you didn't have as many occupying forces holding England, Italy, France (after 1944), all of the islands that had been cleared in the Pacific? So the soldiers that were in the military during that time were over there serving?

Maybe? Not saying that's it...just trying to figure out how they came to that number.

Thought the segment on the battle for hill 875 was very good. Cannot imagine being a soldier ordered to conquer a hill, losing friends in the process, only to leave it once taken. The men who served in Vietnam are genuine heros.

Vietnam = Quicksand.
Those Vets need to be honored in so many, many ways.

I tried to watch it tonight but just couldn't. I grew up in the 60's...and my older brother spent a year in Viet Nam...and four of my first cousins...served as well. They all came home...but over the years the stories came out.

I'll never forget Thursday nights...that's when the government would announce on the evening news the number of Americans killed that week. Sometimes the number was 500 or more...per week!

I'm sure it is a great series. But I wonder if people over the age of 55 are watching it.

quote:

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Bet you're right it doesn't look like an ampersand but rather a treble clef. Back in that day a block T with the treble clef was the band logo, ala Band Sweaters thruogh the ages (although my dad's is maroon on white versus white on maroon as ours are).

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I would agree, I was 99% sure that was a BQ when I saw the image. It would be pretty neat if we could figure out who that was.

Toddy Hill...I am over 55 and I watched the first three parts...mainly because I was there in 66-67. I was tense and anxious through most of it, which kind of was unexpected...but it was well presented. I could not however subject myself to watching after the Tet section. Once we start talking about burning draft cards and demonstrations, and the distorted reporting by the media, I couldn't let myself re- live that crap! One of the worst times of my life...the year after coming home!

Aggie63 - I thought they handled IaDrang pretty good. Like you, I quit watching early. Have you watchd 'We Were Soldiers"?

I had never heard of a war where there would be a weekly score card of KIA flashed across the TV screens of America (or of any nation).

Network news with nightly living color combat's bloody horror helped the US lose that Vietnam War.

airplane driver...yes, I thought the first two sections were good and right on target. Ia Drang was well covered. Some excellent footage.

No doubt in my mind the media cost us this war. When I came home, I was sick about the way they were reporting things. We never had a chance after the media got in the living rooms and distorted everything. (my opinion).

Aggie63 (and all others who served in Vietnam) -

i would like to say thank you for your service. while what you did took place before i was even born, i am appreciative of your service and what you went through. i pray that in your remaining years we can more than make up for your first year home.

Happy Veterans Day!

quote:

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Network news with nightly living color combat's bloody horror helped the US lose that Vietnam War.

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So the media should not present the realities of war? Media back then was what it should be now. They presented the horror of war. They didn't sensor. They showed it like it really is. Nowadays we never show the other side that is affected either. In Vietnam they showed burning villages, with all the population dead or burned. This obviously affected the opinions of the American people.

Now we have graphics on the media outlets showing what type of weapons we are using, and how destructive they are. We show maps of attacking forces, as if it is some sort of game. I respect our military and I'm damn proud of their service. This is not a shot against them. This is a shot at the media.

[This message has been edited by Palooza11 (edited 11/11/2011 9:39p).]

Palooza - if the media sent pictures of D-Day back to America's TV, there would have been demands to sue for peace. NVietnam was about to ask for terms after TET but then Giap told HoChiMin to wait because the American media was portraying it as a major defeat for us. Giap knew the American media would do his propaganda for him. Bernard Shaw was that CNN reporter who was in Baghdad when Desert Storm started and then refused to be de-briefed by US Intelligence because he felt as a reporter he had to be neutral. He represents what is wrong with the media today.

Gigem Hilo...Thanks for your comment. That means a lot. Thanks for taking the time to express that.

Palooza....what you are missing is the fact that they did NOT report the facts. The media generated stories from what they showed that misrepresented. They pushed the negatives till they infected the entire country. They reported clashes (like Tet) as major disasters when it was not. They painted us as baby killers and sympathized with "innocent civilians" every chance they could. They neglected to report old women and young children that walked through a battlefield shooting American wounded in the heads....or the old woman that carried a bottle of battery acid laden beer to sell to GIs...they sold us out. They aided and abetted the enemy and gave them strength. Walter Cronkite declares all is lost....such tripe!

