Im currently a freshman at lonestar and i plan on transferring to A&M next year in the fall, and im trying to transfer into the agriculture and life sciences to do agribusiness. I have decided that I want to become a land man, or at least am seriously considering it. Since im only a freshman i feel it would be better to look into any opportunity or ways to become a landman now, that way i can plan it out. since i plan on transferring to A&M next year, i was wondering is there any classes i can take for a job like this, or any better majors or programs at A&M that i can do to better my chances of being hired out of college or even while in college. im ready to get my foot in the door, and start looking for anyway possible to get some work experience in this career.


Any advice and/or personal stories would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

Make really good grades and go to law school.

I am going to try hard to think that this post is not a troll after today.

Why do you want to be a landman? Why not try to get in business school if you want to be one? Agriculture does absolutely nothing to help you get a job as a landman. If you want to go in house one day, you better be considering law school or do PLM at tech or OU.

Ive got nothing to add but I honestly had no idea that a landman was something kids wanted to grow up and be.

I thought it was one of those, "well out of the options before me, this seems like the best" kind of things.

quote:

---

Ive got nothing to add but I honestly had no idea that a landman was something kids wanted to grow up and be.

I thought it was one of those, "well out of the options before me, this seems like the best" kind of things.

---

Agree with this post. That said, if you have a working brain you can progress into the deal making side of things. If that is what you're thinking, I would say business or geology would be the way to go. Also, law school would not be necessary in my opinion. Even top of market In-House positions don't pay enough to justify that amount debt, given that you can get there a number of other ways.

A lot of our (large independent) in-house new hires seem to come from OU with Tech and UH filling a lot of the land admin new hires. I don't think our land department actively recruits at A&M, but could be wrong. It is a tough time to be a land man right now as most of the contract folks have been laid off, but in 3-4 years it could be very different. If you really want to be a land man and don't want to do law school you'd better research schools that have a Petroleum Land Management degree (or something similar) since they might be better choice than A&M.

What he said.

If you know what you want to do when you graduate it would be foolish to go to a school that 1)doesn't have a program for that field and 2) isn't a school that companies recruit from to fill entry spots in that field.

Has A&M taken any steps to develop a PLM program? It seems like we should have one.

Start with taking an English and/or writing class.

Some of these guys have zero idea what you can make in house, but I have a law degree and that has helped enormously (although some non lawyer landman are automatically biased against you). If I was aiming for this position and did not want to go to law school, I would try to get in OU. You would have to be a sooner for the rest of your life, but they have the best PLM by far.

You need to seriously consider that being a Landman is very cyclical.
Right now I know A LOT of very experienced Landmen that are out of work and or taking other jobs to pay the bills. The vast majority of Landmen are praying for another Boom that isn't likely to happen anytime soon. I even heard one say, quite stupidly, that we "need a war to start", to drive the price of oil back up.

You spend a lot of time on the road, living out of a suitcase in remote oil field towns. Many of them drink...A LOT and eat out way too much and are typically over weight. Just being honest here.

Yes, you do make good money but I have never, not ever, even once heard a prediction about
how long a specific project would last that was actually true.

As was stated above, get good grades and go to Law School. Learn how to run some title but I would not get too attached to the idea of being a Landman 10+ years from now. Most of the real oil field counties are online now and quite a few jobs are actually going to India. I am of the opinion that in 20 years, running title won't even exist as we know it. Technology will change it.

Sorry to be negative, but I would tell you this to your face as well.

Saw's advice is spot on for field landmen. In house won't be exported to India anytime soon, but you are highly unlikely to land an in house gig without a law or PLM degree. Even with law it can be difficult at some reasonably large operators. Zero chance you get one with an agribusiness degree from A&M unless you have serious connections or work in the field and kick ass.

Mega Dittos to SAWg.

Detective Kimball, don't be discouraged by all the advice, but do listen to it. As many more counties and states start placing records online, pretty soon major operators and developers will employ computer algorithms and will find a way to run title for us, rendering us obsolete to the business. DrillingInfo is already making rumblings of this with DI Courthouse. Don't get me wrong, someone will still have to negotiate leases, cure title and hunt down John Doe, but maybe it will give the in-house guys something to do rather than stare at ARC all day...(i'm just messing with you future boss)

Take it from me as someone who got cut recently, this is not the business to make a career of unless you are ok with regular amounts of forced vacation, with no pay. The guys who are always working or have the edge, are the ones who are exceptionally good at the job and retain a lot of title law. They are the ones who are not easily disposable in this line of work.

Title Attorneys, Geologist, Financial Analyst are just a few of the careers that would be better to focus on.
There certainly are others but I would shoot a little higher than a career as a Landman. Trust me, I will tell my sons the same thing when they get older.

