I have property that was once used for grazing. Lots of bermuda, bahia grass, and some other stuff that clearly isn't native.
We have a wildlife exemption, and I'd really like to transform this to a native pasture.
We live in CS, off of Hwy 30.
I'd like to allow it to just grow and not have to shred it to keep it from overgrowth.

Any opinions on a couple of options?
1. cut current grass real low, spray with roundup (or other chemical), then disk a few times, and then plant.
2. get a tiller for my JD5085 and just till the heck out of the property a couple of times, then seed? Would this prevent the need to spray?
3. pay someone to come do this for me. If this is your recommendation, do you have anyone that you would recommend that could do this custom work?

Benefit of getting a tiller is that I could use it to have a food plot for the deer (maybe could use disk??) and then use it to make a huge garden.

The USDA NRCS has multiple programs to help you with this. If you don't want to go that route, here is my suggestion (with 35+ years of experience behind it).
1. Spray with a Roundup/2,4-D combo.
2. Spray again.
3. No-till a cool season cover crop with multiple grass/broadleaf/legume species. A little grazing is ok.
4. In early Feb, repeat 1. A few weeks later, no till your natives.

Tilling will hurt more than help.

You have a soil situation wrapped around an introduced monoculture. Get the micros/macros back in harmony with a native mix.

Trust me on this.

1. Spray with a Roundup/2,4-D combo. When would you do the spraying?
2. No tilling - would you run a disk over the pasture first or after, or nothing at all?
3. What kind of forage mixture would you recommend? We have no livestock.
4. Do you recommend a particular native mix, or do you mix it yourself?

You could chisel plow it then disc it to turn all the current grass under. Let it set and then disc it again. That will basically let you start with a fresh plowed ground to seed and plant.
If you are doing this to have as a food source to deer remember deer don't eat grass. You need to plant broad leaf plants and Forbes and browse species.
If you are doing this to enhance for turkeys, quail and dove I would suggest getting hold of your local NRCS agent and have them come and look at what you want to do.
You could also do no till planting as well.
We turned one of our smaller pastures of Bermuda into quail habitat with the help of our conservation department and they even assisted with the cost. Might check that out as well. Good luck with your project.

Gunny456 said:

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You could chisel plow it then disc it to turn all the current grass under. Let it set and then disc it again. That will basically let you start with a fresh plowed ground to seed and plant.
If you are doing this to have as a food source to deer remember deer don't eat grass. You need to plant broad leaf plants and Forbes and browse species.
If you are doing this to enhance for turkeys, quail and dove I would suggest getting hold of your local NRCS agent and have them come and look at what you want to do.
You could also do no till planting as well.
We turned one of our smaller pastures of Bermuda into quail habitat with the help of our conservation department and they even assisted with the cost. Might check that out as well. Good luck with your project.

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You just made Bermuda and Bahia very happy, as well as annual weeds.

No till planting is the key. Weeds are not stimulated, mulch is maintained, soil structure is maintained. Tilling is killing.

Depending on the soil, I can suggest a solid native mix.

Spraying done immediately. Follow up early September. Cover crop 1 October. No-till all the way......

We did that under the guidance of our local SCS rep back then. He was totally against spraying to kill. He said the soil base had turned very hard due to years of grazing and said to chisel it first then disc.... wait after a couple of rains then disc again. We did it at end of spring.... beginning of summer
Then he sent us to Kings Seeds in SA for a mix. It worked well for us. Has been at least 25 years ago.
Our biggest fight now is keeping cedar And mesquite out of it. We are in the hill country and don't have near the soil quality you guys have.
Sounds like you are very knowledgeable for that area and know what you are doing.

Gunny456 said:

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We did that under the guidance of our local SCS rep back then. He was totally against spraying to kill. He said the soil base had turned very hard due to years of grazing and said to chisel it first then disc.... wait after a couple of rains then disc again. We did it at end of spring.... beginning of summer
Then he sent us to Kings Seeds in SA for a mix. It worked well for us. Has been at least 25 years ago.
Our biggest fight now is keeping cedar And mesquite out of it. We are in the hill country and don't have near the soil quality you guys have.
Sounds like you are very knowledgeable for that area and know what you are doing.

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That's why I was on the next rung of the ladder above your local NRCS guy. I was in his Zone office as a specialist. I got the big bucks.

Call your TPWD Wildlife biologist and tell him/her what you want to do. This all fits with your wildlife exemption. There is a PUB program - pastures for upland birds, that you can probably use.

I started a NRCS sponsored project to convert 20 acres to native grass about 14 months ago. We sprayed roundup and a few weeks later no till drilled a blend of 12 native grass seeds. I tried to find a no till drill to borrow or rent but ended up hiring a contractor. I wish I would have been more patient and sprayed twice. There is still plenty of bermuda/bahia in the pasture but the natives are starting to appear in patches here and there.

B-1 83 said:

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Gunny456 said:

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We did that under the guidance of our local SCS rep back then. He was totally against spraying to kill. He said the soil base had turned very hard due to years of grazing and said to chisel it first then disc.... wait after a couple of rains then disc again. We did it at end of spring.... beginning of summer
Then he sent us to Kings Seeds in SA for a mix. It worked well for us. Has been at least 25 years ago.
Our biggest fight now is keeping cedar And mesquite out of it. We are in the hill country and don't have near the soil quality you guys have.
Sounds like you are very knowledgeable for that area and know what you are doing.

