I'm trying to plan a hike to The Narrows on the Blanco some time soon and I was doing some researching. It seems a lot of people who've done it have problems with the law/land owners saying you can't be down there (even though it's public land). I'm just looking for someone who's hiked it before for any info/tips that could help me plan this trip.
Hiking to The Narrows
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Last: 5 yr ago by JSKolache
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I contacted the Texas Land Conservancy to see if they offered any guided tours of The Narrows. In my email I mentioned that I was trying to avoid the 6.7 mile hike in and out, but stay within the limits of the trespassing laws. Their response was: "You are correct in that you can legally access the Narrows via the river bed. However, once you reach the actual Narrows the only way to traverse it or see it from above involves trespassing as you must leave the river bed and climb up the cliffs. This is a violation of the landowners property rights and both the north and south landowners are very serious about enforcing their rights against trespassers. -Leigh Stuemke"
from comments section: https://texasriverbum.com/index.php/2014/09/17/hike-and-hassled-to-the-narrows/
The river bed may be "public property", but the land is not. The second you leave the stream bed you are trespassing. It also may be illegal to park where they did and walk up, because the ROW may have actually been owned by landowners, not the state.
This is not your property. My advice is to get permission, or go someplace else.
Statement from Sheriff Dept: http://thenarrowsblancotexas.com/wp-narrows/wp-content/uploads/letter-from-sheriff-nn.pdf
You can bet on game cameras being there along the way to document any time you get out of the streambed, especially if it requires you to stray a bit to move upstream. You can almost guarantee a camera is in the spot referenced above. Only way you can legally do it is to portage your watercraft around an obstruction. Unless you want to carry a kayak with you, I wouldn't recommend it.
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Sounds like bringing a drone is in order.
Park somewhere legally, or get a drop off so you don't have to sweat your vehicle getting towed.
Then just stay in the river bed and tell land owners to pound sand.
Then just stay in the river bed and tell land owners to pound sand.
schmellba99: Hard to believe people are looking at what is happening and thinking this is something other than a flu like bug
No. Here is why.LiveOak said:
Park somewhere legally, or get a drop off so you don't have to sweat your vehicle getting towed.
Then just stay in the river bed and tell land owners to pound sand.
I was recently at the Narrows, legally, having been escorted there by a ranch manager because I'm doing some business with the owners and was asked if I'd like to see it.
The ranch manager told me multiple stories about dozens of trespassers parking ahd hiking across the adjoining ranches, some of whom were in very bad shape from dehydration etc by the time they were found. Some had no clue that they were on private property, or at least acted like they didn't, and some were blantanly trespassing and didn't care.
The ranch manager has asked multiple people if they had enough water for the hike, keep in mind that you are looking at roughly a 14 mile round trip and it is not a straight shot. There is very little shade and there are no ammenities nearby. Now, this ranch manager is a nice guy, but telling him to pound sand isn't smart since he's had to rescue multiple people, usually from Austin that had no clue what they were really doing.
Legally speaking, if you stay in the center of the river you are technically legal. The locals may check on you but there is a reason for that. The manager told me his biggest fear is finding a body. This same manager has rescued the same people that told him to go "eff" himself, when he checked on them.
So, you might try being polite and see how that works. Also, I do not know of any legal parking anywhere you can get to or from the Narrows, so you may have to be dropped off.
My "pound sand" comment was directed to land owners who try scare tactics to keep people out. That shat wears me out.
Obviously, a helpful and nice land owner/ranch manager who wants to keep people from harming themselves - totally different scenario. I would guess he's in the minority.
Obviously, a helpful and nice land owner/ranch manager who wants to keep people from harming themselves - totally different scenario. I would guess he's in the minority.
schmellba99: Hard to believe people are looking at what is happening and thinking this is something other than a flu like bug
What I've gathered is you have to be fully prepared and stay in the river bed and it's technically legal. But I've also read stories of people doing it it the legal way and still being harassed
LiveOak said:
My "pound sand" comment was directed to land owners who try scare tactics to keep people out. That shat wears me out.
