I have a question about black baldy cattle. Now this is purely for curiosity's sake because I like to learn things. The way I understand it the black baldy is a mix of a Hereford and a black angus. My question is what are the benefits of the Baldy over either of the other two?

Black baldies fall under the "Certified Angus Beef" marketing so that have some increased value from that standpoint.

A hereford/angus combo gets you the docility and fertility of herefords with the marbling and marketability of angus.

hybrid vigor

More than one way to make baldies if you're strictly talking about color pattern, benefits are dependent on what you mix to make it happen in regards to yield/quality of meat, baldies usually do well at market based on appearance, early maturing easy fattening cattle will be your end result of going a angus/Hereford mix, there's more but off the top of my head, there you go

The cross is usually made to gain the benefits of heterosis (hybrid vigor), in which a hybrid exceeds either parental line for certain measurable traits. As stated by 96ags, the hybrids are black which qualifies them as 'Angus beef.'

I was thinking it might have had something to do with meat yield from the Angus and temperament from the Hereford. But it is more likely it is for speed of maturation and ease of weight gain?

In addition to whats been said already Herefords are usually considered "better mothers" than other breeds so their calves are usually more healthy, get bigger faster, and have less birthing problems. Or so Ive been told.

The Noble Foundation is always a good resource.
http://www.noble.org/Ag/Livestock/crossbreeding-advantages/

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Black baldies fall under the "Certified Angus Beef" marketing so that have some increased value from that standpoint.

A hereford/angus combo gets you the docility and fertility of herefords with the marbling and marketability of angus.

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Any breed or mixture that is black hided falls into the "Certified" category.

That's what Hesby told us, right before telling the story of drinking some dude's spit cup. No idea why I remember that connection.

Keep in mind that "Certified" and "Registered" are two separate things.

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My question is what are the benefits of the Baldy over either of the other two?

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Black cattle historically bring a higher price at the sale barn. A pure angus steer is more valuable than pure hereford steer. So make the hereford black and you get a better premium. As mentioned you gain the benefits of both breeds combined, low birth weight, good mothering/milking and better carcass.

We are actually working on breeding our own "black baldies" but using Angus Plus bulls that have a little brahman to with the South Texas Climate

Hesby was by far one of my favorite profs. He always knew how to keep the class interesting. The funniest class was when he decided to bring a ram into class and "collect" him using the electrode. He asked for several volunteers, one of which was a girl, who volunteered to hold the collection cup. The guys holding the ram weren't holding on very tight....so lets just say the girl got up close and personal with the rams "specimen".

Skeet....why not just go with black Beefmasters?

Number 1 is there are no true registered black Beefmasters. I know there are some out there running around but they are really not legal.
Number 2 would be that Beefmasters do no grade or yield as well as the Angus Hereford mix.
Number 3 why would you want to, unless you just want to have cattle to maintain your AG Exemption and don't have to make a living with them!!

What is the best way to achieve the Hereford/Brangus mix. Is it best to put a Hereford bull on Brangus cows or the other way around. Growing up dad had a Hereford bull on Brangus cows for the most part. Our neighbor in Live Oak county does the same as well.

SD
Not trying to be a horses butt, but you need to check your facts on 1,2 and 3!

There are legal registered Beefmaster cattle with some being homozygous black.

Beefmaster cattle can and do out hot yeild many other breeds especially English cattle.

There are several reasons people choose the breed they do. But just one reason many choose Beefmaster cattle is because of their great disposition and the longevity associated with Beefmaster cows.

H squared

We will just have to agree to disagree Ozzy01.
I know that after lawsuits, lot of money to lawyers and a good ole boy network you DO have registered Beefmasters. If you call a chicken a duck it does not make him one.
Sure there have been some "tests" that show great grading and yield, ask buyers, feedlot people and packing house buyers what their opinion is.
I won't argue this last point with you, just name me a couple of successful cattle people and see if Beefmaster is their claim to fame. I am not talking about people with money, I am talking about people who make their living off of cows. I can really only think of one in deep South Texas and they actually made most of their money off of gas wells. They have made a decent stab at making it with Beefmasters. (but also not their only breed of cattle)

Beefmasters are great, if you've got the time...

fishag04, I think you will want to do an Ankole-Watusi bull on a Scottish Highland cow. Just my two cents.

I agree with SD_71. After working in and being a Cattle Manager at a feed yard for a while, we were not high on beefmaster cattle, I would reject them whenever I was able to. Being 50% Brahman and 25% shorthorn did not do much for us when they were graded out. They would also not finish out where we were wanting our cattle do be at when it came time to ship.

You guys may want to look up the name Lykes brothers.

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What is the best way to achieve the Hereford/Brangus mix. Is it best to put a Hereford bull on Brangus cows or the other way around. Growing up dad had a Hereford bull on Brangus cows for the most part. Our neighbor in Live Oak county does the same as well.

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Simple, easy answer: Angus bull on hereford cow. Hereford bulls aren't known for their calving ease. Angus bulls are.

May have better maternal traits the other way, but a dead calf has no traits whatsoever.

And here ford bulls on brangus is black modely-face, baldie assumes full white face and hereford/Angus cross.

Will expound later.

Have nothing to add, did look up since it was mentioned.

"Lykes Bros. Inc. cattle operation is located in south central Florida, west of Lake Okeechobee. We have been raising cattle since the early 1900's and are now a cow-calf operation that ranks as one of the top five largest in the U.S. Top quality Brangus bulls are used as the sires for our maternal herd of Brangus and Beefmaster cows. High EPD Charolais and Angus-cross bulls are used as our terminal cross sires."

