The political issue is exactly the problem. No one is willing to start knocking on doors in Bunker Hill Village and say that they're going to expanded the nice shady stream that meanders through people's backyards.

Here's the bottom line. If you live in Houston and have flooded in the past you're probably going to flood again. The city and county can say we're studying this and that to alleviate the flooding but the engineering, environmental and financial issues are probably impossible to overcome. So you have 3 options.
Move to an area that doesn't flood.
Elevate your house.
Accept the fact that you will probably flood again and be willing to deal with that.

Just saw this

https://www.chron.com/news/politics/texas/amp/Abbott-Feds-approve-5b-for-Harvey-recovery-13052202.php

Officials said the projects included in the announcement include:

Sabine Pass to Galveston Bay: $3.9 billion
Clear Creek: $295.1 million
Dallas Floodway: $222.9 million
Lewisville Dam: $91.9 million
Lower Colorado River: $73.2 million
Brays Bayou: $75 million
Hunting Bayou: $65 million
Dallas Floodway Extension: $53 million
White Oak Bayou: $45 million
Buffalo Bayou and Tributaries: $1.4 million
Officials said funding for the following studies was also approved:

Buffalo Bayou and Tributaries Study: $6 million
Houston Regional Watershed Assessment: $3 million
Brazos River, Fort Bend County Erosion Management Study: $3 million
Guadalupe and San Antonio River Basins: $2 million
Coastal Texas Protection and Restoration Study: $1.9 million

Will the 3rd reservoir help Barker as well as Addicks?

Fitch said:

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The clearing out of the reservoirs and construction of a new one along Cypress Creek west of 99 will all probably happen. "Improving conveyance" down Buffalo Bayou essentially means widening and straightening sections from Beltway 8 through Memorial and the Villages to Memorial Park.

That has understandably become a political hot potato, to the point that no governmental agency or even the Chronicle, will talk about it.

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Increasing conveyance (widening and deepening) on all major bayous (those shown in red) is a dream. Congress will never approve this.

Fitch said:

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Just saw this

https://www.chron.com/news/politics/texas/amp/Abbott-Feds-approve-5b-for-Harvey-recovery-13052202.php

Officials said the projects included in the announcement include:

Sabine Pass to Galveston Bay: $3.9 billion
Clear Creek: $295.1 million
Dallas Floodway: $222.9 million
Lewisville Dam: $91.9 million
Lower Colorado River: $73.2 million
Brays Bayou: $75 million
Hunting Bayou: $65 million
Dallas Floodway Extension: $53 million
White Oak Bayou: $45 million
Buffalo Bayou and Tributaries: $1.4 million
Officials said funding for the following studies was also approved:

Buffalo Bayou and Tributaries Study: $6 million
Houston Regional Watershed Assessment: $3 million
Brazos River, Fort Bend County Erosion Management Study: $3 million
Guadalupe and San Antonio River Basins: $2 million
Coastal Texas Protection and Restoration Study: $1.9 million

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wish i could easily find how they are allocating money for each project

Fitch said:

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The clearing out of the reservoirs and construction of a new one along Cypress Creek west of 99 will all probably happen. "Improving conveyance" down Buffalo Bayou essentially means widening and straightening sections from Beltway 8 through Memorial and the Villages to Memorial Park.

That has understandably become a political hot potato, to the point that no governmental agency or even the Chronicle, will talk about it.

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Any info on 3rd reservoir? Location, floodee area, etc.?

https://www.chron.com/neighborhood/kingwood/news/article/Army-Corps-of-Engineers-aim-to-begin-dredging-San-12904486.php

Quote:

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Dredging was deemed necessary after floodwaters from Hurricane Harvey rushed downstream and caused sand and siltation to build up in the San Jacinto River. The sand and silt displaces water and limits the river's capacity to hold floodwaters within its banks, creating a greater threat of flooding to the Lake Houston area.

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The 3rd reservoir will be in the Cypress Creek Watershed. So while it may work with the existing Addicks Watershed and Barker Watershed they are different units. The initial plan for a 3rd level was to protect new construction, not to protect existing homes in different watersheds.

