Hodgdon's site doesn't show a starting load with a velocity of less than 2,000 fps for the .308 Win and 180 grain bullets. You might have to use a handgun powder to get subsonic with the .308.Mr. Dubi said:
Just use this: Hodgdon data
Quote:
05-01-2012, 05:32 PM
That load data was available 100+ years ago. Was loaded with a M1906 bullet and was known as a "Guard" load. If you read many of the old writers they used around 6 gr in the 30-30 under a 311291 or similar PB"d cast bullet or 6.5 - 7.5 gr in the '06 for use as a "foraging" or practice load. Whelen had a load he used in the M1903 with the 311008 loaded with a Ideal tong tool that was very similar.
As to a "rule of thumb" having shot lots of such in rifles over the years I've found that lighter weight pistol bullets most often shoot more accurately at 800 - 950 fps with such loads. Thus I use 2.7 gr Bullseye in cases from 7.62x39 to 300 Savage in capacity with 90 - 118 gr PB'd pistol bullets. I use 3.2 gr Bullseye in .308W to '06 capacity cases with the same bullets. Those 2 loads have always worked in any .30 or .31 cal rifle. In .35 call rifles I've found that 120 - 160 gr pistol bullets also are the most accurate in the 800 - 950 fps range. I use 4 - 6.5 gr with those in the .35 Rem, .358W and 35 Whelens. Case that show that speckled crack around the web expansion ring signaling incipient case head seperation that haven't actually seperated yet are great to use with these loads. There is no real psi and these cases get a new lease on life and last practically forever with these 2.7 - 3.2 gr Bullseye loads under a 90 gr SWC or even the HBWCs sold by Hornady and Speer.
With low end loads rifle cast bullets I've found they shoot very accurately if cast soft and PB'd or GC'd at 1050 - 1200 fps, most often right around 1150 fps. I use Bullsey with those also using 6 - 8 gr depending on what it takes to get into that velocity range. Above 1200 fps Unique most often works better.
I also use light weight PB'd cast bullets in the 8x57, the .375 H&H and the 45-70. I use 6.5 gr+ depending on what is also needed to get the bullets to 1050 - 1200 fps. I do use 4 gr Bullseye in the 375 H&H with a 375 RB lightly lubed with LLA for 900 fps and a very deadly small game load to 50-75 yards.
I also have used 200 gr .30 and 8mm very soft cast bullets loaded down to 300 fps with success although it takes about 500 fps to get to 50 yards with the ladder milsurp sights. Using 1.5 to 2.7 gr bullseye gets you to those low end "cat's sneeze" velocities. Bullets must be cast of pure lead or 40-1 or they may stick in the barrel. A ight coat of LLA is all that's need for lube. Also if a rimless case is used you might consider well fire formed cases with the flash holes drilled (#30 - 28) to avoid the shortening of the cases headspace.
Larry Gibson