This. I've read a few accounts of hiking to this place and they all had this general theme. It's really annoying how the landowners think that this public land/resource belongs to them and they try to regulate the narrows like their own personal swimming holes. It really chaps their ass that commoners are allowed to enjoy "their" river. Sorry but if you can't handle the fact that the river is public property and other people might utilize/enjoy it, then you shouldn't have bought land there. Azzhole rich people ruin everything, just like the can ban on the river in new braunfels.
In
etxag18 said:
What I've gathered is you have to be fully prepared and stay in the river bed and it's technically legal. But I've also read stories of people doing it it the legal way and still being harassed
There is some discussion as to whether or not the Blanco is "legally navigable waters" or not. It depends on who you ask. According to the legislature it is, but IMHO, it is not. As I understand the Texas Parks and Wildlife statute, it is not. Putting a kyak on it does not make it "navigable", I hear that a lot.
Please keep in mind that these landowners have had gates left open, found big groups of college kids that were lost, dealt with a lot of liter being left behind, camp fires etc etc etc. One nearby rancher was sued because a kid broke his leg in a nearby cave. The landowner won the suit but it still cost him tens of thousands of dollars.
According to my guy, the county attorney will not prosecute anyone for being in the river, but they will for being on the land adjacent to it. So, stay in the center of the river, carry plenty of water and be polite to land owners.
Yes, according to the letter of the law, you can be there but don't get mad if a landowner checks on you. There are reasons for it. Further, given the sheer volume of traspassers that are found, some of the ones claiming to have done it "The legal way" are probably lying.
drummer0415 said:LiveOak said:
My "pound sand" comment was directed to land owners who try scare tactics to keep people out. That shat wears me out.
This. I've read a few accounts of hiking to this place and they all had this general theme. It's really annoying how the landowners think that this public land/resource belongs to them and they try to regulate the narrows like their own personal swimming holes. It really chaps their ass that commoners are allowed to enjoy "their" river. Sorry but if you can't handle the fact that the river is public property and other people might utilize/enjoy it, then you shouldn't have bought land there. Azzhole rich people ruin everything, just like the can ban on the river in new braunfels.
As a fellow rich azzhole river landowner, I say, pick up your damn garbage. ALL OF IT. Stay in the river bed. My private property is not your exploration grounds. You have no right to be on the land I worked my ass off for, period. There is no portion you can walk on my place in normal river flow. Had many trashy campers leave still burning fires and garbage on my property.
The stream bed may be technically "navigable" in the legal sense, but not the practical. You are wanting to use it for a hike like you would through public lands out west. I suggest you try that instead of aggravating landowners. And that's what you'll be doing, even if it's technically legal.
It's ridiculous that people do that. I was looking for places to hike and came across this. It wasn't until I really started looking into that I found out about all the other stuff. I want to do it the right way and not upset anyone
You read the post from the guy right above you... The landowners don't give a crap if you do everything 100% legal, they're still going to be pissed.etxag18 said:
It's ridiculous that people do that. I was looking for places to hike and came across this. It wasn't until I really started looking into that I found out about all the other stuff. I want to do it the right way and not upset anyone
Is it possible to run an airboat up in there? Wouldn't be running straight pipes or anything like some coonass. My rigs good. Might even pack out an extra sack or too or trash to show appreciation to the landowners.
SWCBonfire said:
As a fellow rich azzhole river landowner, I say, pick up your damn garbage. ALL OF IT. Stay in the river bed. My private property is not your exploration grounds. You have no right to be on the land I worked my ass off for, period. There is no portion you can walk on my place in normal river flow. Had many trashy campers leave still burning fires and garbage on my property.
The stream bed may be technically "navigable" in the legal sense, but not the practical. You are wanting to use it for a hike like you would through public lands out west. I suggest you try that instead of aggravating landowners. And that's what you'll be doing, even if it's technically legal.
The first part of your post is completely understandable and reasonable and I agree with you 100%. People have no right to come on your property, and trashing your property is despicable.
However, The second part of your post completely proves my point. You want to treat the entire thing like it's YOUR private property, but news flash, it's not. You don't care if the waterway is public property, you still don't want people there because it "aggrevates you". That's the part that makes you an azzhole. Wanting to deprive a fellow Texas from enjoying what is rightfully his is not cool.
