Trump floats idea of US reclaiming Panama Canal: 'Foolishly gave it away'

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WolfCall
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9:03p, 12/21/24
AG
It's great having Trump as the de facto President. Never a dull moment as he advocates for America. See the latest below regarding high fees for vessels going through the Panama Canal. I didn't realize fees could go for up to six figures, as high as $500,000.00.

https://www.foxbusiness.com/politics/trump-floats-idea-u-s-reclaiming-panama-canal-decries-tolls-foolishly-gave-away
Quote:
Trump floats idea of US reclaiming Panama Canal: 'Foolishly gave it away'
Trump claimed US ships are being charged 'ridiculous' fees
By Andrea Margolis FOXBusiness

President-elect Trump unleashed a tirade against Panama Canal tolls Saturday, claiming the U.S. is being ripped off by high prices.


In a Truth Social post Saturday, Trump complained at length about the fees levied on U.S. ships going through the Big Ditch. The Panama Canal's tolls can range from three to six figures depending on how large a vessel is and how much cargo it carries, with the largest ships being charged as much as $500,000.

"The Panama Canal is considered a VITAL National Asset for the United States, due to its critical role to America's Economy and National Security," Trump wrote in his post. "A secure Panama Canal is crucial for U.S. Commerce, and rapid deployment of the Navy, from the Atlantic to the Pacific, and drastically cuts shipping times to U.S. ports."

The incoming president criticized former President Carter, who Trump said "foolishly gave it away, for One Dollar." In 1977, Carter signed the Panama Canal Treaty, which phased out U.S. control of the canal by 1999......

.....

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bmc13
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9:04p, 12/21/24
AG
 
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infinity ag
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9:05p, 12/21/24
Trump has a lot of low hanging fruit to pick. He should avoid talking and not getting things done. Let him first solve the issues he spoke about on the campaign. Then work on other stuff.
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annie88
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In reply to infinity ag • 9:06p, 12/21/24
AG
infinity ag said:
Trump has a lot of low hanging fruit to pick. He should avoid talking and not getting things done. Let him first solve the issues he spoke about on the campaign. Then work on other stuff.
He's actually a very good multitasker.
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Dan Scott
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9:10p, 12/21/24
AG
CIA coup in Panama in the next few years…
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Ag87H2O
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9:12p, 12/21/24
AG
He's not wrong. It was nuts to give it to Panama. At a minimum U.S. military vessels should have the right of free and priority passage in perpetuity, and American owned cargo vessels passage at a greatly reduced rate. We should have also demanded a permanent military base in close proximity to the canal.
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titan
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In reply to infinity ag • 9:13p, 12/21/24
S
infinity ag said:
Trump has a lot of low hanging fruit to pick. He should avoid talking and not getting things done. Let him first solve the issues he spoke about on the campaign. Then work on other stuff.
THIS.

Stop telling foes what contemplating and giving them time to do things before you are in power.

Can see a value now in reclaiming it in that it could become a de-facto wall against land migration from further south.

But just order it after in office. (If its that kind of thing have a choice in rather than Congressional)
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MemphisAg1
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9:14p, 12/21/24
AG
Sometimes his ideas fall flat or get passed off as loony, but more often than not he gets traction simply by daring to state them. So many politicians are incredibly timid and measured. Trump is unconstrained and speaks his mind without apology. I've seen this movie before, and I'm going to enjoy the second edition much more than the first. He's been proven right on so many issues that were initially regarded as laughable by the "mainstream," only to see time prove him right.
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Ghost of Andrew Eaton
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9:14p, 12/21/24
Maybe he can get Panama to pay us and then give us the Canal.

I voted for Trump, so don't come with the weak BS.
If you say you hate the state of politics in this nation and you don't get involved in it, you obviously don't hate the state of politics in this nation.
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WolfCall
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In reply to infinity ag • 9:16p, 12/21/24
AG
infinity ag said:
Trump has a lot of low hanging fruit to pick. He should avoid talking and not getting things done. Let him first solve the issues he spoke about on the campaign. Then work on other stuff.
Trump is putting every country (and group of countries) on notice who he feels are treating America unfairly. This goes for the big guys (China, EU, NATO, UN) and the little guys like Panama.

Trump's putting them on notice is a forerunner to future negotiations - gives them an opportunity to reconsider the way they have been doing business with America....

