lazuras_dc said:

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Am I reading correctly, draw applications open march1 for Co? http://cpw.state.co.us/buyapply/pages/hunting.aspx

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Sounds right, deadline is usually (always?) mid-April

NRD09 said:

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lazuras_dc said:

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Am I reading correctly, draw applications open march1 for Co? http://cpw.state.co.us/buyapply/pages/hunting.aspx

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Sounds right, deadline is usually (always?) mid-April

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April 3, 2018

We went up to Trapper's Lake the day after I tagged out. We didn't go out very far cause there was 18" of snow on the ground and a storm blew in just after we got there. So were you hunting in that burn? How far back was your horse ride?

Not real far, maybe 3-4 miles (I was at Starr Lake), but it was more to climb that "cliff" to the southwest of the lake. We actually got pulled because there was a big storm predicted on the last day, and they weren't sure they could get us down if we waited. We already had a decent snow on the 25th. As sketchy as the trail was coming up, we didn't argue (in fact, we damn near volunteered to walk down). When the wrangled got there, first thing they said was "the trail is real Shi---, I think we will walk down the first 1/4-1/2 mile". Funny they should say that. They warned us from the get go to be prepared for a major weather shift, and if they called it it was time to go.

ah good call, I'm always scrambling to get my stuff in at the beginning of April, because I always think it's not due until mid-April

Colorado deadline is always the first Tuesday in April.

If anyone here is planning a true DIY OTC hunt this year, and needs someone to go with, feel free to PM me. The best way I can think of learning would be to go on the first hunt with someone who knows what they are doing.

That's probably going to be me this year. I'll shoot you a PM.

Sounds good.

AgLA06, send me some details, I may be interested, if anything- learning the lay of the land and being a pack mule to get ready for a 2019 hunt. lazurasdc at yahoo dot com

Also Elk101 university is a good resource worth looking at. $99 is a cheap investment for a lifetime of knowledge.

http://www.elk101.com/onlinecourse/

What is that code for a free month? I searched, but nothing like that came up.

Promo code " randy " $50 credit for gear.

So I just found out this week that were expecting kiddo #2 September 30. The Mrs. Is saying all the right things, but it doesn't look like I'm going to be able to go this year now.

AgLA06 said:

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So I just found out this week that were expecting kiddo #2 September 30. The Mrs. Is saying all the right things, but it doesn't look like I'm going to be able to go this year now.

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There will be plenty of time to hunt, Congrats!!

cc_ag92 said:

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AgLA06 said:

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So I just found out this week that were expecting kiddo #2 September 30. The Mrs. Is saying all the right things, but it doesn't look like I'm going to be able to go this year now.

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There will be plenty of time to hunt, Congrats!!

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Thanks. I know.

With it just being one week a year, it's not the same as missing opening weekend of whitetail and getting to go later. Waiting all year for one week in the mountains is really hard already. Skipping a year sucks. Even if it's for the right reasons.

My dad was elk hunting when my mom went into labor.

If I may, I'd like to switch the conversation to clothing and gear. More specifically, budget clothing and gear.

The first few questions I have...

What makes Sitka, Kuiu, First Lite, and similar so different that makes them so expensive? Is there an Ozark Trail alternative to their Yeti offerings?

Sounds like the recommendations are for merino or synthetics. I've got base layers, mid layers, and some insulation. I don't have wet gear and I don't have pants. Any recommendations?

Is there any specific camo pattern to stay away from? From what I see, the offerings run the gamut from dark to light. There's even a few guys that say just stick with any earth tones and you'll be fine. Most everything I'm finding on clearance is in the Realtree Xtra pattern.

If I wanted a backpack, where should I start looking? There's a ton of "regular" backpacking packs on Amazon that are sub-$100. I realize that hunting-specific packs will like come accessorized with hunting-related items, like gun or bow holders.

I try to be pretty budget conscious. The tags and other expenses are enough as it is on these trips and I only have so much "domestic capital" at home anyways.

Most of this I picked up last offseason before my antelope hunt, with the idea that I knew I would be chasing elk in 2018 and wanted to pickup pieces I could use for both.

