I'm in the preliminary research phase of looking at getting a lab puppy, and figured this would be a good place to get some guidance.

First and foremost I want a good pet. But I'd also like someone who'd make a good hunting companion, primarily for ducks. I am inexperienced when it comes to duck hunting, just pond hopped a few times and never with a dog. BUT, I've got two places with great duck potential and would like to get more into it. I have extensive background in training English Pointers and English Setters for quail hunting, so I figure that with a little research training a lab to retrieve shouldn't be too tall a task.

Any advice is appreciated - what to look for, where to look for it. I'm at a point in my life where I've got pretty good time and flexibility to bring a puppy into my life. Hoping for a good house pet first of all who can also join me on little hunting excursions and explore the world of duck hunting together.

Health guarantee a must. Look at health pedigree of parents, grandparents etc. If they come from a hunting family with some trial designations is something you want. Or at least hunting family. Typically good health and working background will help you get a good dog. Though not always

What oscar said, but to be more specific....

Alot of dogs "hunt".... i wouldnt chose a dog with a hunting only background from a complete stranger unless they can prove in the immediate family tree a dog passed hunt tests....

Also just remember that even in every hunting pedigree there are outliers. A lot is genetics but in my mind a lot is also training and consistency. Waterfowl dogs are a lot of work but they are also a ton of fun. It adds a whole new demonsion to the sport and is really fulfilling.

Mine didn't come from a hunting pedigree. I was partly lucky but put in a lot of training. She didn't know which way was up at first. Now, if I run a set to the plug and miss my dog looks at me with total shame.

Mtn_Guide said:

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Also just remember that even in every hunting pedigree there are outliers. A lot is genetics but in my mind a lot is also training and consistency. Waterfowl dogs are a lot of work but they are also a ton of fun. It adds a whole new demonsion to the sport and is really fulfilling.

Mine didn't come from a hunting pedigree. I was partly lucky but put in a lot of training. She didn't know which way was up at first. Now, if I run a set to the plug and miss my dog looks at me with total shame.

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Good, it's not just me. My lab will track dove in the sky and when I miss she wines and gives me a look that makes me feel like a piece of ***** Thanks Maggie!

I am starting on my third lab - all trained for Ducks but we also did a ton of upland. Here are my thoughts/experiences that influenced what I was looking for in a new pup. These are just my preferences etc., which I am sure some on here will disagree with, so take however you please.

Good hunting dog & good house pet - rare to get both qualities in a lab. To be a super good hunter they really need that hyper drive in the field, which doesn't translate well to the house. Decide which trait is more important and accept the limitation of the other.

Male vs Female - I think females tend to be more chill and mature (chill out) quicker than males. Some think females are easyer to train, but I have seen some damn stubborn ones. Some think Males have more drive etc. (macho thing I guess) but the best dogs I have ever hunted behind were girls.

Size - Again maybe a macho thing, but a lot of my buddies insist on big dogs - 80 - 90+ pounds. Some think they need size for long retrieves or handling big ducks and geese. I have hunted with smaller labs that had no trouble gathering all the snows we could drop. I also think smaller dogs are more "light footed"/more agile, and have more stamina and handle hot weather a little better.

My first 2 labs were big (90+), one female one male - both great dogs. This time around I chose to go small female - hopefully closer to 60 pounds.

Also - Labs don't have to be strictly waterfowl - they can do well on upland birds too. Some of my hunting buddies are big quail and pheasant hunters, so my dogs got a lot of time in the field too. My first female was spectacular hunting quail - she was chill enough to stay quiet & close to me and let the pointers do their work. My favorite hunting experiences have been watching 2 pointers work a field, one lock up on a covey and the other honor and move in behind, release the pointers to flush and cut loose - all the while with my lab waiting at my side marking birds. The pointers take off after the strays we miss while my lab retrieves everyone's birds. Big time Pheasant hunters also use a lot of labs. Guys I hunt with in South Dakota exclusively use little 50ish pound labs - trained to work close and get after wounded running birds fast.