Thanks!

But only dredging to Pre Harvey.

redag06 said:

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But only dredging to Pre Harvey.

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I know. Still better than nothing.

I've been seeing some work where the bayou runs out of Barker by Hwy 6. Not sure what exactly because it's usually still dark when I run by there. Pretty big dirt pile, though.

Bondag said:

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And flood mitigation projects only work if it rains where those projects are.

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Considering that most flooding is related to the watersheds, this is a false statement. In fact, if you look at the Harvey flooding in Harris County, a large percentage of that was directly from overflowing watersheds.

I thought we learned from the corpe in the 70s that channeling bayous doesn't improve drainage?

Michael Barnhart said:

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Bondag said:

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And flood mitigation projects only work if it rains where those projects are.

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Considering that most flooding is related to the watersheds, this is a false statement. In fact, if you look at the Harvey flooding in Harris County, a large percentage of that was directly from overflowing watersheds.

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We got lucky in Harvey that a large amount of the rain was able to be collected in Addicks and Barker.

Memorial Day floods had significantly less rain, but all rain was upstream of the reservoirs so areas were affected that would not have been with the same amount of rain to the West

I am cynical of the Cy Fair reservoir or whatever it is called because it does nothing to protect areas along Buffalo Bayou that were hit after the dams were opened.

Bondag said:

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Michael Barnhart said:

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Bondag said:

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And flood mitigation projects only work if it rains where those projects are.

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Considering that most flooding is related to the watersheds, this is a false statement. In fact, if you look at the Harvey flooding in Harris County, a large percentage of that was directly from overflowing watersheds.

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We got lucky in Harvey that a large amount of the rain was able to be collected in Addicks and Barker.

Memorial Day floods had significantly less rain, but all rain was upstream of the reservoirs so areas were affected that would not have been with the same amount of rain to the West

I am cynical of the Cy Fair reservoir or whatever it is called because it does nothing to protect areas along Buffalo Bayou that were hit after the dams were opened.

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I agree with most your last statement. Flood mitigation will help in Houston if it gives better capacity and/or control through the watersheds. That said, if Harvey becomes a 100 year event instead of a 1000 year, we just need to move.

The Cy Fair Reservoir isn't intended to help Buffalo Bayou.

Big Cat `93 said:

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I've been seeing some work where the bayou runs out of Barker by Hwy 6. Not sure what exactly because it's usually still dark when I run by there. Pretty big dirt pile, though.

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Both Addicks and Barker had projects planned before Harvey to install new release gate structures. The one for Addicks was already in progress when Harvey hit, you could see the construction trailers and equipment in the video feeds of the flooding. They use earthen dams or cofferdams to seal off the site as they excavate the berm to construct the gate structure.

It might have helped a little bit. I'm a little sketchy on hard info right now, but this website seems to say that some of the cypress creek overflow/flooding went into addicks (http://houstontx.gov/postharvey/flood-mitigation-projects.html). If that is the case, it would have lessened the amount of water that had to be released from those reservoirs into Buffalo Bayou, so in theory, it could have lessened that flooding. Now, that being said, there are a lot of assumptions there that I cannot quantify.

Interesting to read about there not only being the originally planned 3rd reservoir but a 4th for Cypress Creek.

I came across this article that contains info on SJRA applying to the state for study study a 5th for Spring Creek that would be at least partially sited in Montgomery County. That would have impact for Kingwood and other areas downstream.

Harris County calls for $2.5B bond for flood prevention projects

Quote:

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One solution echoed by numerous officials and residents is the idea of a reservoir along Spring Creek that could prevent excess water from the creek in a heavy rain event from flowing into homes. HCFCD Environmental Chief Glenn Laird said the idea was a plan in the initial concept of The Woodlands, but never came to fruition.

