Heineken-Ashi said:

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Some of you who think its no big deal forget about all the not big deals that we accepted and have been expanded and used for far more than their marketed purpose, like the Patriot Act.

I also don't think some of you realize whats actually going on here. It's no coincidence that states are lining up to get this done at the state level at the same time that governments around the world are deploying the same tactic.

Things like this lead to full blown digital ID to do ANYTHING in your life, and will also lead to social credit systems. Once all the state governments have them in place, the control mechanism is 99% complete. The federal government will then roll it out and you will accept it because "we already have it at the state level and nothing bad has happened yet".

Whatever government tells you to market something like this, think of the three worst case reasons they would actually want it and you will be over the target.

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Land of the free? We are past the point of being the product, now we are the prisoners and need supervision.

twelve12twelve said:

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Now it's time to bring usenet back. Those protocols are still open source and non controlled by a corp/gov.

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I still use Usenet. And IRC. :-)

HTownAg98 said:

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Who could have seen this coming? Oh, I don't know, just about everyone who brought this up when they passed the "ID for porn" bill.

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Bingo. But hey, we were all terrible people for bringing it up because no one wanted to listen about the privacy concerns and the rabbit hole it goes down......

Over_ed said:

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twelve12twelve said:

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Now it's time to bring usenet back. Those protocols are still open source and non controlled by a corp/gov.

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I still use Usenet. And IRC. :-)

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I bet you still have the IRC logs from the original Finn developers! I bet you even boot into a DOS environment and run 1.0!

samurai_science said:

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flown-the-coop said:

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ABATTBQ11 said:

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There's a huge difference between your digital footprint and handing over copies of government issued ID or other documents with 0 control over their security or destruction after use.

As an example, Texas DL's contain an audit number necessary for ordering a new ID online. The only places you'll find that audit number are with the state and on your ID. With a copy and the audit number though, someone can order a physical, state issued copy of your DL without you ever knowing. If someone were to steal a database of ID's, they could easily search for those that fit physical descriptions/pictures well enough to sell them to individuals who could use them. With AI it wouldn't even be hard to pick the closest facial match. If they can get access to your SSN, which isn't hard nowadays, they could easily start opening bank accounts or getting other government issued documents straight from government offices.

This is way more than, "You used your credit card so companies know what you like to order."

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Okay, so this is about making a physical copy or taking a pic of your ID and using it to order fraudulent IDs? Cause it didn't seem like that was the case here.

If Instacart delivers liquor to me, they take a pick of my ID. DoorDash scans the "barcode" on the back.

And someone could do all the things you lay out before this law.

Here is the thing. If what you want to access something that requires ID and you wish to remain anonymous, then you have a choice to make.

I really don't even see where this is gathering something most places do not already have.

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One is the gov forcing it and the other is companies. I don't have to do business with Door Dash ( I dont), or Instacart ( I dont).

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Or the liquor store. But if an ID is required by law then you oppose?

Can you not hit the sticky floor dvd store wearing a disguise and paying cash to get your rocks off?

twelve12twelve said:

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Make fun of China for years for having a social credit system, now shrugs when it happens state-side because of course marketing leeches have to get their cut too. Won't anyone think of the bottom line?

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A digital ID is NOT a social credit system. Many countries around the world have digital IDs. Only China has a social credit system. Good lord!

Not suggesting I support a digital ID, but it is, unfortunately, inevitable.

Ellis Wyatt said:

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Fake republicans.

Harrison has been warning everyone, but the liars keep proclaiming Harrison is the fraud. Wake up.

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I think Harrison is also a fraud, just not in this particular case. Learning of his involvement in puppy mill type businesses really soured my opinion of him.

Quote:

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Both Apple and Google admit it will require users to surrender personal details just to check the weather or to download an app.

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Why?

How?

Or are they just gaslighting us?

Anytime you hear "for the kids", it's not about the damn kids.

BTKAG97 said:

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Quote:

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Both Apple and Google admit it will require users to surrender personal details just to check the weather or to download an app.

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Why?

How?

Or are they just gaslighting us?

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Pretty sure when you download an app now Google and Apple know who you are.

Or maybe you have a burner email on a burner phone paid for with Visa cards you got through crypto and you then used more burner emails to sign up for a VPN and then you still need to make sure the burner phone ever even attempts to connect to yours or your neighbors or your cars Wi-Fi, then maybe you can put on latex gloves and spread a tarp down so you can enjoy 1.38 minutes of pornhub completely anonymously.

MD1993 said:

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The Republicans in Texas are doing their very best to drive people away from the party. To where, I have no idea, but I despise most of our TX (R) leadership and I have only been an R all my life.

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We need to become more like Florida's example. Its strange that we keep getting ones that insist on being partly Left in ideas.

dmart90 said:

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twelve12twelve said:

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Make fun of China for years for having a social credit system, now shrugs when it happens state-side because of course marketing leeches have to get their cut too. Won't anyone think of the bottom line?

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A digital ID is NOT a social credit system. Many countries around the world have digital IDs. Only China has a social credit system. Good lord!

Not suggesting I support a digital ID, but it is, unfortunately, inevitable.