As others have said - knowing something about a pups pedigree helps the odds of getting a good hunter (but still not a guarantee). I got lucky with my first dog which was from purebred parents, but little info on hunting pedigree - second dog was her son. This time I went with a pup that had great pedigree of hunt trials, master hunters etc. for several generations with all the health certs. We will see how she does.

Again - just my 2 cents based on my limited experiences. Hope it gives some things to consider. Welcome to the world of labs, or as my wife would say "bless your heart"......

It's a good idea. Get the dog.

rsmithtesiusa said:

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My first 2 labs were big (90+), one female one male - both great dogs. This time around I chose to go small female - hopefully closer to 60 pounds.

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Take this advice too. OP, you probably already know this from your pointers. Big dogs eat a lot and take up a lot of space. Being big doesn't add anything either.

V8Aggie said:

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Mtn_Guide said:

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Now, if I run a set to the plug and miss my dog looks at me with total shame.

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Good, it's not just me. My lab will track dove in the sky and when I miss she wines and gives me a look that makes me feel like a piece of ***** Thanks Maggie!

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In retrospect, this is where commas save lives. If I run it to the plug and miss my dog, she should be looking at me with more than shame.


and yeah, I feel like a POS too.

If you are talking about buying a puppy from a breeder, find a pedigree with hunt test titles on both sides, and health clearances throughout. Hips, elbows, eyes, CNM, EIC. AKC papers mean nothing about the health of the breeding. A responsible breeder will put a lot of thought into the dam and sire, working to breed in or out certain traits for the betterment of the breed, and producing healthy, biddable pups with drive and desire. It's a lot more than just throwing two purebred dogs in a yard and watching them bump uglies. A good breeder will also put a ton of work into raising those pups, using things like early neuro stim, introduction to all kinds of weird objects, scents, sounds etc that will be a part of their every day life. You will pay a premium for a pup like this. I'm sure you know this from your upland dogs, but the puppy price is just a drop int the bucket over the life of the dog. The rest of it is up to you and what you mold the dog into. Don't buy Wolter's Water Dog book. Check out Bill Hillmann's Training a Retriever Puppy, then use a good pro like Best Retrievers, Watermark, Hidden Lake, etc. Or DIY following something like Lardy's TRT program.

Good hunting dog & good house pet - rare to get both qualities in a lab. To be a super good hunter they really need that hyper drive in the field, which doesn't translate well to the house. Decide which trait is more important and accept the limitation of the other.

Pay attention to the above paragraph.
I've had 3 labs for pets and duck/goose hunting. First one I bought as a puppy from a guy who said his parents were good hunters. I got a copy of Water Dog and he never was very well trained but was a great house pet and he liked to retrieve. Sometimes he would stop and start eating the birds ont he way back and I never could make him steady without a leash. We hunted a lot.

My second lab I bought as a "wash out" from a pro trainer at 1 yr old. He got a Sr Hunter title at 18 months. 5 passes in a row. Was a great pet and fine hunter. But he was not a hard charging ball of energy necessary to really be a champion. Thats why the pro let me have him. My 3 daughters used to lay on him while watching TV. These dogs are available if you look.

So when my second one died at 14 I searched around and bought a puppy who had field trial champions on both sides and plenty of champions going way back. I had pro help force fetching him but trained him myself to the same level as my Sr Hunter. He makes jaw dropping retrieves and will never give up. Most people have never seen a dog like this. Now 8 yrs old. He lives in the house with us but is definitely not a real pet. I would never trust him in the house with a small child.

Ikanizer said:

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Good hunting dog & good house pet - rare to get both qualities in a lab. To be a super good hunter they really need that hyper drive in the field, which doesn't translate well to the house. Decide which trait is more important and accept the limitation of the other.

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You can teach a hot dog a good off switch. My 4 year old's sire is an FC AFC MH FDHF, dam is a HRCH MH and they live in the house. My boy is an excellent companion and is like a cat inside, as long as he gets daily attention. OP is likely looking for something to take to about the senior level that will make him proud hunting and be a great companion as well. Being honest with the breeder about your goals and expectations will help with picking the right litter for that.

