https://www.google.com/amp/www.breitbart.com/big-government/2017/03/24/north-dakota-the-2nd-amendment-is-your-concealed-carry-permit/amp/

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On Thursday Governor Doug Burgum (R) signed legislation allowing North Dakota residents to carry a handgun concealed for self-defense without a permit.

The legislationHouse Bill 1169passed the House on February 21 by a vote of 83-9. It passed the Senate on March 21 by a vote of 34-13.

USNews reports that the permitless carry law allows law-abiding citizens 18 and over to carry a concealed handgun for self-defense as long as they "have a valid ID and notify law enforcement of the weapon during instances such as a traffic stop."

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How quickly will this end badly?

powerbelly51 said:

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It already works in these states:

Alaska, Arizona, Idaho, Kansas, Maine, Mississippi, Missouri, New Hampshire, Vermont, West Virginia and Wyoming

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Those states still require you to be over 21. This allows kids that are still in high school to carry a concealed weapon with no permit or training.

When did CC become a constitutional right?

IslandAg76 said:

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Not to hijack but I never fully comprehended the thought process that allows an 18 year old to be treated as an adult under the law, vote, command a machine gun in battle, throw hand grenades, ..., BUT...after the 3 day battle you can't have a beer because we are protecting you and others.

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Probably because the drinking age was lowered in the 70s, 18-21 year olds couldn't handle it, so it went back to 21.

OP, do you own guns? If so, favorite brand? Go-to handgun caliber?

Don't know how accurate this is, but note that in NH and AK, concealed carry is allowed at age 16.

Also note that Maryland has an offical age of 18 for CC, but in reality, almost no one gets a CC permit. And those that are issued are usually work related. If you get a permit because your job is handling money, you have to store the pistol when you get off work.




http://dustinsgunblog.blogspot.com/2009/10/map-of-minimum-age-to-conceal-carry.html

powerbelly51 said:

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03_Aggie said:

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When did CC become a constitutional right?

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December 15, 1791

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Took me a bit, but yes, you are more accurate with this date....the date that the Bill of Rights (1st 10 Amendments) was ratified.

I would assume that since different states have varying requirements/laws around concealed carry that is has not been been interpreted as a constitutional right under the second amendment.

A quick google search indicates that a federal appeals court out of San Francisco ruled in 2016 that CC is not covered by the 2nd amendment. So it seems the applicability of the 2nd amendment to CC is still an ongoing issue.

redass1876 said:

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03_Aggie said:

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When did CC become a constitutional right?

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It is the right to bear arms, not the right to own them and keep them locked up at home unless your state allows and issues you a special license

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If you want to get really, really technical - the intent from the founders and writers of the Constitution was that the Constitution was specific to Federal rules and limitations. At the time (and up until the Civil War, for that matter), the USA was a confederation of independent states that had a central government to cover a very specific set of items - outside of those items, each state was autonomous from one another and the federal government. Prior to the Civil War the term was "These United States".

Post Civil War things changed considerably. The United States was coined. Seems trivial, but there is a lot of difference between the two terms. That's also about the time that courts started applying federal regs to the states, including the Contitutional guarantees being viewed beyond just federal government guarantees.

Most of the founders were in favor of strong states rights and independence between individual states. Most fully expected each state to adopt individual state religions, languages, etc. because, frankly, the Constitution does not forbid it if one were to actually read the wording in the document itself. The application of the BoR to individuals is a relatively modern view.

As far as firearms - Texas has the restrictions due to the drafting of the post Civil War reconstruction State Constitution - that was one of the punishments levied by the feds on the rebelling states.

Well you know what they say about assuming.

IBombedTheMoon said:

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OP, do you own guns? If so, favorite brand? Go-to handgun caliber?

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Many. Favorite brand of handgun? Sig Sauer, though Walther fits my hand better as a small female. my go to is a 9mm, but my husband like the .45 better. I carry a 9mm compact that fits nicely in my purse.

I completely recognize the location and leanings associated with it. In all fairness it appears to have been the same court that initially ruled in favor of it which triggered the appeal.

schmellba99 said:

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redass1876 said:

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03_Aggie said:

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When did CC become a constitutional right?

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It is the right to bear arms, not the right to own them and keep them locked up at home unless your state allows and issues you a special license

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If you want to get really, really technical - the intent from the founders and writers of the Constitution was that the Constitution was specific to Federal rules and limitations. At the time (and up until the Civil War, for that matter), the USA was a confederation of independent states that had a central government to cover a very specific set of items - outside of those items, each state was autonomous from one another and the federal government. Prior to the Civil War the term was "These United States".

Post Civil War things changed considerably. The United States was coined. Seems trivial, but there is a lot of difference between the two terms. That's also about the time that courts started applying federal regs to the states, including the Contitutional guarantees being viewed beyond just federal government guarantees.

Most of the founders were in favor of strong states rights and independence between individual states. Most fully expected each state to adopt individual state religions, languages, etc. because, frankly, the Constitution does not forbid it if one were to actually read the wording in the document itself. The application of the BoR to individuals is a relatively modern view.

As far as firearms - Texas has the restrictions due to the drafting of the post Civil War reconstruction State Constitution - that was one of the punishments levied by the feds on the rebelling states.

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The 10th amendment defines rights and limitations specified in the Constitution to be federally regulated rights and limitations. The states are not supposed to further regulate those

Those not specifically defined in the Constitution are supposed to be held by the states.

Now this is a completely ignored Amendment, sadly, but that is the intent of it.

This an an excerpt from the syllabus on the D.C. V Heller ruling which appears to have confirmed

Quote:

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Held:

" 1. The Second Amendment protects an individual right to possess a firearm unconnected with service in a militia, and to use that arm for traditionally lawful purposes, such as self-defense within the home. Pp. 253."

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Quote:

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2. Like most rights, the Second Amendment right is not unlimited. It is not a right to keep and carry any weapon whatsoever in any manner whatsoever and for whatever purpose: For example, con- cealed weapons prohibitions have been upheld under the Amendment or state analogues. The Court's opinion should not be taken to cast doubt on longstanding prohibitions on the possession of firearms by felons and the mentally ill, or laws forbidding the carrying of fire- arms in sensitive places such as schools and government buildings, or laws imposing conditions and qualifications on the commercial sale of arms. Miller's holding that the sorts of weapons protected are those "in common use at the time" finds support in the historical tradition of prohibiting the carrying of dangerous and unusual weapons. Pp. 5456.

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