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If you cannot see that it goes that way after the digital ID, I don't know what to tell you.

Quote:

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If you want to remain anonymous, move to a mountain cabin ted kazinsky style.

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how did that work out for Ted?

TexAg1987 said:

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Quote:

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If you want to remain anonymous, move to a mountain cabin ted kazinsky style.

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how did that work out for Ted?

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I cannot help that he got bored and wanted to mail stuff to people.

twelve12twelve said:

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Proposition Joe said:

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twelve12twelve said:

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Proposition Joe said:

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Unfortunately people don't really realize how much of their online lives are already fingerprinted. Your VPN isn't saving you.

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Sure just a VPN isn't saving you, but if you have a mutli-layered approach it will definitely keep you anonymized enough that feds would have to put in work to find you (but if they need to actively find you, you probably *usually* deserve it).

It's a lot of work but it is not impossible to still be essentially anonymous in 2025.

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You're not anonymous. It's just to what degree an effort is being made to track you.

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Sure I am. Tell me who I am right now. List my social security, all known emails, and breached passwords. Tell me what my public IP address is.

I am waiting.

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I have no reason to try and track you down.

But you have 55 posts on TexAgs and jumped right into Politics posting like a seasoned vet -- meaning you likely had another username prior to these 55 posts. It would take even remedial AI about 10 minutes to figure out your previous username, which based on your posts per day probably had thousands of posts -- many of which would have identifiers.

Anyone posting on public message forums is not anonymous - that digital footprint is about as big as they come.

Proposition Joe said:

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twelve12twelve said:

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Proposition Joe said:

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twelve12twelve said:

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Proposition Joe said:

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Unfortunately people don't really realize how much of their online lives are already fingerprinted. Your VPN isn't saving you.

---

Sure just a VPN isn't saving you, but if you have a mutli-layered approach it will definitely keep you anonymized enough that feds would have to put in work to find you (but if they need to actively find you, you probably *usually* deserve it).

It's a lot of work but it is not impossible to still be essentially anonymous in 2025.

---

You're not anonymous. It's just to what degree an effort is being made to track you.

---

Sure I am. Tell me who I am right now. List my social security, all known emails, and breached passwords. Tell me what my public IP address is.

I am waiting.

---

I have no reason to try and track you down.

But you have 55 posts on TexAgs and jumped right into Politics posting like a seasoned vet -- meaning you likely had another username prior to these 55 posts. It would take even remedial AI about 10 minutes to figure out your previous username, which based on your posts per day probably had thousands of posts -- many of which would have identifiers.

Anyone posting on public message forums is not anonymous - that digital footprint is about as big as they come.

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Bro thinks an LLM's hallucinations will accurately guess a poster based on inference data lmao

twelve12twelve said:

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Proposition Joe said:

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twelve12twelve said:

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Proposition Joe said:

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twelve12twelve said:

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Proposition Joe said:

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Unfortunately people don't really realize how much of their online lives are already fingerprinted. Your VPN isn't saving you.

---

Sure just a VPN isn't saving you, but if you have a mutli-layered approach it will definitely keep you anonymized enough that feds would have to put in work to find you (but if they need to actively find you, you probably *usually* deserve it).

It's a lot of work but it is not impossible to still be essentially anonymous in 2025.

---

You're not anonymous. It's just to what degree an effort is being made to track you.

---

Sure I am. Tell me who I am right now. List my social security, all known emails, and breached passwords. Tell me what my public IP address is.

I am waiting.

---

I have no reason to try and track you down.

But you have 55 posts on TexAgs and jumped right into Politics posting like a seasoned vet -- meaning you likely had another username prior to these 55 posts. It would take even remedial AI about 10 minutes to figure out your previous username, which based on your posts per day probably had thousands of posts -- many of which would have identifiers.

Anyone posting on public message forums is not anonymous - that digital footprint is about as big as they come.

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Bro thinks an LLM's hallucinations will accurately guess a poster based on inference data lmao

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Yes, I'm sure 100% of your posting style on this new username is completely unique compared to your last posting style.

It wouldn't even take a LLM - it would take a compsci undergrad about a morning's worth of work.

Thinking just because you created a new username that your old one could never be tied back to you is about on the level of papaw not understanding how his phone knows his location.

twelve12twelve said:

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Over_ed said:

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twelve12twelve said:

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Now it's time to bring usenet back. Those protocols are still open source and non controlled by a corp/gov.

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I still use Usenet. And IRC. :-)

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I bet you still have the IRC logs from the original Finn developers! I bet you even boot into a DOS environment and run 1.0!

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Wish I had seen this earlier. No. But only because my wife makes me get rid of my old stuff.

When I die, my clothes, computers and other stuff will be out on the curb the next day. She is sentimental, to our cats. She loves me, just not any of my stuff.

She will call Goodwill to pick it up.

Proposition Joe said:

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twelve12twelve said:

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Proposition Joe said:

---

twelve12twelve said:

---

Proposition Joe said:

---

twelve12twelve said:

---

Proposition Joe said:

---

Unfortunately people don't really realize how much of their online lives are already fingerprinted. Your VPN isn't saving you.