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That's why I was on the next rung of the ladder above your local NRCS guy. I was in his Zone office as a specialist. I got the big bucks.

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Wild card..... I want to do this, but I have some serious hog damage.... Like... Ripped my tailpipe of the pickup serious..... How do I repair that and do the native conversion?

I wanted to disc and drag a couple of telephone poles to smooth out all the hog wallows, wait a month, then spray.

Thoughts?

This is on primarily Latium clay. Black gumbo in E. Washington county.

cavscout96 said:

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This is on primarily Latium clay. Black gumbo in E. Washington county.

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Latium is an interesting soil. It is not a true black land soil, but darn sure black and sticky. I worked the Brenham Field Office for a few years out of A&M, and supervised the Agronomy my last 12. It will grow a SOLID native mix of Indiangrass, switchgrass, sideoats, etc......

If I have 75 acres where I want to do this exact project in Coleman county, who is the best contact?

DeBoss said:

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If I have 75 acres where I want to do this exact project in Coleman county, who is the best contact?

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USDA NRCS Coleman Field Office If converting pasture, INSIST on one season of cover crop.

B-1 83 said:

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The USDA NRCS has multiple programs to help you with this.

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This is interesting. What / how much of cost is covered typically?

Honky Tonk Hero said:

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B-1 83 said:

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The USDA NRCS has multiple programs to help you with this.

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This is interesting. What / how much of cost is covered typically?

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40-60%. Potentially more if veteran or "underserved" producer (you figure that out ;-)). You can maybe use a "Technical Service Provider" to help.

My 20 acre project was 100% covered. The NRCS representative told me they are generous because they are trying to encourage people like me to be good stewards of their land. Something like that. I'm thinking about doing another 20 acres.

Contact TPWD, they might have a drill you can rent or borrow.

But I can tell you you'll have hell finding a contractor in Brazos county that can do this work. No Till Drills are almost impossible to find here.

You might have luck finding someone out of Burleson County though.

Why not let it naturalize naturally? If left undisturbed it will naturalize within a few years.

Troutslime said:

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Why not let it naturalize naturally? If left undisturbed it will naturalize within a few years.

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"Naturalize" doesn't necessarily mean the better climax species. While nature will scratch and claw to get natives in there, it can be a looooooooooong slow process to get the good stuff in there.

Troutslime said:

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Why not let it naturalize naturally? If left undisturbed it will naturalize within a few years.

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bahiagrass and bermudagrass can fight the fight better than natives if they have already established.

honestly the slow method on small acreage may be the best fight. Try to establish plots, try to get a burn program going. Hope the natives can slowly increase over time.

Esp if the goal is wildlife.

B-1 83 said:

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cavscout96 said:

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This is on primarily Latium clay. Black gumbo in E. Washington county.

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Latium is an interesting soil. It is not a true black land soil, but darn sure black and sticky. I worked the Brenham Field Office for a few years out of A&M, and supervised the Agronomy my last 12. It will grow a SOLID native mix of Indiangrass, switchgrass, sideoats, etc......

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great, thanks. I've been really looking forward to giving this a shot.

any thoughts on how to repair the hog damage?

Spot fill/disc before the cover coop........and pray. We had no hogs in Washington County 83-85. Few deer - north of Burton had a few.

Thanks. That is helpful. We've been able (this year) to keep the hog damage at bay, so hopefully I can fix this stiff from previous years and move forward.


Repair
Cover crop
Spray
NT drill

cavscout96 said:

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Thanks. That is helpful. We've been able (this year) to keep the hog damage at bay, so hopefully I can fix this stiff from previous years and move forward.


Repair
Cover crop
Spray
NT drill

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Add a spray after repair. Every effort possible should be made to kill that present vegetation with no soil disturbance.

Rhizomes are a witch to get rid of. Best way to kill any Bermuda is poor soil quality. That isn't the goal. Like any exotic there comes a time where you need to lay the waste to it. You are correct it will naturalize over time In most situations but you need either terrible drought or terrible soils. Listen to the expert above his plan is a very good one. I will say having several years experience with native grass seeding find where you want to end up and try to match what your soil environment will handle. I see so many people try to grow tall grasses in shallow soils in hill country. Study your location and plant what would normally be found in that setting. Don't try to plant aspens in college station. I see wrong native grasses planted in wrong areas all the time. Happens out west where rainfall is in short supply some years. Talk to someone like you have above or a scs guy that can help you evaluate a realistic seed mix. I don't like Custom seed mixes. I choose to by mono seeds and seed To fit the Environment. Have fun learning native plants can be very very rewarding. Why range judging and range camps are still so important today. We need this knowledge to stay with a few of us.

thanks!

Wildlife Habitat Federation is also a good source for this type of project.
They will do consultation, have seed that you can purchase and will actually come do the prep & planting with their own equipment.

whf-texas.org

Damn! Dreaded quadruple post!

Listen to B-1 83. I taught him everything he knows! Ha! Just kidding. Although we did work together a hundred years ago.......Bruce knows his stuff!