Quote:
He seems to be silent these days.
Hubert J. Farnsworth said:flown-the-coop said:Hubert J. Farnsworth said:Quote:
You cannot pull the Nation back to the middle or over to the right by pulling from the barest thread at the end of a rope. You get more leverage pulling in the middle.
I strongly disagree. Centrist governing does nothing but pull things farther left.
Meh, that's recency bias. And it's not a default position.
Again, it's a weakness of trying to overly apply the "Overton window".
The democrats are embracing socialism and communism, but God forbid the republicans fill their ranks with actual right wing conservatives to fight back. Moderate republicans helped lead us to this point by compromising everything away over a number of years. The moderates have had their chance and failed.
infinity ag said:
I get the feeling that the Republicans will lose the midterms.
Trump needs to cater to his MAGA base and energize them. Not water down his agenda. Act quickly, he does not have a lot of time. He seems to be silent these days.
Im Gipper said:Quote:
He seems to be silent these days.
Say what??
flown-the-coop said:Hubert J. Farnsworth said:flown-the-coop said:Hubert J. Farnsworth said:Quote:
You cannot pull the Nation back to the middle or over to the right by pulling from the barest thread at the end of a rope. You get more leverage pulling in the middle.
I strongly disagree. Centrist governing does nothing but pull things farther left.
Meh, that's recency bias. And it's not a default position.
Again, it's a weakness of trying to overly apply the "Overton window".
The democrats are embracing socialism and communism, but God forbid the republicans fill their ranks with actual right wing conservatives to fight back. Moderate republicans helped lead us to this point by compromising everything away over a number of years. The moderates have had their chance and failed.
You really think 60 hard right candidates can win Senate races? That a hard right candidate can win a national election? That you will get 218 house congressional districts to reliably elect hard right wingers every two years?
The Tea Party had decent success 15 years ago and many of its conservative ideas remain part of MAGA / Trump. It also caused some rifts in the GOP that cost us later on until Trump arrived to coalesce around new leadership.
Also, you talking fiscal conservative, social conservative, Bible thumper or Presbyterian?
Moderates in the R party are not the issue. It's there lack of backbone when push comes to shove.
Quit electing ******* needs to be the mantra of the GOP.
flown-the-coop said:
And what have "true conservatives" like Randy and Massie achieved? Voting with Dems way more than any moderate.
Who was your last great "right" leader in your view? You are screaming very loudly at clouds.
And our system of government was designed to compromise! I assume that most people did not have a course in US government so they don't realize this. But in a democracy based system the will of the people, collectively, should be reflected in government policy. What is "common sense" to you is egregious oppression to someone else.
We also protect the rights of those in the minority. This is done via functions like the Senate and electoral college and by the rights outlined in the US Constitution and its amendments. All these things require compromise to function.
flown-the-coop said:
No they are not reasonable. Have not been for quite some time. And yes i would like to see the Rs be as cohesive as them. The cracks in that seem to be on the far right with Massie and Randy, nit with any moderate.
Danny Vermin said:
Maybe but you know how quick the news changes. I'm guessing he will put the full court press during the summer. JD already said they will be doing some rallies before the midterms. People lose focus way too fast these days.
Hubert J. Farnsworth said:flown-the-coop said:
No they are not reasonable. Have not been for quite some time. And yes i would like to see the Rs be as cohesive as them. The cracks in that seem to be on the far right with Massie and Randy, nit with any moderate.
Rand and Massie are strange. They seem more libertarian than conservative.
What do these people in the senate all have in common? McConnell, Murkowski, Collins, Cornyn, Lankford.
Tea Party said:
Thank you for finally admitting you want the R party to be a moderate party.
The "far right" as you call it like Massie and Paul etc are just normal conservatives with slight Libertarian leanings that don't want to go along with a moderate agenda when their party is in the majority.
flown-the-coop said:Hubert J. Farnsworth said:flown-the-coop said:
No they are not reasonable. Have not been for quite some time. And yes i would like to see the Rs be as cohesive as them. The cracks in that seem to be on the far right with Massie and Randy, nit with any moderate.
Rand and Massie are strange. They seem more libertarian than conservative.
What do these people in the senate all have in common? McConnell, Murkowski, Collins, Cornyn, Lankford.
RINOs.
What would you call a Ted Cruz?
flown-the-coop said:Tea Party said:
Thank you for finally admitting you want the R party to be a moderate party.
The "far right" as you call it like Massie and Paul etc are just normal conservatives with slight Libertarian leanings that don't want to go along with a moderate agenda when their party is in the majority.
Let me tell you a secret…
This is not your party. It's not mine either.
Massie and Paul are staunch libertarians with slight R leanings. And they are not leaders of the R party and there is a reason for that.
Your concept of a moderate platform and mine are likely to be very different. But that doesn't at all make your concept the "truer" version of the Republican Party. And your username points to you not aligning yourself as an R anyways.
Why are you so hell bent on mischaracterizing Massie and Randy as not libertarian ?
Hubert J. Farnsworth said:flown-the-coop said:Hubert J. Farnsworth said:flown-the-coop said:
No they are not reasonable. Have not been for quite some time. And yes i would like to see the Rs be as cohesive as them. The cracks in that seem to be on the far right with Massie and Randy, nit with any moderate.
