Going to start looking at compact track loaders for when I retire at the end of this year. I'm going to need a write-off next year and have been wanting one for the ranch for a long time. I don't know a lot about them other than having used different ones on several occasions and they are handy for lots of different jobs.

Looking for recommendations for brands and dealers. Don't want a high end one as I've seen how much they can go up to. Just want a solid machine for the $.

Things I want:

Tracks
Enclosed cab with ac/heat.
High Flow
Brush package
Brush mulcher attachment
Standard other attachments like a bucket, post hole digger, trencher, etc.....

I'm located in Central Texas/Bastrop county.

Thanks.

Here are three brands I recommend you stick with because each uses a true planetary motor for the drive system. Others use simple drive motors. Trust me, you don't want drive motor replacements and this is a big deal. For this reason alone, I advise you avoid the Deere, Case, New Holland, and even the big name, Bobcat.
Go with:
Cat
Takeuchi
Kubota

Cat offers the best Cab because it is one complete unit sealing better than others.
Cat also has the best undercarriage because it is suspended which Means a better ride, less vibration on the rest of the machine, and longer track life.
Cat also offers the best High Flow and cooling packages if you must have high flow. They have two different versions of high flow and if you're thinking of using a mulcher (as you mentioned one) it's the only brand I'd recommend. Although, I don't think mulching full time with a skid steer or CTL is a good idea. So hopefully it's just a little around your own place.

Holt Cat is the dealer for your area.

Kubota and Takeuchi quality are both good.

I have been in the construction equipment business for 20 years and am happy to answer any questions you have.

We have a Kubota SVL95 with high flow. The thing is a beast. It replaced a 75 and it's unbelievable how much more power the thing has. I prefer hand controls so I'm not a fan of Case, but they aren't terrible. The only issue I could see some people running into with the 95 vs the 75 is 77" wide vs 68" wide which doesn't fit on our original trailer, so something to consider if you have narrow axles.

Catag94 said:

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Here are three brands I recommend you stick with because each uses a true planetary motor for the drive system. Others use simple drive motors. Trust me, you don't want drive motor replacements and this is a big deal. For this reason alone, I advise you avoid the Deere, Case, New Holland, and even the big name, Bobcat.
Go with:
Cat
Takeuchi
Kubota

Cat offers the best Cab because it is one complete unit sealing better than others.
Cat also has the best undercarriage because it is suspended which Means a better ride, less vibration on the rest of the machine, and longer track life.
Cat also offers the best High Flow and cooling packages if you must have high flow. They have two different versions of high flow and if you're thinking of using a mulcher (as you mentioned one) it's the only brand I'd recommend. Although, I don't think mulching full time with a skid steer or CTL is a good idea. So hopefully it's just a little around your own place.

Holt Cat is the dealer for your area.

Kubota and Takeuchi quality are both good.

I have been in the construction equipment business for 20 years and am happy to answer any questions you have.

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Cat, if you don't mind me asking, are you with Holt?

Hard to argue with this list, I do not have any experience with Cat, but I can tell you Takeuchi and Kubota are absolutely phenomenal machines. I have been impressed with the Takeuchi TL8 and TL10.

I also echo what Cat said, stay away from Deere and Bobcat as they spend an enormous amount of time in our shop and the foot controls on a Bobcat drive me crazy.

Actually, yes, but not in the OP's area.
I also have a lot of experience with Bobcat, m, Takeuchi, and the Kubota products.

Sorry, OP. I didn't mean to hijack your thread.

Very nice, my old mentor just moved over to Texas First and that is why I was asking.

Hey! No worries. Keep the input coming. Thanks.

Kubota, Cat, Taekuchi, Bobcat, Deere

That order based on my experience of having them on jobsites for 20ish years. Kubota and Cat can almost be interchanged.

Na Zdrav 87 said:

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Brush mulcher attachment

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That's a very, very demanding application.

Although I've never owned a track loader, I have hired in a company to do mulching for me and their smaller machine was a Terex/ASV 120 HP track loader with the high flow hydraulics package.

I was very impressed with the amount of work it was able to do, and the size of the trees it was able to reduce to mulch. While it wasn't as fast as the big 250+ HP hydro axes I've hired in, it handled even the large stuff.

This particular company does nothing but mulching and runs its machines hard day in and day out, so you may want to look at Terex/ASV as well as the other brands recommended here, as I really don't think they'd stick with Terex like they have if they were troublesome machines.