It has worked in the past.
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titan
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In reply to MemphisAg1 • 9:16p, 12/21/24
S

Agree with that. As said, its probably a great idea now -- as its a shortcut to walling off another caravan type moment from anything further south, which simplifies the problem north of the Canal barrier in turn. Basic stuff.
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WolfCall
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In reply to MemphisAg1 • 9:17p, 12/21/24
AG
MemphisAg1 said:
Sometimes his ideas fall flat or get passed off as loony, but more often than not he gets traction simply by daring to state them. So many politicians are incredibly timid and measured. Trump is unconstrained and speaks his mind without apology. I've seen this movie before, and I'm going to enjoy the second edition much more than the first. He's been proven right on so many issues that were initially regarded as laughable by the "mainstream," only to see time prove him right.
^ This!!!!

Regret I have only one star to give!
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Dan Scott
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9:18p, 12/21/24
AG
The canal helps save about 10 days. Vessel rates fluctuate depending on size and market but 30k/day is about average. So the Panama Canal authority knows this and vessel operators know this so that that's how the charge is derived.

What is going to be nuts going forward is LNG. Those vessels can be upwards of 100K/day and the U.S. LNG export is going to blow up in the next decade more than what it is now.
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agent-maroon
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9:19p, 12/21/24
AG
So what would "reclaiming" the canal look like, exactly? Overthrow the government like the previous poster suggested? Full on military takeover by force? Make them a Godfather style "offer they can't refuse"?

Not opposed to any/all of the above, just curious what the smart people are thinking.

Oh, and jimmah carter was a dumbass of the highest order...
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rocky the dog
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9:24p, 12/21/24
AG
Elections are when people find out what politicians stand for, and politicians find out what people will fall for.
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LOYAL AG
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9:36p, 12/21/24
AG
Good timing, Mr President. 35 years and one day ago me and 20k of my closest buddies arrived in Panama to oust Noriega. We actually landed early on the 20th.

Good times!
A fearful society is a compliant society. That's why Democrats and criminals prefer their victims to be unarmed. Gun Control is not about guns, it's about control.
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Hubert J. Farnsworth
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9:41p, 12/21/24
A democrat gave the Panama canal away. Just like democrats gave us the federal reserve, social security, the great society(welfare), and the affordable care act.
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TexasAggie73
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10:01p, 12/21/24
AG
One of his billionaire friends must own a shipping company.
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Ag with kids
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In reply to Ag87H2O • 10:06p, 12/21/24
AG
Ag87H2O said:
He's not wrong. It was nuts to give it to Panama. At a minimum U.S. military vessels should have the right of free and priority passage in perpetuity, and American owned cargo vessels passage at a greatly reduced rate. We should have also demanded a permanent military base in close proximity to the canal.
We actually BUILT it. WE spent the money to do it. Teddy Roosevelt made sure it happened.

Carter failed the US in many ways, but this was his biggest.

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Buck Turgidson
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In reply to TexasAggie73 • 10:06p, 12/21/24
TexasAggie73 said:
One of his billionaire friends must own a shipping company.
Those fees get added to our imports and cost us all money. The same fees make US exports more expensive, hurting US industries that rely on exports. Not good for Americans either way.
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aTmAg
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10:12p, 12/21/24
AG
There is funny Reagan story about this. Reagan and Buckley Jr. disagreed on this. Reagan wanted to keep it, and Buckley thought we should give it away. Well, the next time Buckley was in California and went to visit Reagan at his ranch, Reagan had constructed huge signs, each with one word that lead up the road to his house. They said:

We
Built
It.
We
Paid
For
It.
It's
OURS!
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TexasAggie73
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In reply to Buck Turgidson • 10:18p, 12/21/24
AG
Buck Turgidson said:
TexasAggie73 said:
One of his billionaire friends must own a shipping company.
Those fees get added to our imports and cost us all money. The same fees make US exports more expensive, hurting US industries that rely on exports. Not good for Americans either way.


There has always been a charge to transit the canal. It saves time and the cost is about the same a ship would cost going around the southern tip.
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infinity ag
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In reply to annie88 • 10:20p, 12/21/24
annie88 said:
infinity ag said:
Trump has a lot of low hanging fruit to pick. He should avoid talking and not getting things done. Let him first solve the issues he spoke about on the campaign. Then work on other stuff.
He's actually a very good multitasker.

Let's see. He's got another chance to prove himself. He's talked a lot and people gave him a chance. Now time to show some results.
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AgGrad99
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10:34p, 12/21/24
AG
Trump likes to flood the zone. I think it helps him get things done
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Ag with kids
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In reply to Ghost of Andrew Eaton • 10:35p, 12/21/24
AG
Ghost of Andrew Eaton said:
Maybe he can get Panama to pay us and then give us the Canal.