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What is the best way to achieve the Hereford/Brangus mix. Is it best to put a Hereford bull on Brangus cows or the other way around. Growing up dad had a Hereford bull on Brangus cows for the most part. Our neighbor in Live Oak county does the same as well.

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Simple, easy answer: Angus bull on hereford cow. Hereford bulls aren't known for their calving ease. Angus bulls are.

May have better maternal traits the other way, but a dead calf has no traits whatsoever.

And here ford bulls on brangus is black modely-face, baldie assumes full white face and hereford/Angus cross.

Will expound later.

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Thinking back I can only think of one time we had a Hereford bull. Stepped away from the business when in college during after my dad passed away in '04. Would love to get back in at some point.

I was thinking more along the lines of the heat/insect resistance the Brahma brought to the Brangus line would be more important in your momma cows than anything else.

Had a go with hereford bulls on brangus cows a while back - long enough to go through the entire lifespan of the replacement heifers kept. Large, commercial brangus cows were better able to birth, although I can't remember I'd any calves were lost. Steers were pretty exceptional, albeit with hereford heads. We sold through the auction barn back in those days, so no carcass data.

Heifers were generally fancy (brangus cows had more leather back then, too) and matured well... can't remember if they bred at any rate greater than brangus replacements, don't think so. They were good looking cows.

They did not last as long as their straight bred brangus counterparts. They had "hereford eyes" - as a result several got cancer eye (NEVER an issue with brangus, at least for us). As they got older, they developed calving issues and lost calves. We have good river bottom country that is easy on cows, so we keep animals a long time.

If you want something with some hereford, my advice is get some f1 brafords, especially if you need heat tolerance. Cross with Angus bull = modely face calves that can qualify for CAB.

Interesting thread. I could say a lot, but don't care to type an essay on phone. Suffice to say that an ideal mama cow and feedlot steer will not be the same "breed". Beef masters (themselves a cross breed) make excellent brood cows, but their male siblings don't do well in the feedlot, nor grade out near as high as Angus X steers. That's why Lykes Bros prefer to breed their cows to Angus etc.

Also, I remember well when Angus calves were penalized at auction (back in 50's-'70's) Research turned that around and created a bias in favor of them. In the '80's, every breed (except poor Herefords) wanted black genes! It was comical.
That said, there is often more variation within breeds of cattle than between them.

Ozzy01,
Lykes Bros. if you will read more you will find that ships are where they made their money. They also had at the time the largest feedlot in South Texas outside the little town of Edroy (about 30 miles N of Corpus Christi).
The largest majority of the cattle that came out of that feedyard were lucky to grade Good (yeah it was that long ago) It is no longer there.
BG again showed his sage knowledge with the difference within breeds being a big challenge as well.
Another thing I have found through my 60+ years is if you have cheap bulls you will sell cheap calves!!
Good discussion, thanks to all!!

Nothing to add other than I remember the smell of that Edroy feedlot well. Lived about 5 miles as a crow flies from there and smell carries well in that windy part of Texas.

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Nothing to add other than I remember the smell of that Edroy feedlot well. Lived about 5 miles as a crow flies from there and smell carries well in that windy part of Texas.

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Is the feedlot in Edroy no longer open?

I was checking cows yesterday, and came across calf #6 for 2016:

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Mama had left it there like they do, but whenever I find a newborn by itself I always check to make sure mama is taking care of it. I drove by it a few times and then she appeared.

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My herd was originally a registered Polled Hereford herd. After four Brangus bulls and one Angus Bull, (keep some heifers...sell or trade the bull) most of my herd are Black Baldies, and a few are all black. I have one red one/ white face but she is getting very old.

MARKETABILITY is the best answer on this thread. I remember when Dr. Gary Smith in meats class told us of the marbling study in the 1970's and Angus BARELY beat out Hereford, which beat out all the rest. This manifested itself into the marketing levels you see today of CAB, etc. My point is that the meat has very little difference that can be attributed to the breed, but the perception of value makes all the difference. And the buyers at the auction only have seconds to make a decision, so being black helps sometimes.

Also, my grandfather was a huge Polled Hereford rancher in the early to mid 1900's. He NEVER pulled a calf and never had calving problems. This is not attributed to the breed, it is in the individual genetics for birth weight and body conformation. My grandpa did not keep bulls with too large shoulder/head size compared to the body. These days we are a lot smarter about looking at genetics of the individual sire for calving ease.

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Number 1 is there are no true registered black Beefmasters. I know there are some out there running around but they are really not legal.
Number 2 would be that Beefmasters do no grade or yield as well as the Angus Hereford mix.
Number 3 why would you want to, unless you just want to have cattle to maintain your AG Exemption and don't have to make a living with them!!

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I am with you on the black Beefmaster...

Not sure how they get away with calling them a purebred Beefmaster if they are black. There is no black in the 3 breeds that make up that breed.

I have no problems with a % Beefmaster but please call it what it is.

Don't get me started on the integrity of the Beefmaster pedigree...
But the answer to the color issue is simply isolating recessive genes, then selecting for it/them. How the genes "got there" to begin with is the problem every species deals with in trying to maintain breed integrity. In the end, it's simply a matter of personal preference. Different strokes...

Thank You! I have kin in the Beefmaster business and they were on the losing side of this battle. Big money ruled and I think they put some type of stop on it, but the barn door was already open.
Beefmasters are ok if that is what you want and like, they just do not fit into my program.
I really like getting the little slips from the auction barn that my calf was the highest sell in it's weight class or range. The feeders like my steers and the heifers go private treaty to producers who want good cows.
Makes me feel pretty good, and I too learned a lot from Dr. Smith and I did a lot of work for Dr. Cross when he was a grad student and I worked in the meat lab with "Scooter" and "JR". Fun days!!