It has been thoroughly discussed in other threads that many thousands of deserving applicants are annually passed over by Ivy+ colleges. What I haven't heard discussed much is where those kids wind up.

Lets say you have a white male who lettered in a varsity sport, has an SAT score in the mid 1500s as well as other honors and extracurriculars, but he can't demonstrate some all-consuming passion and predetermined life path (because he's 17) and doesn't fill a specialized niche. In other words, he is every bit as academically qualified as the kids who do get admitted to top colleges, but is without a life story that sparks the interest of a leftist admissions officer. We know the most selective schools will gleefully reject that kid without a second thought. Most highly selective colleges seem to be looking for (mostly nonwhite) kids who are already almost finished products and then just issue them a stamp of approval. Where do those rejected applicants go in 2024? What highly regarded colleges are looking to take bright, talented kids and actually help develop them and help them figure out what they want to be when they grow up?

State schools like tu, Texas A&M, etc.

My kid didn't apply to an Ivy, but applied to Vanderbilt and Notre Dame. Did not get into Vanderbilt and ended up at ND, which was first choice, even if accepted to Vanderbilt. If they did not make it into ND, probably would have been Alabama due to National Merit Scholarship. And without National Merit scholarship, likely would have been A&M.

Even though a kid may be disappointed if they are not accepted to their top choice, having A&M and/or tu (if you are in Texas) as a "safety" school is still a great situation to be in.

If a kid applies to enough of the Top 25 they have a decent shot at getting in one unless they don't strategize well at all. Applying ED helps a LOT at the ones outside the Top 10. Most who can't do ED go to Flagship publics but some will go to the next tier private schools in the 25-50 range. Really a lot depends as well on how much money matters.

Keep in mind that a lot of the flagship public schools have several programs to compete with the T20 schools and they successfully attract talented students from them every year. Each of these programs provide their own academic opportunities and most come with additional merit dollars. Within the last three years, I have successfully placed students into each one of these selective programs.

Texas A&M:

• E2EnMed Early Assurance Program (8 students/year)
• Brown Scholars (~50 students/year)
• Mays Business and Engineering Honors (~90 students/year)

University of Texas

• 40 Acres Scholars (15-20 students/year)
• Plan II (~200 students/year)
• Engineering Honors (~50 students/year)
• Canfield Business Honors (100 students/year)
• College of Science: Dean's Scholars, Health Science Scholars, and Polymathic Scholars (~50 students/year for each program)
• Liberal Arts Honors (~200 students/year)

When you submit scores to schools, can you submit only your best score, or does it automatically send all scores if you took the SAT/ACT more than once?

khkman22 said:

---

When you submit scores to schools, can you submit only your best score, or does it automatically send all scores if you took the SAT/ACT more than once?

---

you can select which scores to send

That's what I thought, but I was not involved when they were sent. I'm thinking the first score may have hurt the chances for Vanderbilt.

Rice. Don't forget Rice

BlueSmoke said:

---

Rice. Don't forget Rice

---

Rice is another one of those schools that predominantly admits students through Early Decision, and I expect that to only increase with their addition of ED II this year.

Rice is included in the Ivy+ group, along with schools like Vandy, Tulane, Duke, Northwestern, MIT, Caltech, U Chicago etc. They all accept less than 10% of their applicants.

My son was one of the kids you are talking about. 3.8 something raw GPA, multiple AP courses, varsity football, lots of community and even statewide leadership positions, a published independent research paper.
National Merit Finalist, single score perfect ACT.
Tragically Caucasian, raised upper middle class (not of the large donor class), with no sad story to tell.

Rejected by every Ivy he applied to and multiple near-Ivy schools. Waitlisted at a few near-Ivys.

He is attending University of Florida now, and has straight A's in his first semester with a 16 hour load right now. So far, so good, but not what he was aiming for. I suspect that in 3 years he will crush the LSAT, much as he did the PSAT and the ACT. We will see, at that time, if the next round is any different.

My daughter applied to William & Mary. Was number one in her high school class, clubs and all that, don't remember test scores, but was rejected.
Went to A&M, made one B in 4 years and that was a 89, earned two majors. Received full ride for her masters and PhD program at UT Dallas. Now a tenured college professor at UNT.

Buck Turgidson said:

---

Rice is included in the Ivy+ group, along with schools like Vandy, Tulane, Duke, Northwestern, MIT, Caltech, U Chicago etc. They all accept less than 10% of their applicants.

---

Those schools are not created equal and ED impacts them at very different levels. Tulane is probably the most extreme, if you apply ED the acceptance is 40% or so, Regular and it's definitely below 10%. At MIT though applying Early Action really doesn't give you much of a boost at all, same with Caltech. It really varies a lot depending on the school. Rice is another one that you drastically improve your chances ED and if you are RD you are probably under 5%.

my kid is not quite Ivy 'qualified' (has the test scores and extra curriculars but not the gpa). i echo much of the sentiment here. i think the vast majority of ivy/ivy+ are overrated. though i wish my kid could get a crack at MIT....

i think he'll end of choosing Bama (nms) or A&M with an outside shot of Carnegie Mellon.

Buck Turgidson said:

---

Where do those rejected applicants go in 2024?

---

Top state universities. Then get a second shot at IVY for Grad/Professional school.

Daughter UC Davis to Cornell Law.
Son, UCLA freshman.

With zero need based financial aid, I'm glad the kids ended up at state school.

do state schools in this area/more regional type private schools(SMU etc) give decent merit scholarships for this caliber of student without NMS?

phorizt said:

---

do state schools in this area/more regional type private schools(SMU etc) give decent merit scholarships for this caliber of student without NMS?

---

There are actually only a few schools that care about NMS, they just get a lot of pub over it. Among the Top 50 Schools fewer than 5 have scholarships for it and most are pretty small. A&M is really the only major school in Texas that cares about it. For elite schools it is only considered a modest level award on an application and certainly won't get you in to a Top 20 school without a strong resume and grades to go with it. Probably the best school that rewards NM is Vanderbilt that gives a modest scholarship for it but it's like having a small coupon code at Vandy which has become one of the most expensive schools in the country.

Tons of scholarship money at most schools without it, A&M is the only school I know of that makes it a prequalifier for significant awards except Tulsa.