---

Sure just a VPN isn't saving you, but if you have a mutli-layered approach it will definitely keep you anonymized enough that feds would have to put in work to find you (but if they need to actively find you, you probably *usually* deserve it).

It's a lot of work but it is not impossible to still be essentially anonymous in 2025.

---

You're not anonymous. It's just to what degree an effort is being made to track you.

---

Sure I am. Tell me who I am right now. List my social security, all known emails, and breached passwords. Tell me what my public IP address is.

I am waiting.

---

I have no reason to try and track you down.

But you have 55 posts on TexAgs and jumped right into Politics posting like a seasoned vet -- meaning you likely had another username prior to these 55 posts. It would take even remedial AI about 10 minutes to figure out your previous username, which based on your posts per day probably had thousands of posts -- many of which would have identifiers.

Anyone posting on public message forums is not anonymous - that digital footprint is about as big as they come.

---

Bro thinks an LLM's hallucinations will accurately guess a poster based on inference data lmao

---

Yes, I'm sure 100% of your posting style on this new username is completely unique compared to your last posting style.

It wouldn't even take a LLM - it would take a compsci undergrad about a morning's worth of work.

Thinking just because you created a new username that your old one could never be tied back to you is about on the level of papaw not understanding how his phone knows his location.

---

I would bet that current LLM's don't allow users to try to dox people like that. I think that opens them up to lots of lawsuits.

So you have the old Clayton Williams mentality then. "If its going to happen, might as well sit back and enjoy it".

Awesome outlook. Nothing bad ever comes from just accepting whatever government wants to do.

Its about building the surveillance state. Owners of Oracle and Palantir are now the donor class taking over the Republican party.

Here is Larry Ellison laying it all out

The man behind the digital ID push is Larry Ellison, owner of Oracle, CBS, CNN, and, soon, TikTok. He wants data centralization and total surveillance. "Citizens will be on their best behavior because we're constantly watching & recording everything that's going on." Terrifying. https://t.co/mb05XvnOAx pic.twitter.com/cUx45ORy2F

— Michael Shellenberger (@shellenberger) September 27, 2025

schmellba99 said:

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So you have the old Clayton Williams mentality then. "If its going to happen, might as well sit back and enjoy it".

Awesome outlook. Nothing bad ever comes from just accepting whatever government wants to do.

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Not at all. I made no reference to enjoying it. But reality is that anonymity is nearly impossible, if not impossible to achieve.

Hell, your DNA is now spread everywhere in quantities that can be used to convict your 8th cousin thrice removed.

Now, we can have a wholly different discussion about inappropriate access of such data and using it for nefarious, abusive, overreach purposes.

So if we want to get cute with a Clayton Williams reference… you can do a lot to prevent rape by making the consequence of such horrid activity such that only the most sordid would attempt. Same should go for data breaches, identify theft, etc.

We good?

Is he watching Minority Report on loop?

I am glad Ellison is yipping about like this. It is useful to waking people up to the dangers of what is almost certainly coming.

And should give plenty of opportunity for the market to develop to counteract such intrusion.

Rather than worry about a central ID, be supporting ways to subvert it.

flown-the-coop said:

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ABATTBQ11 said:

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There's a huge difference between your digital footprint and handing over copies of government issued ID or other documents with 0 control over their security or destruction after use.

As an example, Texas DL's contain an audit number necessary for ordering a new ID online. The only places you'll find that audit number are with the state and on your ID. With a copy and the audit number though, someone can order a physical, state issued copy of your DL without you ever knowing. If someone were to steal a database of ID's, they could easily search for those that fit physical descriptions/pictures well enough to sell them to individuals who could use them. With AI it wouldn't even be hard to pick the closest facial match. If they can get access to your SSN, which isn't hard nowadays, they could easily start opening bank accounts or getting other government issued documents straight from government offices.

This is way more than, "You used your credit card so companies know what you like to order."

---

Okay, so this is about making a physical copy or taking a pic of your ID and using it to order fraudulent IDs? Cause it didn't seem like that was the case here.

If Instacart delivers liquor to me, they take a pick of my ID. DoorDash scans the "barcode" on the back.

And someone could do all the things you lay out before this law.

Here is the thing. If what you want to access something that requires ID and you wish to remain anonymous, then you have a choice to make.

I really don't even see where this is gathering something most places do not already have.

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You have the option of going to a store yourself to get alcohol or engage with companies who choose to ID check and verify at delivery. This is entirely different in scope and would be closer to providing a copy of your ID for every transaction you make.

And just because delivery companies do it for record keeping and CYA on age restricted items does not make it a good idea to force it on a wider scale and create infinitely more failure points and opportunities for abuse and mishandling.

Then go back to shopping at the store where the cameras are broke and you can only pay in cash.

Or open a business that provides the much needed anonymous transaction in.

And folks should be able to differentiate someone supporting such data gathering (I am against it) versus someone trying to advise you on the realities of how broad your digital footprint already is and that some of these things do indeed broaden it and people should oppose, but realize that in all likelihood these guys already have the info and are wanting to legitimize it so they can monetize it.

Just do not be blinded to what already exists.