There are ways to remedy unwanted people from coming onto your property. Lots of Texans have figured that out, considering there are millions of miles of fencing all over Texas. Hell I don't care if you put 30 attack pitbulls on chains long enough to reach the edge of your property, and then add some land mines for good measure, but the mindset of trying to keep people away from the river entirely and from enjoying the public property because you want to act as if it's your own is ridiculous. That's just part of what comes with the territory (no pun intended) of owning private land right next to public land. Wanting to restrict the rights of others simply because you don't like them is a very liberal mindset.
Brad06ag said:You read the post from the guy right above you... The landowners don't give a crap if you do everything 100% legal, they're still going to be pissed.etxag18 said:
It's ridiculous that people do that. I was looking for places to hike and came across this. It wasn't until I really started looking into that I found out about all the other stuff. I want to do it the right way and not upset anyone
Best to go to Colorado is you really want to hike, overland and explore. Texas is poor for these activities due to lack of public land.
I would go to Colorado but it's about a 14 hour drive compared to a 3 hour drive to Blanco
Has the OB ever discussed Scotland's Land Reform Act of 2003? In summary (as I understand it), all land and water is accessible by the public as long as you are "behaving responsibly."
https://www.scotways.com/faq/law-on-statutory-access-rights
Despite our common love of the outdoors, I suspect many here might be opposed given the conflict with the private property rights we hold so dear (Exhibit A: SWCBonfire's post above). I will say that as a tourist "behaving responsibly", I greatly enjoyed the ability to explore the Scottish Highlands without fear of harassment or legal consequences. Not sure I would feel the same way as a landowner though...
https://www.scotways.com/faq/law-on-statutory-access-rights
Despite our common love of the outdoors, I suspect many here might be opposed given the conflict with the private property rights we hold so dear (Exhibit A: SWCBonfire's post above). I will say that as a tourist "behaving responsibly", I greatly enjoyed the ability to explore the Scottish Highlands without fear of harassment or legal consequences. Not sure I would feel the same way as a landowner though...
This is a comment of a friend of mine in NB on the Guadalupe.
Imagine that lots of travelers come to your neighborhood and walk up and down your street. And every now and then they come in your yard and take a shlt and leave trash. Would you be ok with that on a daily basis!
Imagine that lots of travelers come to your neighborhood and walk up and down your street. And every now and then they come in your yard and take a shlt and leave trash. Would you be ok with that on a daily basis!
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Have a close friend that lives on a very famous residential street that is frequented by visitors obviously not from the area and obviously there for freebies/handouts. The big times are halloween and during the holidays. On halloween, van and truckloads of kids from far-flung neighborhoods get dropped off and walk the streets getting treats from the people that live there. Some bad eggs occur, but for the most part, its just kids looking to have fun in an area where people can and do participate in the activity.
Same thing at christmas. There are even carriage rides running all evening right down their street.
With respect to all of that stuff, their attitude is just to be graceful about it and take pride in what they have even if the uninvited visitors aren't willing to.
It sounds like the people around the narrows area have gone the exact opposite direction -- including going as far as involving local authorities in preserving the fortress of solitude.
What is surprising is that no one in the area seems to recognize that they're sitting on a potential gold mine (or at least a real source of revenue). Why not sell permitted access to the area on a premium basis? Then you get to control ingress, egress, activities while on site, and make some money while doing it.
The rush to contention over whatever issue may be pressing always seems so divisive and ignores the reality that there may be more mutually beneficial solutions out there.
Same thing at christmas. There are even carriage rides running all evening right down their street.
With respect to all of that stuff, their attitude is just to be graceful about it and take pride in what they have even if the uninvited visitors aren't willing to.
It sounds like the people around the narrows area have gone the exact opposite direction -- including going as far as involving local authorities in preserving the fortress of solitude.
What is surprising is that no one in the area seems to recognize that they're sitting on a potential gold mine (or at least a real source of revenue). Why not sell permitted access to the area on a premium basis? Then you get to control ingress, egress, activities while on site, and make some money while doing it.
The rush to contention over whatever issue may be pressing always seems so divisive and ignores the reality that there may be more mutually beneficial solutions out there.
Dude should put a needle in the halloween candy one year and it would probably taper off.
Bad eggs always ruin it for everyone else. Folks need to respect what is not theirs.
