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Intro into the thermal scope world

19,736 Views | 114 Replies | Last: 2 yr ago by Thaddeus Beauregard
96ags
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Where would you guys suggest someone start looking? I've got an AR that I plan on putting it on, but I don't even know what is considered low end/high end, etc.

Appreciate any advice you can give.
Capt. Augustus McCrae
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A budget would be a good starting point
tandy miller
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I would not get lower than 384 resolution and no smaller than 25 mm objective.

Agree with above re: budget
96ags
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Capt. Augustus McCrae said:

A budget would be a good starting point


I'm not sure. I was thinking $2,000 - $2,500 if that will get something decent to start.
rab79
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96ags said:

Capt. Augustus McCrae said:

A budget would be a good starting point


I'm not sure. I was thinking $2,000 - $2,500 if that will get something decent to start.
here you go, this is more than decent, and not a chinese sensor.
https://hueyoutdoors.com/product/pulsar-talion-xq35-pro-thermal-rifle-scope/

get the QD mount too, this guy was covering sale tax for awhile.

here is a review
BigTShirtAg
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AGM rattler or AGM adder. I'd go with the 35-384. Both of those are right there in your budget range. Look at feraltexasoutdoors dot com. They have some nice specials going on right now.

Couple weeks ago Tandy told me he had the agm rattler 25-384 that he uses and likes, his only complaint was if he could do it again, he would do the 35-384.

I have a Buddy with a amg adder 35-384 that he loves. That's the one I'll be getting in a couple weeks once that Christmas bonus hits lol. I've used it while with him and I love it aswell.
tandy miller
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BigTShirtAg said:

AGM rattler or AGM adder. I'd go with the 35-384. Both of those are right there in your budget range. Look at feraltexasoutdoors dot com. They have some nice specials going on right now.

Couple weeks ago Tandy told me he had the agm rattler 25-384 that he uses and likes, his only complaint was if he could do it again, he would do the 35-384.

I have a Buddy with a amg adder 35-384 that he loves. That's the one I'll be getting in a couple weeks once that Christmas bonus hits lol. I've used it while with him and I love it aswell.


This. At that budget I'd get the 35-384.

Pulsar is a good option as well, though
96ags
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Thanks guys, I really appreciate it.

Hopefully this will help some folks out for Christmas too!
Thaddeus Beauregard
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tandy miller said:

I would not get lower than 384 resolution and no smaller than 25 mm objective.

Agree with above re: budget


+ 1000000!

384 is considered "standard resolution," 640 (and higher) is considered "high res" in today's consumer thermal market at current technology.
tandy miller
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Here's a few videos at different yardages/conditions. Again, this is out of an AGM Rattler TS 25-384.

50 yds



104 yds




70 yds, 70% humidity

Thaddeus Beauregard
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rab79 said:

96ags said:

Capt. Augustus McCrae said:

A budget would be a good starting point


I'm not sure. I was thinking $2,000 - $2,500 if that will get something decent to start.
here you go, this is more than decent, and not a chinese sensor.
https://hueyoutdoors.com/product/pulsar-talion-xq35-pro-thermal-rifle-scope/

get the QD mount too, this guy was covering sale tax for awhile.

here is a review



Absolutely! Talion XQ35 is exactly $2500, and I don't think anything can touch it in terms of image quality, feature set, and reticle selection at that price point. Plus Pulsar has very good customer service and as mentioned, is made in Europe, not China.
skelso
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The common practice is to start with budget and work from there. I take a different approach with my customers. I start with needs and realistic expectations and go from there. There's no difference between a 640 core, 384 core, 320 core, etc if it never leaves the safe.

Is night hunting something you already do and want to level up your kit? or something new to you?

Do you have access to land to hunt regularly at night, or will you be relying on outfitters and invites?

Do you typically hunt alone or with others? kids??



96ags
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skelso said:

The common practice is to start with budget and work from there. I take a different approach with my customers. I start with needs and realistic expectations and go from there. There's no difference between a 640 core, 384 core, 320 core, etc if it never leaves the safe.

Is night hunting something you already do and want to level up your kit? or something new to you?

Do you have access to land to hunt regularly at night, or will you be relying on outfitters and invites?

Do you typically hunt alone or with others? kids??






For me, I used to do a lot of predator hunting years ago, but haven't done much recently so I'd say this all relatively new to me.

I have access to plenty of land so I could be fairly regular if I'm successful reducing hog numbers.

It will mostly be used by me or my 22 yr old son.

tandy miller
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Solid advice
rab79
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you got some suggestions, do your research and decide which features work best for you, do you want rechargeable batteries or CR 123's? do you want multiple color and reticule options? is recording video with sound something you would like? Lots of little details that can make a difference in how satisfied you are with a purchase when you are laying out this amount of $$.
skelso
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If you've predator hunted at night, then you should have a good idea what you're getting into. I ha e a lot of customers who buy high end thermal because they are planning to night hunt the majority of the time but quickly realize their buddies don't have thermal and tgey don't like hunting by themselves all the time.

Pulsar was the first brand I carried back in 2016ish. They are a solid company with good customer service and decent products. Their market is bang for your buck.

IR Defense was the second manufacturer I picked up later that year. They were bought out by Trijicon who still markets their flagship products. Their market is solid, American made optics. For years they were technology leaders but they have brought little new features / models to market in recent years.

NVision, uses American BAE cores. Is generally less cost than Trijicon for comperable scope, and has a better warranty.

There are a bunch of players in the budget market. AGM, IRay, ATN, etc. Many use chinese sensors vs American or French (Pulsar) Of them, I prefer IRay. Their firmware produces very detailed imaging even from 384 cores.

As someone else said, pick the features most important to you.