"The idea of a reservoir on Spring Creek goes back to [The Woodlands founder] George Mitchell," Laird said. "One of the earliest plans for the original 18,000 acres of The Woodlands was a 1,000-acre lake reservoir on Spring Creek somewhere basically in the area upstream of Gosling Road. In case no one noticed, it never happened. Like with all master plans, not everything quite gets done."

While a reservoir near The Woodlands and unincorporated Spring was not included on the initial list of projects for the Harris County bond, as Spring Creek borders Montgomery County, Laird said HCFCD has reserved funds for partnership projects outside the county for projects that would also benefit Harris County.

One such project could come from a proposal from the San Jacinto River Authority. The SJRA announced plans in late May to submit an application to the Texas Water Development Board for a grantto be matched with local funds from the SJRAwhich would be used to study the feasibility of a reservoir along Spring Creek and a real-time gate operation tool for Lake Conroe to release water from the Lake Conroe dam. An exact amount for the grant has not yet been announced.

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I wouldn't think that 1000 acres would help that much but I guess it could help a bit. Depends on if they keep it empty or not and my guess is no.

Also, it wasn't really a reservoir on cypress creek but a levee that would try to keep it in channel.

RM1993 said:

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You can spend all the money in the world on every flood mitigation project imaginable, but when you get from 40-60 inches of rain on Houston in the span of a few days it is going to flood....

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that's why it's called mitigation, not elimination.

RM1993 said:

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You can spend all the money in the world on every flood mitigation project imaginable, but when you get from 40-60 inches of rain on Houston in the span of a few days it is going to flood....

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That'll cause flooding and damage anywhere in the world. HTH.

To see the difference in how effective our flood mitigation is, look at this. The 2018 Japan Floods that are going on right now.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018_Japan_floods

• Widespread rain of 15 inches over 10 days with some up to 39 inches
• One place had 23 inches in 2 days
• 209 people dead
• 2.42 million people evacuated with recommendations of 4.22 million more to evacuate.

Obviously, this is terrible, but we had significantly worse rainfall and less destructive flooding. Japan is very industrialized and has good infrastructure. This isn't Haiti or the Philippines. Houston and the gulf coast did wonderful comparably.

Quote:

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Houston and the gulf coast did wonderful comparably.

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Worst natural disaster in US history, in terms of dollars. Tap the breaks.

Quote:

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One place had 23 inches in 2 days

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I had that in about 4 hours during the peak of Harvey.

Exactly. And we didn't evacuate 6 million people.

I feel like we have some people here who would defend the New Orleans levee boards who got complacent in their diligence and maintenance. There are certainly areas of Harris County that now flood far more often than they used to when we get a significant rain. No one is asking for or thinks that flooding can be eliminated but I thought there was pretty close to a 100% consensus after all the recent flooding that maintenance needed to be done better and there might be major projects that could make a material difference with the flooding. Additionally, looking at whether all the development to the west was having an impact on flooding which could be helped by another reservoir was on the table. When did taking a look at this and determining what actions to take become something to sneer at?

The med center fared MUCH better during Harvey, with twice as much rain, than it did during Allison. We are thankful that MD Anderson survived this time as well as it did.

As for evacuating 6 million people, that's about 3 city blocks in most Japanese cities. If we had as much population density as Japan, we would have moved that many people during Katrina, Rita, Ike, or Harvey.

Greater Houston needs a lot of work.

Gap said:

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I feel like we have some people here who would defend the New Orleans levee boards who got complacent in their diligence and maintenance. There are certainly areas of Harris County that now flood far more often than they used to when we get a significant rain. No one is asking for or thinks that flooding can be eliminated but I thought there was pretty close to a 100% consensus after all the recent flooding that maintenance needed to be done better and there might be major projects that could make a material difference with the flooding. Additionally, looking at whether all the development to the west was having an impact on flooding which could be helped by another reservoir was on the table. When did taking a look at this and determining what actions to take become something to sneer at?

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Nobody sneers at it in my neighborhood. Very few of us are back in our homes. I guess it's a common response to look at someone else's trouble and reject what it might be saying about your own mortality or vulnerability. I do it too. The internet makes it easy to do.