The best mulching heads will demand high flow hydraulics, and you'll find that you get more performance (at the cost of tooth life) from steel planer teeth than you will from carbide teeth.

Funny thing about tax write offs - unless you're in the 100% bracket, they'll still cost you something!

Enjoy your machine, and your retirement.

Thanks Ribeye.
True on the tax write-off. It's more of an excuse to buy one than anything. I've always wanted one. Got plenty of tractors and other equipment but don't have a track loader. I've got a LOT of work for it to do in my retirement.

If you really do your research, you will find that the undercarriage of the ASV machines is a very fragile and expensive one. It does offer the smoothest of rides, is really only advisable for sandy or grassy underfoot conditions. Any rock at all and the ASV can cost you from $5 to $12 per hour over time. Give this some serious thought before you buy one with that undercarriage. Cat offer the same undercarriage on the units that have model numbers ending in 7 (i.e. 297D). I would do my best to steer you away from buying on of these too.

Thanks Catag for your input.

Just for kicks since I haven't began pricing yet, what order does Cat, Takeuchi and Kubota fall in price wise?
And yes, the mulching I plan to do will be on my own places. Mainly clearing and mulching small brush along river and creek bottoms.

I am sure the Cat will have the highest price tag followed by probably Tak and the Kubota. Kubota has many different dealers and prices will vary from one to another much more (they compete against each other alot).

Since you're not really in a hurry, take time to study the used market. Not because you want buy a used one, but rather to see the values for comparison as they age. You may and may not ever sell what you buy, but make no mistake, it is still an investment. I imagine you would prefer to make the smartest choice. It is very common for one to be 4-8 grand more up front but also be worth 6-15 grand more later. This makes alone would mean it is not the most expensive to own. You would also want to find out who offers you the best support for the years you'll own/operate it. One brand may be better for support after the sale in El Paso, while another brand may be far better choice in Houston. You want to know who will service you where you are. Then, you need to consider things like track life comparisons, fuel burn comparisons, creature comforts and safety, etc.

Once you decide, no matter what brand, if you intend to mulch with it, you need a FULL Forestry package and you should get the auxiliary hydraulic oil cooler option. Beyond that, you must be meticulous about keep in it clean and well maintained. As others have said, mulching is extremely taxing on any of these machines. people have learned over the last 12-15 years, that improperly equipment machines and poor maintenance can be serious many people have burned lots skids steers regardless of brand to the ground.

I am not sure about Kubota as they have only been making CTLs for a few years now, or Takeuichi, but Cat offers a fully and properly equipped machine from the factory for this application. These are significantly more expense than the machines without the full gear so be prepared. But, don't cut corners for cost reasons, or, don't do the mulching with your own machine, hire it out or rent one.

Are you sure you want a mulching head, or would something like a Ground Shark high flow shredder be sufficient?

While I can see a Kubota 95 being able to run a GroundShark, there is no way I would put a mulcher on it. A 95hp Kubota is around $73K.

I believe New Holland used to make Deere machines. All the hay guys I know run New Hollands, granted most of them are wheeled machines. For their size, New Holland will reach higher than competitor's machines. When loading hay on an 18 wheeler, it might make a difference. I used a New Holland C237 to move some hay and it worked well.

I would be curious to hear some of the knocks on the New Hollands.

CatAg - Thanks for all your input so far. Can you post general prices of a 259D, 289D and 299?

OP - one thing to consider is what you will really do with it, and whether you need more than the 74 HP models that don't need DEF.

Having had Terex equipment on site - I wouldn't touch it unless you like looking at your equipment not operating more often than not. They are often popular because they are cheap.

I had a 55ton Terex hydro crane we bought brand new on my project site a few years back. I think it had something in the area of 10 hours on it when it showed up on my jobsite. Still had the new crane smell from the dealer. It spent as much time down getting warranty (and non-warranty, which I'm still mad about) work done as it did actually operating. Not impressed at all with the quality they produce.

milkman00 said:

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Are you sure you want a mulching head, or would something like a Ground Shark high flow shredder be sufficient?

While I can see a Kubota 95 being able to run a GroundShark, there is no way I would put a mulcher on it. A 95hp Kubota is around $73K.

I believe New Holland used to make Deere machines. All the hay guys I know run New Hollands, granted most of them are wheeled machines. For their size, New Holland will reach higher than competitor's machines. When loading hay on an 18 wheeler, it might make a difference. I used a New Holland C237 to move some hay and it worked well.

I would be curious to hear some of the knocks on the New Hollands.