I went with BlackOvis for my merino layers. They are a pretty good deal normally at $45 but I picked them up on camofire for $35 each.


King's Camo is another decent budget brand. This soft shell vest popped up on Sierra Trading post for $40 and picked it up.

The name brand jackets are some of the highest dollar items they try to suck out of you. I researched the material they used and found this tactical soft shell jacket by Condor. Had some brutal wind in Wyoming this year that it knocked down well and proved to be water resistant in some windy drizzle. If you don't care about camo it's a good option. I wanted it more as a shell so went with the light weight uninsulated version. Picked up up on Amazon for $80. Only problem is if I wear it in public people start thanking me for my service and I wasn't in the military.


A lot of my buds are in Kuiu, FirstLite and Sitka however I have found no direct correlation between having those brands and success rates thus far

I've gone through this process, and have done everything from going super cheap to falling victim to my lack of willpower and bought expensive gear. What you pay a lot of money for in my experience really is: (1) Quality; (2) Weight; (3) Wind/Water protection; (4) Camo. ...also are usually paying more for wool/synthetic in an effort to avoid cotton. No matter what Centerpole90 might tell you, Cotton is the devil (for active hunting at least).

The best mountain "kits" are multi-layer. Because climbing mountains is terrible, hot, sweaty work. ...but sitting on a mountain top is strong, cold winds blowing up your skirt. Frozen mornings and sun-lit afternoons. It is not a 1-size fits all.

You can find quality gear in a lot of places. But most of those places don't have camo. And that's fine. It's especially fine in base/mid-layers. I still laugh at camo base layers. I cannot imagine a scenario where I'll ever need my underwear to be camo. If I'm down to my undies I already have different issues. You see Prana, or even Eddie Bauer pants recommended. They'll have brown, olive, slate gray. All work just fine and I wear them regularly at home and on the mountain. Same goes for puffy vests or puffy jackets. I wear them as a mid-layer, rarely an outer layer. So who cares if it's black or green, or even yellow (although I generally stay away from blue/yellow)? Winter clearance sale and you can pick up puffy vests/jackets for $30-50 that would run you $100-150 in camo. ...same goes for the merino base layers. Find them on clearance, who cares about colors. Black Ovis through camofire is about as good a deal as you can find, but occasionally you get quality buys on Sierra Trading Post or similar type websites.

Pants: You aren't subject to some of the limitations that I am in this department... Prana makes a good pant. I have a lot of Eddie Bauer active pants. You can find good deals on camofire if you want to go the camo route. I think SKRE and SYLO are two that are very good. Camo on camofire is going to be roughly the same price as solid colors elsewhere. Solid colors elsewhere will be ~60-75% the cost of camo. Thigh zips can be very nice features (my SKRE pants have thigh zips) to help you vent when you're climbing. Most brand names have good quality zippers, good pocket locations, etc. Most hunting brands will have a early season/lightweight, mid-season/mid-weight, and late season-heavyweight. I can't imagine hunting in the mountains in heavyweight pants. I think you'd die trying to climb.

Me in the Mountains:
- merino base layers (leggings and 1/4 zip tops - won't have a top that isn't zipped)
- Lightweight pants and 1/4 zip shirt - camo
- midweight/puffy: fleece or down - don't care about the color
- Wind-breaking layer. I generally use a good quality camo rain gear for this, but a jacket like the Sitka Jetstream is amaze-balls. But $330... eeeesh.

You don't have to spend top dollar to get decent quality (edit...like sean said, on under layers). However, there are some exceptions, most notably footwear (boots & socks) and rain gear. You definitely get what you pay for with those.

Good knowledge of wind and thermals is far more likely to make or break a hunt than your clothing. Likewise, your ability to act/be stealthy will be far more important to your success than how stealthy you may think you look. I tend to believe camo is a lot like fishing lures, where often times (not always) they're made to appeal to the hunter as much as they're made for their marketed purpose. That said, a big open pattern tends to help prevent the silhouetting you're likely to experience out West. Your typical realtree/mossy oak patterns can make you look like a big dark blob.