I'm skeptical that the running of title is something that will become automated in the near future. Outsourced to India, perhaps, but you could pretty much do that now by supplying a run sheet and given the currently existing level of online access to the instruments. And the results would be substandard even to the product delivered by same day hires on crews for big "land service" outfits at $105 oil.

Any amount of time in the business will reveal that a PLM and/or a Law degree may be great credentials (and HR loooooves credentials) but neither confer actual competence.

You have time. Find out if you even like screwing with this stuff. Use your summers to try and intern for an independent landman/broker somewhere and learn to develop a Mineral and Leasehold takeoff that adds up to 1 like they are supposed to. You'd be shocked at how many PLM majors still cannot do this.

There are upsides to being a company landman, but can stability really be counted among them? And if you like to be chained to a bunch of fetishists for meetings then being a major company Landman is for you. Independents usually work an area and will move from courthouse to courthouse depending on the job. They are not stuck in an office day after day. Online access will change this somewhat, but what it boils down to is, well, independence.

And even though it is less stable than a gig as a company landman, there is still a good living to be had being an independent. If you get on with a good broker (usually defined as one who holds on to his clients at any oil price...and probably one who knew not to jack his rates to $800 day for his crews when he had the companies over a barrel three years ago) you can get pretty steady work and probably learn more about the fundamentals of the business faster than a PLM or a job as a company man will deliver it to you. You won't be dragging down engineer money, but look at it as continuing ed with a positive cash flow. Ultimately, learn to put together deals and acreage and you can do very well.

Most of all, try and get into a position where you can see if you even like it and decide after that.

quote:

---

Any amount of time in the business will reveal that a PLM and/or a Law degree may be great credentials (and HR loooooves credentials) but neither confer actual competence

---

this is true with just about any industry...

quote:

---

quote:

---

Any amount of time in the business will reveal that a PLM and/or a Law degree may be great credentials (and HR loooooves credentials) but neither confer actual competence

---

this is true with just about any industry...

---

True, I don't mean to crap on the PLM or Law degrees...it is just that credentials are credentials and are aside and apart from knowledge or competence.

Sheila Jackson Lee has a Law degree from...wait for it....Yale.

DO NOT GO TO LAW SCHOOL IF YOU WANT TO BE A LANDMAN...Most ridiculous thing I've seen posted on here in a long, long time.

You'd be better off financially/professionally going to a school with a PLM program but if you bleed maroon then do business and start interning with oil and gas companies (they love hiring new landmen fresh out of college). If you want to better your chances you could pick up your plm certificate at UH during the summer.

Feel free to shoot me a pm and I can give you some personal experience regarding this exact situation.

quote:

---

quote:

---

quote:

---

Any amount of time in the business will reveal that a PLM and/or a Law degree may be great credentials (and HR loooooves credentials) but neither confer actual competence

---

this is true with just about any industry...

---

True, I don't mean to crap on the PLM or Law degrees...it is just that credentials are credentials and are aside and apart from knowledge or competence.

Sheila Jackson Lee has a Law degree from...wait for it....Yale.

---

I'm a big believer in competence over credentials. Unfortunately that's not the way our world works. It might be once you can establish competence, but getting the start is the biggest hurdle in that case.

Just need one person to believe in you and give you a shot, then it's all on your shoulders.

quote:

---

I'm skeptical that the running of title is something that will become automated in the near future. Outsourced to India, perhaps, but you could pretty much do that now by supplying a run sheet and given the currently existing level of online access to the instruments. And the results would be substandard even to the product delivered by same day hires on crews for big "land service" outfits at $105 oil.

Any amount of time in the business will reveal that a PLM and/or a Law degree may be great credentials (and HR loooooves credentials) but neither confer actual competence.

You have time. Find out if you even like screwing with this stuff. Use your summers to try and intern for an independent landman/broker somewhere and learn to develop a Mineral and Leasehold takeoff that adds up to 1 like they are supposed to. You'd be shocked at how many PLM majors still cannot do this.

There are upsides to being a company landman, but can stability really be counted among them? And if you like to be chained to a bunch of fetishists for meetings then being a major company Landman is for you. Independents usually work an area and will move from courthouse to courthouse depending on the job. They are not stuck in an office day after day. Online access will change this somewhat, but what it boils down to is, well, independence.

And even though it is less stable than a gig as a company landman, there is still a good living to be had being an independent. If you get on with a good broker (usually defined as one who holds on to his clients at any oil price...and probably one who knew not to jack his rates to $800 day for his crews when he had the companies over a barrel three years ago) you can get pretty steady work and probably learn more about the fundamentals of the business faster than a PLM or a job as a company man will deliver it to you. You won't be dragging down engineer money, but look at it as continuing ed with a positive cash flow. Ultimately, learn to put together deals and acreage and you can do very well.