CatAg - Thanks for all your input so far. Can you post general prices of a 259D, 289D and 299?

OP - one thing to consider is what you will really do with it, and whether you need more than the 74 HP models that don't need DEF.

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These are great points. In fact, some of the brush shredders today can handle pretty large brush and run on standard flow even.

New Holland did make the Deere machines but that was a really long time ago (early to mid 2000's). Many of the brands today make machines that lift much higher that the 10'6" range that has historically been the max. Cat is not yet one of those. As far as the NH CTL, I am not a fan of their Drive motor quality and their non suspended undercarriage. Their service accessibility has always been an issue also. But most of all is their resale value. Again, these are investments so one should consider both the purchase price and the buyer market later.

Great point on the <75hp models. They will still have a DPF but wont require DEF. Still important to run them at higher RPMs more and not idle a lot. the only Cat model with DEF is the 299D.

Lots of variables on prices, but ROUGH ranges:
259D - $58K to $66K depending on options, etc.
289D - $65K to $74K depending on options, etc.
299D - $75K to $100K+ depending on options, etc.
There are lots of options to consider, especially on the 299D.

Cat is currently rolling out their newest models with some new features. These are the D3 versions.

OP - Based on your original post, you said you didn't want a high end one, but the options you mention wanting (forestry package, mulcher) put you in the category of needing a high end one.

CatAg can correct me, but if really going with a mulcher, you would need a fancy 299D Cat. If you can do with a shredder, then it opens your options up a lot, along with bringing down your price significantly.

Cat is the ultimate buy once, cry once. I know a guy that bought a used Cat 930 loader 36 years ago, and it is worth as much today as he paid for it. Granted he probably also has as much in repairs as he paid for the machine - partly due to Holt's mechanics having issues with directions. If they can screw up directions where the owner can see Holt's building from the jobsite, I would hate to see their service calls to Bastrop. The last time my contact needed repair work done, Holt didn't even respond, after 2 attempts, so I fixed the machine instead.

Our bulldozer guy ran off a Holt mechanic that was supposed to be working on a D6T when it had issues on our rootplowing job. The mechanic stopped at the D6R on site and said he couldn't see the D6T that was sitting on a hill 300 yards away in clear view. When I finally drove the mechanic to the D6T, he started complaining about the maintenance that he felt hadn't been performed on it, including an oil change. The owner had literally changed the oil the prior week in that machine. The owner sent that mechanic back to the shop and requested one of his two regulars instead. Oh, and Holt failed to flag a parts order as the machine being down, so it took a week to get in a new injection pump. So instead of being up again and finishing the job, it rained 2 inches and delayed the project that much more.

If you do look at New Holland, I know Equipment Depot was significantly cheaper (over $5000 less) than the other guys. One neighbor goes to Lagrange (Kleiber Equip) and other friends use Williamson County Equipment in Taylor. Its been a year or so, but I was told the C237 high flow with cab and most of the goodies was under $53k.

So what you're saying is you dont like holt's service?

The ASV Rt120 has the highest flow to the head. If you want to mulch, you need all the flow you can get. They also have a great cooling package, and I've never heard of one running hot on the hydraulics. They can be had for under 100k. The only undercarriage problem I have seen is with the axles, and I've never seen ASV not cover them even when the machine is out of warranty. Starting 9/1 they have 2 years of warranty.

Note:. I do work at an ASV dealer so take that as you will.

Holt service caters so much to the big boys that if you are a small outfit, your experience may suffer. The best mechanic that worked on that 930 I mentioned is on contract with a huge construction company now where he can't even be requested to come back to the little guy.

It's quite disappointing considering how great the people were there when I was 5. I wanted to ride on a bulldozer for my birthday. Dad took me in there and the salesman made my day and made it happen. Two weeks later that salesman ended up with a sale out of the deal. Now they don't seem to care about the little guy.

Milkman, it sounds like you have had some tough experiences. I hate hearing that and there is no excuse for it. I would simply say that those aren't the normal experiences throughout Holt's territory. Yes Holt has some techs that are on Resident status with some contractors. This means those contractors are paying for 100% of their time so they aren't available to service other calls. However, Holt has also hired and designated techs specifically for the l products. The Austin, Pflugerville, and the new Georgetown locations will have techs for these needs. Also, I in the DFW Area, but if you ever need some assistance, don't hesitate to reach out to me.

Thanks. Hopefully we don't need help too soon, but good to know of a lead if we have issues.