I also tend to think a good, lightweight technical fabric is far more important than what's printed on it because comfort is king on Western hunts due to all the mileage. Unfortunately however, I don't know of any real budget brands doing good work in this area. I prefer merino wool for everything that touches my skin.

My personal favorite for pants is the First Lite Corrugate Guide pant, but this can be such a personal decision based on your build and budget. My advice is that if you're going to spend several grand on a hunt, cutting corners on good clothing will likely ruin your experience. Weight is another factor you deal with when using the budget brands. Out West, ounces equal pounds, and pounds equal pain.

Remember...there is no such thing as bad weather, there's only bad gear.

I killed two bulls in solids this year.

But I also have a pile of fusion camo. I think color is overrated, but the functionality of the expensive stuff may not be. But I'm sure dudes every year get it done in jeans and a tshirt.

shaynew1 said:

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I killed two bulls in solids this year.

But I also have a pile of fusion camo. I think color is overrated, but the functionality of the expensive stuff may not be. But I'm sure dudes every year get it done in jeans and a tshirt.

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Generally agree, but the type of hunting also matters to your choices. Are you rifle hunting or bow hunting? Are you hunting with a guide or on a DIY trip? Are you hunting in a stand or humping it over ridges? Are you packing in your gear for a 10-day backcountry hunt, or getting dropped or just day hunting? Are you hunting public land or do you have access to private? You just can't look at gear in a vacuum and say X works as good as Y,

I have become a first lite fan and have been buying more than I probably should with a baby due in June.
The best thing I have bought from them is the uncompagre puffy jacket. That thing is freaking awesome. Light weight, packs into a pocket and you really don't even feel the wind. And they have them on sale right now.

stdeb11 said:

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I finally gave in to First lite/merino wool craze this year and can say it's definitely worth it for base layers. Sign up for camo fire and pick up deals on the black ovis merino stuff if you're on a budget. Earth tones work plenty well.

Some camo tends to "blob" at a distance, but if you're on a budget I'd much rather have nicer gear than camo specific stuff so if you can get deals on quality clothing via REI, Sierra Trading post, etc i'd pick that over lesser quality camo gear.

Cabelas space rain pants and jacket works well and can catch them on sale.

On hunting packs, the main difference should be the frame/suspension. Designed to haul out a heavy load of meat vs 35lbs of backpacking gear. If you're on a budget, check out rokslide classifieds. Depending on your hunting style a stand alone daypack and then a frame at the truck might work, or you may want one that can do both. Boots, socks, and pack are the best places you can spend your money.

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I can't agree with this enough. If your hunting rifle season, you're mostly going to be orange anyway. If it's not freezing or wet during rifle season, I'll wear some of the Duluth 5 or 6 pocket fire hose work pants in grey and brown. They hold up well to the underbrush, but aren't too heavy.

My only additions would be Cabelas shirts and pants were what I found to be a good balance between cost and value. They have good quality stuff and all the varying thin to fleece / wool options. I also like their western hunting pattern. Go to the store to try on the various weights and to figure out a size. Watch weekly and they'll run it all on sale at least quarterly it seems.

Best thing I added last year was a down vest from Eddy Bower that was earth brown on one side and hunter orange on the other. Caught it on clearance for 60 or 70% off last summer. It was awesome and saved me wearing the extra hunter orange vest for rifle season.

I took my grandfather on his last elk hunt this last year and he needed a pack as we were way back in for a drop camp. I found him a nice Badlands pack on the Rokslide classifieds for less than $100. It will probably be my new pack moving forward.

The Costco / Walmart trekking poles for like $35 are awesome. I'll never hunt the back country without them again. A quick google search will show you which ones from the various back country hunting sites.

My dad purchased a nice spotting scope and tripod for my first year and I've never got to use it. None of the public land in Colorado I've hunted have had the terrain to be able to use it. I probably won't even pack it moving forward. They won't be stationary out in the open during daylight during rifle season anyway.

So, where I'm at right now on clothing:

Base Layers: I've got all three options that Academy sells under their Magellan brand. Basically lightweight, midweight, and heavyweight. They're all polyester and spandex. I will keep an eye out for merino stuff on sale. Are there different weights or is it just merino or bust?