I want to change what I said about people wanting to sue for peace if they had seen pictures of DDay. America was different in 1944. They would have demanded we continue the war and "punish" those people that caused the trouble in the first place.

Veterans, in my classroom students are hearing the reality of your struggles and the fact that despite enormous pressure the overwhelming majority of you fought with honor and courage. Students don't leave my class thinking that US troops lost that war, but that in a conflict laden with missteps and wrongful policies the guys on the ground, in the air and on the sea were the ones getting the job done day after day. I've had quite a few students leave my class saying "wow...I need to go thank Grandpa" or "I never knew what my uncle went through". Thank you for your sacrifices.

I finally got to watch part 1 and 2 last night. I remember growing up reading some stories about Vietnam and seeing media stuff and always wondering why they would attack a hill or fly to location X, fight for a few days, kill a bunch of VC, then leave.

All I could think was WTF was that for? They got the hill then left?

Last nights Part 2 talked about how it was all about body count. Someone, somewhere decided that the best way to win was to kill as many VC as possible.

While I understand the premis of fighting is to kill the other guy, aren't you supposed to GAIN something at the end of the battle?

Haven't got to parts 3-6 yet.

Hey Aggie63 I agree with you wholeheartedly. Quote: "Palooza....what you are missing is the fact that they did NOT report the facts. The media generated stories from what they showed that misrepresented. They pushed the negatives till they infected the entire country. They reported clashes (like Tet) as major disasters when it was not. They painted us as baby killers and sympathized with "innocent civilians" every chance they could. They neglected to report old women and young children that walked through a battlefield shooting American wounded in the heads....or the old woman that carried a bottle of battery acid laden beer to sell to GIs...they sold us out. They aided and abetted the enemy and gave them strength. Walter Cronkite declares all is lost....such tripe!"

Like gigemhilo said in his post, everyone who served in Vietnam was/is a Hero. Y'all went through some serious sh** and then had to deal with an entirely different kind of sh** when y'all got back. From one Combat vet to another, I hope you had a great Veteran's day and many more to come.




AGGIE12B
JC '88
If you value the Freedom and Liberties you have in your life, be sure to Thank a Veteran everyday!

Aggie 12B. Thanks so much for your good words. One thing you never get tired of is knowing you can sit down with a fellow vet and speak the same language. Thanks for your service as well.

I want to report that this Veteran's Day was the best one I have ever had. Was made to feel really important, and I have to tell you, it felt really good.!

Aggie63 - coincidently, going through some old envelopes VDay I came across a small newspaper clipping my dad clipped about "First Cav Base at AnKhe Attacked". It mentioned that "administrative staff" was sent to the perimeter. I remember one attack on July 31, 1966 when they got us engineers out of bed for a walk through the boonies. I had an M79 and PRC10 and was drunk as hell because July 30 was my 19th birthday. The walk sobered me up quickly.

That cannot be a BQ. Because there is no way that helicopter could get off the ground if it was.

AirPlain Driver....I don't remember that attack, but I believe I was out at Pleiku on an operation during that week according to my letters. (My family saved almost every letter I wrote home, so I have a pretty good record).
I do remember the mortar attack of Sept 4. Do you recall that one?

I think during the Sept attack my company was down at VanCan along the coast building an airstrip for a SF camp.

4L Ag

I was there July '69 - July '70. I was CofE and spent first six months at an in-country R&R site (Vung Tau) building a rock crusher. Had ROK for security and all was good (for being in Viet Nam). Then move to end of earth in delta.

I attended a Veterans Day ceremony with one of my grandkids and there was another vet there that was in Viet Nam in early '60s and in Air Force. He showed pictures of hanging with locals in their homes, cruising down street, attending festivals, etc.

I had never thought about it, but I guess that all changed with TET. We rarely left base in vehicles unless a convoy and never went into villages alone. If I had to travel, my driver and I had M-16s, side arms, an M-79 grenade launcher and lots of ammo. I even kept an AK-47 in my jeep for a while.

I will never forget meeting a major convoy of Big Red One unit going toward Vung Tau. They had an escort of Hueys and Cobras and hardware out the wazoo.

Walter Cronkite was a t-sip bent on broadcast T R E A S O N.

Lord Haw Haw of the Vietnam War.