I certainly understand the idea of having dedicated guys to certain contractors. It just sucks when we found one we liked that knew what he was doing on older equipment and haven't been able to replace him.

Seeing the issues our bulldozer man went thru really showed the downfall of the construction industry being so swamped with work lately.

Is Danuser still the best hydraulic auger system for post holes?

Danuser is a good one.
There is also one made by a company called Premier Augers that I think is really good. https://www.premierattach.com
Actually the Cat brand augers are also good if you run across one at a good price.

We use Belltec located in Belton, Texas

http://www.belltec.net/

Something to consider is the mulching head you use. I ran a bradco not knowing the difference. It was fine and trouble free, but the cat 272c I ran it on just didn't have the horsepower to run hammers on oak and elm. My solution was to run 15 chippers in the middle for the larger trees knowing I'd have to change them out often. Choppers are like a chain saw, put them in the dirt and they're done. I got to watch another outfit running cimaf heads with all chippers on 299c carriers. They were amazing and made the smallest shreds cutting down on cleanup. They also made the best use of 94hp which is the same as my 272c. Biggest complaint with the cat machine was ac and service. Ac condenser design couldn't have been worse for dust and the shop mechanics charged over 100/hr to guess and change parts. This was mustang, not holt. If I were buying another today I'd get either a tak or Kubota and cimaf head.

The C model Cat machines were not even close to what Cat offers today in D models with XHP. The XHP machines are 107hp (net) and offer hydraulics of 40 gpm at 4061 psi.
Also, the Cat A/C has changed significantly too. It is much better sealed and easier to service.

I'd recommend the FAE heads or a head made by Fecon.

Catag94 said:

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The C model Cat machines were not even close to what Cat offers today in D models with XHP. The XHP machines are 107hp (net) and offer hydraulics of 40 gpm at 4061 psi.
Also, the Cat A/C has changed significantly too. It is much better sealed and easier to service.

I'd recommend the FAE heads or a head made by Fecon.

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I agree with all that, but for the price of a XHD, I'd go for a dedicated carrier with at least 140hp. Fecon does seem to be the standard for high horsepower machines, but even the xhd model is underpowered for continuous use in hardwoods. That's why I'd look for a head that will carve the tree instead of hammer it to death.

I agree and, if someone has a lot of mulching to do or, especially, intends to do it commercially, I would also definitely recommend a purpose built machine like a Fecon. That said, there is still a very substantial price jump from a fully decked out XHP machine with head (roughly $120K) and a 140hp range Fecon or other dedicated mulcher.

Mulcher heads are awesome. I've also seen lots of machines burned up because the debris wasn't cleaned and caught on fire. Had good experience with cat and kubota.

What's a good place to look for a solid, clean used machine in Central Texas?

PM me and I can give you my rep Spencers info at holt cat in San Antonio.

Na Zdrav 87 - you sound a whole lot like myself. I've been researching CTL with mulching heads for several years now. I would use it primarily for my place (still yet to buy but I'm looking in Bastrop County as well) but I may do some contract work on the side to write off the machine.

After extensive research on both CTL machines and mulching heads, the hands down winner is the Kubota 95 SVL for a personal use dude (you and me). Unless you're an extremely wealthy land owner, the CAT 299D is awesome but it'll cost $25 - $30,000 more than the Kubota.

I found a brand new Kubota for $68,500 including the ROPS (Roll Over Protection System). You would have to buy an aftermarket front lexan door for an additional $1,000. Ewald Kubota in Austin offers an SVL 95 special for $67,000 but it doesn't have an enclosed cab so it's not an option.

You need to look at the type ground you will mulch. Rocky? - you'll need carbide teeth. Carbide teeth are way less efficient and won't make as small a mulch as the alternative. But, Carbide teeth will eat rocks and keep on mulching.

If you have a more sandy loam type soil, then you'll want knives (steel teeth) instead of carbide teeth. The knives are 100% more efficient and create a much finer mulch but they will dull every time you hit a rock. They also make heads with interchangeable teeth (switch back and forth between the two depending upon the job).

The two best heads are Denis Cimaf and FAE. They both make a $35,000 mulching head that has an internal hydraulic cooler so you won't need the auxiliary cooler on top of the CTL. Another option instead of getting the cooler is to get a bite-limiter head. These type heads limit the depth of the bite thus allowing the head to stay at high speeds all times (won't get bogged down in deep wood which slows the head and creates enormous heat).

Contact me anytime at Jnnyberg at Hotmail dot com. I would be happy to talk anytime or share whatever info I have.