Rand and Massie are strange. They seem more libertarian than conservative.
What do these people in the senate all have in common? McConnell, Murkowski, Collins, Cornyn, Lankford.
RINOs.
What would you call a Ted Cruz?
They are all moderates. Ted Cruz is a conservative who I think has started to lose his usefulness(I know I'll get bashed for that).
Tea Party said:flown-the-coop said:Tea Party said:
Thank you for finally admitting you want the R party to be a moderate party.
The "far right" as you call it like Massie and Paul etc are just normal conservatives with slight Libertarian leanings that don't want to go along with a moderate agenda when their party is in the majority.
Let me tell you a secret…
This is not your party. It's not mine either.
Massie and Paul are staunch libertarians with slight R leanings. And they are not leaders of the R party and there is a reason for that.
Your concept of a moderate platform and mine are likely to be very different. But that doesn't at all make your concept the "truer" version of the Republican Party. And your username points to you not aligning yourself as an R anyways.
Why are you so hell bent on mischaracterizing Massie and Randy as not libertarian ?
Take that up with the GOP that allows Massie and Rand to run as Republicans.
And they are more conservative than Libertarian. Why are you hell bent on mischaracterizing them as libertarian?
But I see based on your views of how R's are now a moderate party that we can't have agreement there since our definitions of R are inconsistent so it's a semantics impasse and this discussion is just going in circles.
flown-the-coop said:Hubert J. Farnsworth said:flown-the-coop said:Hubert J. Farnsworth said:flown-the-coop said:
No they are not reasonable. Have not been for quite some time. And yes i would like to see the Rs be as cohesive as them. The cracks in that seem to be on the far right with Massie and Randy, nit with any moderate.
Rand and Massie are strange. They seem more libertarian than conservative.
What do these people in the senate all have in common? McConnell, Murkowski, Collins, Cornyn, Lankford.
RINOs.
What would you call a Ted Cruz?
They are all moderates. Ted Cruz is a conservative who I think has started to lose his usefulness(I know I'll get bashed for that).
Moderates according to your personal perception or is there a chart we can reference of what makes them moderate?
flown-the-coop said:
So you are down to yelling at clouds. That's fine, some of those clouds can be annoying and deserve to be yelled at.
But it doesn't do a damn thing to stop the march of the Dems.
Hubert J. Farnsworth said:flown-the-coop said:
So you are down to yelling at clouds. That's fine, some of those clouds can be annoying and deserve to be yelled at.
But it doesn't do a damn thing to stop the march of the Dems.
You act like you want to stop the march of the dems, but when I point out that moderates in the republican party compromise and help that leftward march, you call it yelling at clouds.
Im Gipper said:
Can we stop the derail and stick to discussing the midterm elections?
flown-the-coop said:Hubert J. Farnsworth said:flown-the-coop said:
So you are down to yelling at clouds. That's fine, some of those clouds can be annoying and deserve to be yelled at.
But it doesn't do a damn thing to stop the march of the Dems.
You act like you want to stop the march of the dems, but when I point out that moderates in the republican party compromise and help that leftward march, you call it yelling at clouds.
Give it some thought and I think it will come to you.
Or read my numerous previous posts on this thread.
You want to pull the rope by the very end, when you have greater leverage on the middle. You want to mandate Overtons window nonsense but from a conservative standpoint. I think that's ineffective and a waste of time. But if that's your strategy, have at it.
Tea Party said:
Since you keep trolling us saying we are yelling at clouds when we are trying to discuss how to get the R party back to conservativise policy, can you give us your perfect plan for righting the R party ship?
And since you balk at any discussion regarding defining conservative and moderate, can you give your definitions of those? Just so us old men yelling at clouds can get an understanding of why you keep deflecting the discussion regarding getting the R party back to conservativism instead keep saying we need to be more moderate.
flown-the-coop said:Tea Party said:
Since you keep trolling us saying we are yelling at clouds when we are trying to discuss how to get the R party back to conservativise policy, can you give us your perfect plan for righting the R party ship?
And since you balk at any discussion regarding defining conservative and moderate, can you give your definitions of those? Just so us old men yelling at clouds can get an understanding of why you keep deflecting the discussion regarding getting the R party back to conservativism instead keep saying we need to be more moderate.
No, cause I don't respond to arrogance of such petty nature.
And why do I need to define it?
And I said you have to compromise. It's how our Country and its government work. Where did I say we need to moderate and join the Dems or adopt their policies as our own?
I think it's funny you try and deflect by simply accusing someone else as deflecting. But that is consistent with arrogant approach to discussing something you evidently are not comfortable me discussing.
flown-the-coop said:
So no compromise? Great.
Let's get NOTHING done so everything can fall apart and Dems can coast to victory.
Solid plan. Let's see how it works out for us.
Hubert J. Farnsworth said:flown-the-coop said:
So no compromise? Great.
Let's get NOTHING done so everything can fall apart and Dems can coast to victory.
Solid plan. Let's see how it works out for us.
That didn't answer my question. The democrats do not compromise and they have successfully pulled the country farther to the left to where socialists and communists are getting elected in places. Your solution is more republicans governing from the middle when that is what they have been doing for a long time and losing ground.
