I'm pissed. 1st, the homeowners decided not to include that they knew the foundation had been worked on in the past in their sellers disclosure, but they THREW AWAY ALL THE DOCUMENTATION ABOUT THE REPAIR!!!

I'm not trying to figure out who did the foundation repair in the first place, but am having no luck. I've tried calling all the foundation repair companies in Dallas that I can find. None of them have any records. I tried calling the city of Richardson to see who pulled the permit for the repair. Either they didn't get a permit, or "they used less than 3 piers and it wasn't required."

I'm at a loss. Anyone have any advice on where to go from here? Obviously the problem has been fixed, I would just like the warranty for it and know who did it. We're getting a foundation guy we trust to go look at it tomorrow to get his opinion, but I'm so mad at the sellers!

Check with S&W Foundation? They are based in Richardson

Did you already close on this place? Given they already seemed to commit a major issue by leaving it off the sellers disclosure, I would turn the screws on making them tell you who did it. I'd contact a lawyer if need be to put a scare into them. You may be surprised how they magically come up with a name and/or documentation after getting a little scare. Assuming this foundation company didn't work pro bono, I'm guessing there's some evidence of payment with a name on it if the seller goes to the trouble of working with their bank, credit card company, etc.

[This message has been edited by DannyDuberstein (edited 2/28/2012 1:14p).]

We're in option period. sellers claim they no nothing and threw the documentation away "not knowing what it was"

Sounds like you're taking the right step of getting it checked out. After seeing the work, maybe your engineer will have some ideas on who to contact to track down more information. I also wouldn't hesitate on being much more aggressive on what you seek for repairs, etc., even if the engineer report comes back satisfactory. Their alternative to turning down your repair request would likely be putting the house back on the market while having to disclose a previous foundation issue with no documentation and no warranty. Can't claim ignorance anymore, and that kind of disclosure with no history and warranty is going to sting.

[This message has been edited by DannyDuberstein (edited 2/28/2012 1:32p).]

so you think i should get it checked out and basically go back to the table and say that since you dont have any of the paperwork, we have no idea the quality of work, when it was done, and no warranty, that we have to prepare for the worst and unless you take $X off the price, we're walking and you'll have to put in your disclosure that you had undocumented foundation repairs

That would be my inclination. After you have your engineer inspect it and have more facts to make a decision, I'd sit down with your own agent to discuss next steps. It might be a matter of negotiating directly over this particular issue, negotiating more aggressively on the other items the regular inspector finds, or a combination of the two. The "didn't know what it was and threw it away" stuff just doesn't sit well at all with me, especially given how common and how expensive this kind of issue can be.

[This message has been edited by DannyDuberstein (edited 2/28/2012 1:57p).]

I would do something very very similar. This is BUYERS market, and unprepared / ignorant sellers need to be punished. You can't do that. I just sold our home in Richardson last fall, and had to meet the foundation repair guy in a parking lot to have the buyer's name transferred onto the warranty. Its part of selling a home.

If they want to make some kind of repairation to you - like 2k - I'd pay your trusted foundation guy a grand to come out and 'do some minor fixes' if he deems necessary, then keep that 1k for your troubles.

That is indicative of irresponsible sellers - and it angers me a ton reading this.

how much should we drop the price in order to prepare for knowing we're going to have this same issue when we sell in the future?

I think that is where you need both the engineer's assessment as well as the realtor's expertise (assuming you have a good one) regarding how much that situation would typically impact the value of the house. Too much unknown to say since you don't know how extensive the repair was and what kind of shape it is currently in.

Just saw you had a thread over here… Think about it like this, how much would the disclosure have impacted you when viewing the house? Imagine saying, you know there has been work done on the house, but you don’t know what the work was exactly before your buyer makes an offer. That’s going to hurt pretty bad in the future, even with an engineer having inspected the foundation. If your realtor is not advising a cut in sales price, then they appear to be more concerned with closing the deal.

Is the house less than 10 years old? If so, the builder probably covered the repairs, and the previous owner's may have had nothing to do with it. My previous house was like that, and in all honesty foundation repairs become a big pain the arse when you try to sell, so I would probably avoid it all together unless you are getting an amazing deal or plan on staying there forever. There are plently of other houses out there.

As a side note, when we sold the above mentioned house, I had to go back to the builder to get additional paperwork that the original owners did not give me (which was also a pita), and the superintendent told me it is cheaper to put down the cheapest foundation on 100 houses assuming 5-10 may need additional work in the 10-yr structural warranty period, then do all of them correctly in the first place.

I would walk. There are plenty of houses on the market and these people sound shady as hell.

Honestly the "plenty of houses on the market" just isn't true right now. It hasn't been for months really.

Yeah, I've heard that thrown out as well as it being a buyers market, which in the grand macro scheme, may be very true. However, housing is so location dependent that inventory can really vary and these assumptions can be very inaccurate. We moved about 8 months ago in this supposed "buyers" market, but with the house we were selling, there was very little inventory at the time in our area and value range so we were able to get a premium price for it with multiple offers coming in within the first week it was on the market.