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Back up, Bubba Jack. As mentioned, there is no walkable streambed on my property (Guadalupe). It is boat only. No tubers in this part of the country (Gonzales co.) There were people fishing upstream and downstream of our swimming hole this past weekend. We tried to be reasonably respectful of their fishing, but we have the right to be in the river, just as they do. Except I have the right to sit on the bank and drink a cold one, and they don't.
And if you check a lot of the deeds up in the Hill Country, they go to the center of the streambed, or even include the stream bed. So even though you may have a right to ACCESS, you may be, in fact, walking on someone's deeded, private property. You only have a right of passage. It literally MAY NOT be public property you're talking about.
Someone want to look on Hays County appraisal district and see?
Private property rights are the very cornerstone of American capitalism. This is a horrible point.
And if you check a lot of the deeds up in the Hill Country, they go to the center of the streambed, or even include the stream bed. So even though you may have a right to ACCESS, you may be, in fact, walking on someone's deeded, private property. You only have a right of passage. It literally MAY NOT be public property you're talking about.
Someone want to look on Hays County appraisal district and see?
Quote:
Wanting to restrict the rights of others simply because you don't like them is a very liberal mindset.
Private property rights are the very cornerstone of American capitalism. This is a horrible point.
It's really simple. You can't under any circumstances cross someone's private property. If you have to do that to get to the river it is not accessible and you need find another activity. If you have permission from a landowner or can access from a public access point you have every right to be there but you should under no circumstances stray onto private property once there. If you get access always pack out your trash. I don't know anything about the narrows but it sounds like there is no reasonable access without trespassing so as much as it sucks it's not a public place.drummer0415 said:SWCBonfire said:
As a fellow rich azzhole river landowner, I say, pick up your damn garbage. ALL OF IT. Stay in the river bed. My private property is not your exploration grounds. You have no right to be on the land I worked my ass off for, period. There is no portion you can walk on my place in normal river flow. Had many trashy campers leave still burning fires and garbage on my property.
The stream bed may be technically "navigable" in the legal sense, but not the practical. You are wanting to use it for a hike like you would through public lands out west. I suggest you try that instead of aggravating landowners. And that's what you'll be doing, even if it's technically legal.
The first part of your post is completely understandable and reasonable and I agree with you 100%. People have no right to come on your property, and trashing your property is despicable.
However, The second part of your post completely proves my point. You want to treat the entire thing like it's YOUR private property, but news flash, it's not. You don't care if the waterway is public property, you still don't want people there because it "aggrevates you". That's the part that makes you an azzhole. Wanting to deprive a fellow Texas from enjoying what is rightfully his is not cool.
There are ways to remedy unwanted people from coming onto your property. Lots of Texans have figured that out, considering there are millions of miles of fencing all over Texas. Hell I don't care if you put 30 attack pitbulls on chains long enough to reach the edge of your property, and then add some land mines for good measure, but the mindset of trying to keep people away from the river entirely and from enjoying the public property because you want to act as if it's your own is ridiculous. That's just part of what comes with the territory (no pun intended) of owning private land right next to public land. Wanting to restrict the rights of others simply because you don't like them is a very liberal mindset.
drummer0415 said:LiveOak said:
My "pound sand" comment was directed to land owners who try scare tactics to keep people out. That shat wears me out.
This. I've read a few accounts of hiking to this place and they all had this general theme. It's really annoying how the landowners think that this public land/resource belongs to them and they try to regulate the narrows like their own personal swimming holes. It really chaps their ass that commoners are allowed to enjoy "their" river. Sorry but if you can't handle the fact that the river is public property and other people might utilize/enjoy it, then you shouldn't have bought land there. Azzhole rich people ruin everything, just like the can ban on the river in new braunfels.
At this location, which land adjacent to the river is public?
I'm neither rich, nor a landowner. Just a lowly commoner.drummer0415 said:LiveOak said:
My "pound sand" comment was directed to land owners who try scare tactics to keep people out. That shat wears me out.
This. I've read a few accounts of hiking to this place and they all had this general theme. It's really annoying how the landowners think that this public land/resource belongs to them and they try to regulate the narrows like their own personal swimming holes. It really chaps their ass that commoners are allowed to enjoy "their" river. Sorry but if you can't handle the fact that the river is public property and other people might utilize/enjoy it, then you shouldn't have bought land there. Azzhole rich people ruin everything, just like the can ban on the river in new braunfels.