Most of all, try and get into a position where you can see if you even like it and decide after that.

---

This is a remarkably good post.

If your degree is in agribusiness, you need a law degree to have any real shot. You could get lucky, bust your ass and make it. However, more and more companies are going to business, Plm or law only. guessing the guys saying law school is the stupidest thing they've ever heard are content in the field, which is fine.

Many land men who did not do one of those are stuck in the field. There are some great field guys and a lot of terrible ones. The great ones usually end up starting their own shop which is how you really make money in the field (outside of doing things like overcharging mileage, which is common).

There is a big movement among in house land men to attempt to kill the notion that there are no qualifications necessary for the job. This is caused by the huge number of field guys and some in house guys that have literally no idea what they are doing. Credentials don't guarantee success, but they definitely can help filter out some people who would be in way over their head.

There are a lot more field land spots than in house, usually field is contract and in house is full time. Most replies you get here are field because Texas a&m is not well represented in house (no law school, no PLM). So take the field-is-heaven with a grain of salt. You do get much more freedom in the field though! and you probably make more initially than the PLM guys (no idea what a field guys benefits look like).

those are 2 good comments.

A law degree helps in more ways than one. If you're goal is to just be a land man, then you can get there multiple ways. However, a law degree opens up a lot of options for future advancement through an organization that you simply cannot get without it.

I don't know how that was perceived as "dumb"... But options and versatility are things you need in the oilfield. Especially when the commodity price tanks.

Field Landmen and Company Landmen are two different but symbiotic jobs. They guys in the field are usually contractors, too. You need to get in with a good, reputable broker. Companies don't call individual Landmen a lot. They call the guys who can put multiple other guys in the field on short notice.

Oh, and do this: Download the home version (it's cheap) of ARCGIS 10.3 and learn to use it. It is a valuable skill to have in the land business and it translates to a ton of other industries as well.

TXDOT is hiring project managers. It is probably the easiest route into land acquisition.

They pay crappy but have an amazing retirement. Once you have a few years as a PM for TxDOT make the decision either to go career (20 years) or go private early. Career at TxDOT is a nice career path and after 20 years, when the pension is fully vested, you retire and go private.

Or you can take your experience running projects for txdot private after a few years and get on with an acquisition company doing ROW or pipeline at a good salary. Run up to a Project manager or somesuch making nice money. From there you can go solo (landman) or just make your nice income for the next 35 years.

Landman is not the greatest job out there. They make good money when times are good but are never home and they are the first ones cut when the market shifts. It is a rather cutthroat business.

I started as a field landman the week I graduated a&m in 2011. Managed to stay with the same broker and client through three projects until I was finally cut in May. The field lanman gig is/was an awesome job for a single person right out of college...whole lot of freedom and good money. The constant uncertainty will wear you out though and things can change in a second. One day the client gives permission to hire 15 new contractors and the next week they decide to lay off 30.

Assuming the market bounces back in the next few years I would enter the profession with extreme caution. Have a good plan B option if things get rough and make sure you're good at saving money. Oh and make sure you marry someone that has good benefits and a steady income.

And if you have never been a contract employee before MAKE DAMNED SURE that you hold back enough money to make your estimated tax payments because they aren't withheld by your "employer".

I am certain that if everyone in the country actually had to write quarterly checks to the IRS instead of having it magically withheld from the paychecks there would be a total of seven Left of center officeholders in the whole damned country.

quote:

---

And if you have never been a contract employee before MAKE DAMNED SURE that you hold back enough money to make your estimated tax payments because they aren't withheld by your "employer".

I am certain that if everyone in the country actually had to write quarterly checks to the IRS instead of having it magically withheld from the paychecks there would be a total of seven Left of center officeholders in the whole damned country.

---

BOOM!!!!

I just got my JD and never really looked into being a landman until recently. Any suggestions for someone just starting out? I'll also send a PM.

quote:

---

I just got my JD and never really looked into being a landman until recently. Any suggestions for someone just starting out? I'll also send a PM.

---

A year as a Field Landman will pay less but would be great experience whether you end up as a company landman or a title attorney for a firm. You also need to consider if you really like being around lawyers all the time. I say that only half-jokingly because Law Firms in general have a certain...um...culture that may or may not be your cup of tea. If it isn't, life as a title attorney in a stable full of other attorneys may not be to your liking.

Credentials are important in getting your foot in the door. But now you have those with your JD.

Whichever way you head, realize this. You never leave "school". What has changed is you begin to set your own curriculum based on what provides the most actual utility to you and you can dispense with all of the stuff that education experts larded up your degree plan with to make you more "rounded".