Thanks but I'm willing to cut the buyer pool for piece of mind

I require BOS for all of the guns I sell and have never had an issue, the only people that I don't have do BOS are family and close friends. If they don't want to do a BOS I have and will continue to decline to sell to.

I don't know why people fuss about BOS.
I require them on my gun sales and have never had an issue.

and if you had an issue with it, cool, because I don't want to sell an AR15 to you anymore.

Nice guns good luck with the sale

Let's agree to disagree

Not sure why you feel the need to detail any thread selling a firearm with the same statements about BOS.

Let the BOS crusade go…

agsalaska said:

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TXJD2012 said:

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Let's agree to disagree

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As long as you understand that I am right and that all you are doing is opening yourself to unnecessary liability with local State and Feds. Then we can agree to disagree.


Tell me, how exactly are you storing that information?

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Can you tell me what liability issues you're talking about?

The two most obvious are records retention and being in the business(ATF).

The last one has been kicked around in the ATF for a long time. They used personal records in Alaska to justify a warrant on a case when I lived there 20 years ago, long before they changed the language.

I feel as though doing a background check also implies you're "in the business" too.

So throw your crusade out the window please and quit being a curmudgeon.

Absolutely not. Consider what you just said for a second.


Going to an FFL and having a background check done is just due diligence. That has absolutely nothing to do with receipt and record retention. Zero.

A bill of sale is a documented record of a business transaction. Period.

And the last part as long as a certain percentage of y'all are working on feels and not on logic will NEVER happen. Ever.

I read every single thread you post on about this and every single time I've read every single post and I still have to go try to figure out why it's a bad idea. Can you perhaps outline a specific example? I do not ask for bills of sale. But I also have no problem signing one if someone wishes to have it. In fact, I don't even ask for CHL. I have a firearm. You have cash. Let's make a deal.

For my own education, and I fully understand and accept ridicule, can you explain to me like an epic dummy how I can shoot myself in the foot by asking for a bill of sale and ALSO how I can shoot myself in the foot by signing one?

And I am being totally serious. I want to fully understand because I do sell firearms as I trade around and make my collection cooler. This is clearly a big deal to you and if someone is that worried about it then maybe I should at least find out why because maybe it should be a big deal to me too.

I'll do my best off of a cell phone.

The risk is really on the seller more than the buyer. That is assuming you as a buyer do not give any information like your DL number.

But there are a few reasons

1. The ATF has very loose rules(intentionally) about being 'in the business.' And a bill of sale is by definition a business transaction. You can go ahead and challenge that all you want(not you) but I have seen firsthand the ATF use personal records. Another poster that we all know well said earlier that he always gets a BOS. He also sells a lot of guns. I'm sure the ATF will appreciate all of that information being put together for them.

2. Records retention. You are responsible for protecting the records of others while in your possession. Especially if you are possessing it in a business transaction. Depending on jurisdiction it could be anything

3 the last is the most obvious to me. What would you rather tell a cop? Or a defense attorney? Let's say you sold a gun two years ago to some dude named Kenny. Kenny killed a rich kid in a bad drug deal. Rich kids parents are coming for blood. 1. I have no idea what happened to that gun. 2 I sold it to the killer and was concerned enough about his background that I made him sign a BOS(instead of going the 4473 route). Have fun with those attorney fees. And of course the cops are. It your friends. We should all know that.


It just doesn't do you any good for anything ever. In any circumstance. There is not a single circumstance that I can think of where it helps you and plenty of real world scenarios where it ****s you. All it does is make people feel better. It's about feels.

If you are concerned about who you are selling to there is a procedure in olace(4473). Otherwise you are doing more harm than good.

[If you want to make comments on this board about POS use this type of post and not just that it is a bad idea without any other explanation. -Staff]

agsalaska said:

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I'll do my best off of a cell phone.

The risk is really on the seller more than the buyer. That is assuming you as a buyer do not give any information like your DL number.

But there are a few reasons

1. The ATF has very loose rules(intentionally) about being 'in the business.' And a bill of sale is by definition a business transaction. You can go ahead and challenge that all you want(not you) but I have seen firsthand the ATF use personal records. Another poster that we all know well said earlier that he always gets a BOS. He also sells a lot of guns. I'm sure the ATF will appreciate all of that information being put together for them.

2. Records retention. You are responsible for protecting the records of others while in your possession. Especially if you are possessing it in a business transaction. Depending on jurisdiction it could be anything

3 the last is the most obvious to me. What would you rather tell a cop? Or a defense attorney? Let's say you sold a gun two years ago to some dude named Kenny. Kenny killed a rich kid in a bad drug deal. Rich kids parents are coming for blood. 1. I have no idea what happened to that gun. 2 I sold it to the killer and was concerned enough about his background that I made him sign a BOS(instead of going the 4473 route). Have fun with those attorney fees. And of course the cops are. It your friends. We should all know that.


It just doesn't do you any good for anything ever. In any circumstance. There is not a single circumstance that I can think of where it helps you and plenty of real world scenarios where it ****s you. All it does is make people feel better. It's about feels.

If you are concerned about who you are selling to there is a procedure in olace(4473). Otherwise you are doing more harm than good.

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You should post this every time you need to mention it. THIS makes sense to me and it has a practical example. Especially item 3, and 1. Thanks for the explanation.

Well, y'all have really done a great job derailing this guy's thread. Have some self awareness.