Mid Layer: Core4Element Selway 1/4 Zip Top. Still searching for pants.

Insulation Layer: Cabela's Insulator Jacket.

Outer Layer: I don't have anything here yet. Looking at wind and water proof.

Accessories: I've got a Core4Element Selway beanie and cap. Will probably look for a neck gaiter or I've got a Seirus balaclava from Academy that I really like.

I need socks and new boots.


And on Gear:

I've got a Magellan 0*F mummy bag that weighs about 3-4 pounds.


ETA: I'm a DIY guy. I'm also pretty cheap so I don't expect that I'll pay an outfitter for something that I can do myself. It will very likely be a public land hunt anywhere I can get a tag and feel comfortable going. I don't have too many friends that are interested in this, so it could end up being just me or, eventually my son and me. I'm not looking at this just being a one time thing. It's something I'd like to start doing regularly. Kind of a lifestyle thing.

Anyone have experience with froggtoggs for a waterproof outer layer? Saw a camo outer layer one at Walmart for cheap...

For me I was planning on wool base and mid layers I already have. The corrugated guide pant and umcompagre puffy jacket from first lite.

If I threw the frogg togs on that would that be water proof enough with the guide pant ?

Others may have different luck with them, but I've found they rip very easily.

Of course there is cheaper gear out there that works.

When you are working your ass off and the elements are coming down with fury, you will be comfortable in Sitka. Cheap stuff not so much. I have owned good and cheap cammo. The Sitka stuff is not needed for most people, but the ones who do, it is a godsend.

Are you sitting in a tree stand or climbing a peak under rain and snow?

Most important elements are boots, a merino base layer, and good rain gear.

Sitka Mountain pants and a merino shirt are perfect for an early season hunt with out spending to much. Use a down jacket you already own for insulation and a outer shell if needed. You can use cheap rain gear if you trust it. Hard to beat gortex.

Sitka is a hard pill to swallow with the retail markup. With a guide discount and it's not so bad. I wouldn't own so much if I didn't have one.

7-10 day hunt, comfort is everything. To me comfort is worth its weight in gold. You can stay out longer and hunt harder.

I will admit though I am a gear snob.
My Gear:
Boots: Scarpa Kinesis
First Light Merino Base
Pants/ Jacket - Sitka 90%
Vest - Sitka Jetstream
Insulation- Arcteryx Atom or Kuiu Super Down
Rain Gear - Kuiu Yukon

lazuras_dc said:

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Anyone have experience with froggtoggs for a waterproof outer layer? Saw a camo outer layer one at Walmart for cheap...

For me I was planning on wool base and mid layers I already have. The corrugated guide pant and umcompagre puffy jacket from first lite.

If I threw the frogg togs on that would that be water proof enough with the guide pant ?

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Probably....They tend to lack the durability, breathability and quiet of the higher end stuff. But in a pinch they can save you

I've sat in my tree stand with frog togs and been ok. If I had a base camp to come back to and could get warm I probably would be ok with them. If i was bivy hunting or running a spike camp, I would want a little more.

A packable puffy is awesome. I love my uncompaghre puffy from first lite. But a few years ago I bought a $30ish packable down vest off Amazon. Packs down to less than half a Nalgene bottle size and weighs almost nothing. Always carry it and when it's needed, there's nothing better.

Also the minus33 merino neck gaiter is my favorite cheap piece of gear. Like adding another layer. That plus the thin merino beanie from black ovis. Combined makes a sort of balaclava, but can wear my ball cap over it so I can still use the hat bill to steady binoculars

I'll certainly test the bag before I go. I've used it in the teens without much issue. The only real problem I have with it is that it takes a while for it to fluff up enough to be warm. Often times it sleeps cold the first night and plenty warm thereafter.

I figure that I'll slowly replace some of the budget gear with better gear, if I need to. It's just a little difficult to tell the Mrs. that I'm buying a couple thousand dollars worth of clothes and gear all at once. Like the hunting itself, it'll all be a learning process. Try something one year, try something a little different the next. I'll make a few mistakes. Just have to make sure I don't make a deadly one.