In general though, I do think it's wise to keep yourself from getting emotionally attached to the home and be prepared to walk. Buyers market, sellers market, whatever, there will always be another opportunity. It's just a matter of time. In this case, hopefully the engineer can give you a clear picture of what you're dealing with and then make the call from there.

That said, even if you try to move forward on this house, I'd negotiate a healthy allowance for the issue because a no documentation no warranty ding does impact the value. If this is going to be a problem when you eventally sell, you want to make sure this seller takes the hit and not you. The good news is that your inspector noticed it and you hold the leverage with the option. These guys now have your general inspection report that they'll have to disclose to future bidders - which will include this problem along with everything else he found, then anything your engineer finds. Even if the house comes back clean, I'd put them over the barrel for a nice chunk and would be prepared to walk if they don't accept it.

[This message has been edited by Jimmie Dimmick (edited 2/29/2012 12:32p).]

I don't really get why people think this is worth some sort of compensation from the seller. All the guy wants is the copy of the paperwork for the repairs.

If they can't provide it then make them get a structural guy to come do an inspection at their cost at the very most. The thought that they owe you thousands of dollars because they lost their receipt is pretty laughable.

He made a bid on a house without any disclosure that it had previous foundation problems. For many buyers, this negatively impacts the value of the house - particularly when the extent of the work is unknown and there is no warranty to be transferred. It's not about the receipt. It's about the fact that, right or wrong, many buyers wouldn't even make an offer in a situation like this if they'd known about it, which is a potential obstacle for him whenever he needs to sell the house.

[This message has been edited by DannyDuberstein (edited 2/29/2012 3:06p).]

Exactly Danny. I'm not worried about the house and the foundation really. I feel that if it's not currently exhibiting issues after the drought we just went through, it's probably ok. I'm upset that I've put money on this house, because knowing it had foundation issues would have affected my initial offer, ESPECIALLY since they don't have any documentation.

They obviously knew it had foundation issues based on the response when we asked them about it based on our inspection. They said "yes, your inspector should have seen the crack repair in the wall. We should have replaced the carpet, but we didn't." And they checked "no" to the question on the disclosure asking if the property had any foundation repairs since the house was built. That is a material misrepresentation of fact in my opinion.

Then dont buy the house!

If this is really a "surprise" issue that is what the option period is for. Back out. I don't see why the seller should be obligated to pay up for foundation work that was performed and the home was repaired to a point where the foundation is functional.

If unsure whether it is functional get a foundation inspector. Seems simple to me.

selling a 50s P-n-B house in Richardson was easy enough to just not check some issues on the disclosure. if they did in fact check the box you're talking about, thats dis-honest. thats why i think there's an 'unknown' box - and a free response section.

culd - do you think there are buyers out there who would have zero issue with this situation? any at all?

quote:

---

I'm upset that I've put money on this house, because knowing it had foundation issues would have affected my initial offer, ESPECIALLY since they don't have any documentation.

---

Really? First of all, you usually do your due diligence during the option period. You really have no idea what condition the house is in just from a disclosure. Second, you are in for a rude awakening in a 30 - 40 year old house if you think you will know everything that's wrong with it the day you move in.

quote:

---

It's about the fact that, right or wrong, many buyers wouldn't even make an offer in a situation like this if they'd known about it, which is a potential obstacle for him whenever he needs to sell the house.

---

You are going to have to wait a long time to find a 30 - 40 year old house in Richardson that hasn't had some sort of foundation work.

I understand the concern about not knowing what was done to the house during the last fix. That is honestly the biggest issue. However, many of you are coming off like you would never buy a house that has had foundation work. You're just not going to find that very often with 40 year old homes in DFW.

[This message has been edited by AeroAg2003 (edited 2/29/2012 7:57p).]

quote:

---

You are going to have to wait a long time to find a 30 - 40 year old house in Richardson that hasn't had some sort of foundation work.

I understand the concern about not knowing what was done to the house during the last fix. That is honestly the biggest issue. However, many of you are coming off like you would never buy a house that has had foundation work. You're just not going to find that very often with 40 year old homes in DFW.

---

Precisely.

Why don't you have a company (or foundation engineer, I.e. Express foundation) come out and estimate if it needs further repair, if it does ask for a concession for the cost, if it doesn't and you like the house and price, buy it. We (the foundation company I work for) do over a thousand houses a year in dfw, they are hard to miss around here in the buying process

And we work on houses ranging from 30k to million dollar homes, pier n beam, slab, block and pad. Commerical. The only way the house is going to be without foundation repair, is with proper new construction, proper builders piers before construction, etc. I have repaired home where the soil is literally a 6" layer covering solid rock, and the house still moved. All homes (less thoughs with proper new construction piers) are subject to heaving. Not all homes sink.

Appreciate it guys. The foundation company we had come out said all was good and his only recommendation was to have the static and pressure lines tested for a leak.

We're moving forward with the house hoping the concede on some other repairs around the house. Hopefully we'll know something this afternoon!

I reccomend nortex testing for your plumbing test, they don't offer repair so they have no reson to lie about a leak

See... I told you that you might be overreacting!

Glad to hear everything is good. Hopefully you can use the paperwork issue to get some monetary concessions.