No need to pile on to the advice offered in this thread, except I'll throw my hat into the small lab camp. Have a 65 lb chocolate male and I think that's the perfect size for ability to handle elements, etc, while still being small enough to handle. I didn't get him through a breeder though so guess I got lucky. Great pet / hunting dog. He's a chocolate so he's a neurotic moron at times, but he's my neurotic moron and doesn't have an ounce of quit in him!

The MINIMUMS I would look for in a puppy

* mother has at least a SH (AKC) or HRCH (HRC) title
* sire has at least a MH or HRCH title
* OFA on hips for both sire & dam


It's been a while - if I was starting my search, I would go as Rody Best.
https://www.bestretrievers.com/

The hunting has been covered. I'll chime in on the health aspect.

Make sure the sire and dam are OFA good or excellent for hips AND elbows. Ask to see the certificates. Don't feed ad lib (free choice) or anything raw or grain free. Pick a commercial large breed puppy diet and feed in rations based on age and weight and directions on the bag. If you are going to neuter, wait until 9months or so. No earlier than 6. And of course, when you get her bump this thread with pics. Lab puppies are the absolute best.

Thank you all so much for your feedback! It seems I've got a lot more research and considerations upcoming (which I look forward to).

I'm definitely hearing conflicting advice (what else can you expect on such a subject and such a format!) when it comes to whether I should really look for good hunting bloodlines or if that is going to inhibit my main goal of finding a good pet. I imagine there's truth to both sides. I figure with any animal there are important decisions you have to make but ultimately a great deal of the outcome will be determined by 1) Luck and 2) Training.

Again, thank you all so much for taking the time to give me advice.

I just finished reading your long post on a thread from a couple years ago regarding silver labs when I saw that you had commented on this thread.

I mainly just wanted to say that I really enjoyed reading that post as it pertained to the expectations, responsibilities, and lives of DVMs. I work for a financial planning/insurance agency that works almost exclusively with veterinarians, so needless to say you guys are a very special group to me and it was nice to see some of those truths aired (since people don't realize or stop to consider what y'all deal with on a day to day basis). I have quite a few friends in vet school and recently out, and they are almost universally nervous about adequately servicing their clients in general practice after just four years of education. And we know how taxing the profession is in so many ways once everyone is out of school.

Anyway, I guess I just wanted to say a "thank you" to another veterinarian. I try to do it every chance I get. I almost considered replying to that post (hopefully you know the one I'm referring to) but didn't want to bump that old thread. But then when I saw you had commented on mine I figured I'd reply here (after private messaging was not working for some reason).

Reach out to mike Hudman with black water creek retrievers. Hes in east Texas and He's got good dogs. I have a 5 year old I got from him and she's a hunting fool.

You're welcome! Always glad to help.

Quote:

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when you get him bump this thread with pics

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FIFY

Rollie (Registered as G. Rollie Yellow) at 7 Weeks:

First Night at home (8 Weeks):

Getting used to his blind:

After his first time in the water:

Sleeping in my office:


And a couple short videos:

Rollie's first exposure to water

A short retrieve through distractions

Labs make the best hunting dogs!

FIREDISC Cookers said:

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Labs make the best hunting dogs!

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TheOC16 said:

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Quote:

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when you get him bump this thread with pics

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FIFY

Rollie (Registered as G. Rollie Yellow) at 7 Weeks:

First Night at home (8 Weeks):

Getting used to his blind:

After his first time in the water:

Sleeping in my office:


And a couple short videos:

Rollie's first exposure to water

A short retrieve through distractions

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Awesome dog and awesome vids

Do you have any breeders in mind? Big thumbs up for Wildrose if you need a recommendation.

Oruc Reis said:

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Do you have any breeders in mind? Big thumbs up for Wildrose if you need a recommendation.

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I talked to many different breeders - probably close to 30 for just preliminary info, talked seriously to 4, visited 2. Finally settled on a litter from LL Gun Dogs in Crockett.

Is yours also fond of chewing on shoes, wood, plastic, steel and everything else? Besides doing great on plain water retrieves, she's really good at finding my kids shoes that they leave out and bringing them to me in my office throughout the day. I have quite the collection by the end of the day.