But if I were a rich landowner, knowing what lowly commoners typically end up doing to public areas - I'd be a butthole as well. And while it sucks for the 95% of the people that want to visit and are generally good people, the fact of the matter is that the other 5% are not good people and are the reason those landowners pretty much have to be an ******* - because they will destroy, litter and otherwise absolutely ruin something cool like the Narrows if left unchecked.
Don't believe me? Go to any publicly accessible place and tell me what you see. I'll save you the effort - it's not pretty. There isn't a boat ramp, bank fishing spot or section of beach down here that isn't effed up by that 5% of the population that flat doesn't care about being something other than the same garbage they leave behind. Sucks, but it is what it is.
I never knew what "The Narrows" looked like, but it's pretty awesome.
A landowner could make some extra change by allowing folks access to this, similar to Kreuse springs.
(Just don't let it become an overcrowded sh*thole like Kruese can be in peak summer hours)
I think it's funny that people think ranchers should jump at the chance to get into the amusement park business.Apache said:
I never knew what "The Narrows" looked like, but it's pretty awesome.
A landowner could make some extra change by allowing folks access to this, similar to Kreuse springs.
(Just don't let it become an overcrowded sh*thole like Kruese can be in peak summer hours)
What I've gathered is there's a public access point about 7 miles up river. From there you have to hike into the Narrows and as long as you're within the river beds it's legal, but people have ran into problems with the landowners/law saying they can't even be in the river beds which is false
Where in my post did I say they should "jump at the chance"? I said a man could make some extra change.
That kind of "amusement park business" I guarantee would pay a hell of lot better than cattle most years.
Besides, plenty of ranchers are willing to put up with the headaches of lease hunters... which could be considered a form of amusement park.
That kind of "amusement park business" I guarantee would pay a hell of lot better than cattle most years.
Besides, plenty of ranchers are willing to put up with the headaches of lease hunters... which could be considered a form of amusement park.
Well that's different. Growing up, I always wanted to float the Devils River but at the time there was no good public access and the ranchers in that area had a reputation of being the sort that would shoot you first then come and kick the crap out of your carcass. It's a delicate balance. You can say the ranchers are angry SOB's but part of the reason those areas are so pristine is other than a handful of people and cows nobody goes there.etxag18 said:
What I've gathered is there's a public access point about 7 miles up river. From there you have to hike into the Narrows and as long as you're within the river beds it's legal, but people have ran into problems with the landowners/law saying they can't even be in the river beds which is false
Sounds like the same general issue as with the Devil's River which has been discussed on here before.
Limited legal access points and you cant leave the riverbed if you need to.
Limited legal access points and you cant leave the riverbed if you need to.
Well I can't argue with that logic. Those are very similar things. I'm just thinking about the small group of ranchers I know. None of them are what I would consider a people-person.Apache said:
Where in my post did I say they should "jump at the chance"? I said a man could make some extra change.
That kind of "amusement park business" I guarantee would pay a hell of lot better than cattle most years.
Besides, plenty of ranchers are willing to put up with the headaches of lease hunters... which could be considered a form of amusement park.
And in the same breath complain what a hard life it is being a rancher because cattle prices are down, feed prices are up.rootube said:I think it's funny that people think ranchers should jump at the chance to get into the amusement park business.Apache said:
I never knew what "The Narrows" looked like, but it's pretty awesome.
A landowner could make some extra change by allowing folks access to this, similar to Kreuse springs.
(Just don't let it become an overcrowded sh*thole like Kruese can be in peak summer hours)
Meanwehile sittin on a Havasu Falls type of deal in their back yard.
If I had property there, I'd sure have reservations about letting the unwashed have access to such a pristine place. (And I consider myself a people person)
If I did, I would keep the price UP, supply of permits LOW, limit days & hours.
Pay a private security guy a decent wage to ensure entrance fees are paid, trash picked up etc.
Or do it yourself.
If I did, I would keep the price UP, supply of permits LOW, limit days & hours.
Pay a private security guy a decent wage to ensure entrance fees are paid, trash picked up etc.
Or do it yourself.
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