I don't make a lot of content so I didnt think I would use video much but found it very valuable for animal recovery as I can replay video and pull out context of where animal was, where it ran, etc.

Ranging at night is difficult. I use the range finder all the time. However, it's not really needed since I shoot a 6.8 which has little drop out to 150ish.

The most important advice I can give is buy from a reputable dealer who works directly with the manufacturers vs through distributors. That relationship cam be valuable if you ever have issues. For instance, Pulsar has a 3yr warranty. I just sent a scope in that I sold almost 6 years ago. I was expecting the customer to pay for out of warranty repair. Since I sent it in for them, Pulsar replaced the scope free of charge.
skelso
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Also, if your primary species is swine, stay with lower magnification. Much over 3x will limit field of view to a point where follow up shots on running sounders become difficult.
tandy miller
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This is what you need, OP

96ags
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My wife just called you some very bad names. I told her that was inappropriate!!!
Dirty-8-thirty Ag
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My buddy that is richer than 6' up a bulls ass has one of these. It's so fun to hunt with him. He has all the cool stuff from iRay.
BCStalk
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I looked through that scope…IT WAS AWESOME

But back to reality. I love my AGM Rattler TS35-384. I upgraded from my old Flir unit and this thing is amazing for what I hunt at which is typically fields up to 200 yards.
tandy miller
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Dirty-8-thirty Ag said:

My buddy that is richer than 6' up a bulls ass has one of these. It's so fun to hunt with him. He has all the cool stuff from iRay.


The videos on YouTube w that optic are nuts. You can pretty much count the hairs on a boar's nutsack (if you're into that kind of thing)
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tandy miller
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Bregxit said:

Borrowing this thread to not clutter up the board...

Does anyone have suggestions for lightweight powerpacks? Looking for something to power my AGM Varmint 50-684 for more than a couple of hours.


I use this

Anker PowerCore 10000 Portable... https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0194WDVHI?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share
tandy miller
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Bregxit said:

tandy miller said:

Bregxit said:

Borrowing this thread to not clutter up the board...

Does anyone have suggestions for lightweight powerpacks? Looking for something to power my AGM Varmint 50-684 for more than a couple of hours.


I use this

Anker PowerCore 10000 Portable... https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0194WDVHI?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share


Awesome thanks tandy! Not sure why I couldn't find that one on Amazon before but the size looks perfect.

Any tips on attaching it to a rifle or just tape it on somewhere?


I use zip ties. My hand guard is round so I slapped a piece of picayune rail on side and zip tie it to that.

If you're feeling fancy you can get this… it's made for that battery

https://apex3d.net/anker-10-000-battery-pack-mount
rhtexfish
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Is AGM a Chinese sensor? Anybody see good thermal sale deals out there? The Pulsar Talion looks pretty nice on YouTube vids
tandy miller
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Yes the core is from china
Thaddeus Beauregard
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rhtexfish said:

Is AGM a Chinese sensor? Anybody see good thermal sale deals out there? The Pulsar Talion looks pretty nice on YouTube vids


A buddy of mine works with thermal microbolometers used in military applications, doing testing and calibration. I've never used any AGM products but he tells me that InfiRay/IRay and Bering Optics (which use InfiRay cores) have the best image quality of the Chinese based core thermals and that the French made Lynred cores in Pulsar produces a little better IQ than equivalent spec AGM in the "affordable" class of thermals. He gets lots of units sent to him from several of the thermal optics manufacturers for T&E and he brings them out to my hunting lease periodically so I get to try out a lot of stuff I can't afford. So, I trust his opinion on this.

One of the things I really like about the Talion scopes is the batteries they use last a long time compared to other scopes and they typically include a spare battery with the scope. I get around 6 hours of battery life with my Talion XG35, and that combined with being able to carry a spare battery means I never worry about batt life on a hunt. The other thing I live about the Talions is the hinged batt compartment door in the center of the scope body is very convenient, fast, and cleverly designed for making battery changes in the field as easy as possible. There's no chance of dropping and losing a battery cap or needing tethers on the scope to keep from losing a cap.
rhtexfish
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Thx
Thaddeus Beauregard
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You bet brother!
aggieforester05
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No complaints about my Burris BTS 35. Paid $1,700 for it last year, resolution is 400x300.

I also have a Sightmark Wraith 4K. The thermal is on another level. It's like comparing a 1993 Oldsmobile to a 2023 Bentley. The only downside, target shooting (sighting in and checking zero) during the daytime is much more difficult with the thermal.
tandy miller
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aggieforester05 said:

No complaints about my Burris BTS 35. Paid $1,700 for it last year, resolution is 400x300.

I also have a Sightmark Wraith 4K. The thermal is on another level. It's like comparing a 1993 Oldsmobile to a 2023 Bentley. The only downside, target shooting (sighting in and checking zero) during the daytime is much more difficult with the thermal.


Easiest way to sight in:

Put foil over cardboard. Put a white sticker as bullseye (I use nametags).

Lean cardboard back a little so the foil is angled up. The foil will reflect the cold of space and appear very cold. The sticker will look hot.

Sometimes I will heat up a marble and put it in my bullet hole so I can adjust reticle. Sometimes I just guess
Thaddeus Beauregard
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I just staple one of those hand warmer packets to my target backstop and it shows up nicely. Once I used a frozen water bottle. Same thing just opposite polarity. Then again, with my 640 core scopes, just a target with a 4-6" black center is sufficient. The black absorbing the heat from sunlight is plenty good enough. A lot depends on the scope's sensor sensitivity.

As for daytime thermal scope use, if you have a scope with a bright enough screen, sufficient eyepiece light shield, and a reasonably sensitive core (the smaller the NETD mK spec number, the better…anything 40mK or less being excellent), daytime shooting is no problem.
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