This thread explains so much about hunters and the rifle myths that will forever exist.

CTGilley said:

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BrazosDog02 said:

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Serious question….if a rifle is THAT dirty, it seems that would be pretty obvious with a visual inspection down the bore, no?

I know dirty bores can affect consistency but I cannot fathom a bore requiring hours of cleaning that couldn't be easily seen by looking down the bore.

Then I got to thinking that if that's the case then wouldn't that permanently mess up the barrel and rifling? Would corrosion be a thing? Kind of a rabbit hole but now I'm curious.

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That is a long conversation with what ifs. IMO bores should stay clean. I do not believe in the fouling shot. I my limited experience there is normally corrosion near the throat but I have not had one that would not shoot MOA after cleaning. I think the crown is most important. (Like a choke on a shotgun.) I am talking hunting at 200 yards.

YMMV and there is a lot of debate but without a long conversation, I believe accuracy starts drop after the first shot. Some guns take 1000+ to notice.

This is better discussion over a beer.

TLDR: Guy said it 3030 could not group in a pie plate. I cleaned it for 8 hours. Gun shoots sub MOA.

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i think the guys shooting competitions would 100% disagree with you.

Furlock Bones said:

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CTGilley said:

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BrazosDog02 said:

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Serious question….if a rifle is THAT dirty, it seems that would be pretty obvious with a visual inspection down the bore, no?

I know dirty bores can affect consistency but I cannot fathom a bore requiring hours of cleaning that couldn't be easily seen by looking down the bore.

Then I got to thinking that if that's the case then wouldn't that permanently mess up the barrel and rifling? Would corrosion be a thing? Kind of a rabbit hole but now I'm curious.

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That is a long conversation with what ifs. IMO bores should stay clean. I do not believe in the fouling shot. I my limited experience there is normally corrosion near the throat but I have not had one that would not shoot MOA after cleaning. I think the crown is most important. (Like a choke on a shotgun.) I am talking hunting at 200 yards.

YMMV and there is a lot of debate but without a long conversation, I believe accuracy starts drop after the first shot. Some guns take 1000+ to notice.

This is better discussion over a beer.

TLDR: Guy said it 3030 could not group in a pie plate. I cleaned it for 8 hours. Gun shoots sub MOA.

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i think the guys shooting competitions would 100% disagree with you.

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I know a handful that shoot competitively and they are split on the issue.

There is a lot of debate and I have read a lot on both sides. It has been pretty well proven that accuracy there can be a slight difference but it is very much over blown and the vast majority of the time it is due to a cold shooter not a clean barrel.

AKA- Fudd Science

I buy this for anyone interested in leaning more about shooting. It is a good easy read and something in there for everyone. The early chapters are pretty basic but I used a lot of the later info when I started shooting past 500 yards. Lots of good reminders.

Just so we are clear….your first shot on a long range hunting target post cleaning is a non-fouled or 'wet' bore?

TX_COWDOC said:

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Just so we are clear….your first shot on a long range hunting target post cleaning is a non-fouled or 'wet' bore?

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Yes

Please provide said proof. Not your own accounts . I'm interested to see this data and how this was conducted.

Hoyt Ag said:

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Please provide said proof. Not your own accounts . I'm interested to see this data and how this was conducted.

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Book I posted has a chapter on it but he kinda rides both sides of the fence but leans to a clean barrel. I will look for some of the more technical ones later

CTGilley said:

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TX_COWDOC said:

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Just so we are clear….your first shot on a long range hunting target post cleaning is a non-fouled or 'wet' bore?

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Yes

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Better answer is that I have no problem with taking that shot with a clean bore. I have not seen a significant shift in my rifles.

Normally, I check my rifle after traveling so it may have a few shots.

I was very much telling people the importance of a fouling shot just a few years ago. I just now believe it to be less important than I once did.

Edit: I would not have solvent or oil in the barrel. I would run dry patches prior to hunting.

My first shot fouler is always a flyer. I clean, then put some BreakFree CLP on a wet patch down the bore then shoot. Only then does the rifle go in the case.

Quote:

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I will look for some of the more technical ones later

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TX_COWDOC said:

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Scope/Rings are most likely. Also check stock / action screws as well.

I have my grandfather's old Winchester 30-06 and reluctantly changed out the glass from the original Redfield scope which confirmed to be a problem.

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This issue caused me 3 years of heartache. One of the screws that mounts the weaver rail to the stock was slightly loose. I'd be on the paper every time but my group was never better than 6". Drove me crazy.

CTGilley said:

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I know a handful that shoot competitively and they are split on the issue.

There is a lot of debate and I have read a lot on both sides. It has been pretty well proven that accuracy there can be a slight difference but it is very much over blown and the vast majority of the time it is due to a cold shooter not a clean barrel.

AKA- Fudd Science

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now this part I agree with. for hunting, the biggest thing is cold shooter. cold barrel. practicing that first shot is probably much more important than worrying about the absolute precision of the rifle barrel.