I voted for Trump, so don't come with the weak BS.
This.
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Sea Speed
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10:45p, 12/21/24
AG
I ****ing love this.
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Eliminatus
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10:46p, 12/21/24
AG
Empty rhetoric is empty. HOW would a reclaim even realistically take place? Carter et al. were colossally incompetent in literally giving away one of the most strategic positions on the entire globe and we expect Panama to reciprocate and give it back? Because there is zero leverage without full on economic warfare or actual violence.

It sounds nice but until any sort of halfway feasible plan emerges of it even reaching the realm of possibility, this is simply clickbait to me.

Also, never miss a chance to damn Carter and his admin. They screwed us so bad we are still walking funny all these years later. I don't care how bad relations were with Panama and his want to pivot to a "new" way of foreign policy after the disaster of Vietnam. What a dismal failure he and that Congress was.
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Sea Speed
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In reply to Ag87H2O • 10:48p, 12/21/24
AG
Ag87H2O said:
He's not wrong. It was nuts to give it to Panama. At a minimum U.S. military vessels should have the right of free and priority passage in perpetuity, and American owned cargo vessels passage at a greatly reduced rate. We should have also demanded a permanent military base in close proximity to the canal.


I went through on a USNS ship and the pilots were complete *****s and threatened to send us to anchor to languish because we wouldn't give them a room. This was at the height of covid when everyone was mask Nazis and concerned about breathing each other's air and all that other bull***** The USNS ships don't have pilot cabins right by the bridge like a lot of commercial vessels.

The US Embassy had to get involved because the pilot was throwing a temper tantrum and threatening our ship.
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4
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In reply to LOYAL AG • 12:31a, 12/22/24
AG
LOYAL AG said:
Good timing, Mr President. 35 years and one day ago me and 20k of my closest buddies arrived in Panama to oust Noriega. We actually landed early on the 20th.

Good times!

Damn, I'd like to buy you a beer or 20 and hear your stories
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AggieVictor10
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1:06a, 12/22/24
AG
HELL YEAH
hard times create strong men. Strong men create good times. good times create weak men. and weak men create hard times.

less virtue signaling, more vice signaling.

Birds aren’t real
Lol,lmao
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txags92
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In reply to agent-maroon • 1:24a, 12/22/24
AG
agent-maroon said:
So what would "reclaiming" the canal look like, exactly? Overthrow the government like the previous poster suggested? Full on military takeover by force? Make them a Godfather style "offer they can't refuse"?

Not opposed to any/all of the above, just curious what the smart people are thinking.

Oh, and jimmah carter was a dumbass of the highest order...
We already dismantled and decommissioned the nuclear reactor barge that used to power the canal facilities for us when we still owned it.
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Shoefly!
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In reply to Ag87H2O • 3:12a, 12/22/24
AG
Ag87H2O said:
He's not wrong. It was nuts to give it to Panama. At a minimum U.S. military vessels should have the right of free and priority passage in perpetuity, and American owned cargo vessels passage at a greatly reduced rate. We should have also demanded a permanent military base in close proximity to the canal.

$500k per ship is not a fee, it's plundering!
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bobbranco
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3:39a, 12/22/24
AG
Probably Trump pushing back on the Chinese.

Quote:
Currently, China controls two of Panama's five principal zone ports through Hong Kong-based Hutchison, with one on each side of the waterway at Balboa and Cristobal. Chinese companies are finishing work on the Amador Pacific Coast cruise terminal. These follow China-based Landbridge buying control of Margarita Island, Panama's largest port on the Atlantic side, for US$900M in 2016 and China Communications Construction's building of a deepwater port.

And according to US trade publication Engineering News-Record, a consortium of Chinese state-owned firms will soon restart construction of a fourth US$1.3Bn bridge across the Canal after at least five years of disputes.

https://www.rivieramm.com/news-content-hub/news-content-hub/us-and-china-clash-over-neutrality-of-drought-hit-panama-canal-79323
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BigRobSA
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6:53a, 12/22/24
But then we'd have to deal with all those Mexicans in Panama.





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nortex97
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7:04a, 12/22/24
AG
Jimmy Carter's two most enormous, glaring 'mistakes' in office (aka acts of absolute treason/idiocy) were giving away the Panama Canal and putting the mullah's in charge of Iran (make no mistake, this would not have happened without his approval). I will not mourn when that hateful old bigot finally passes.

Back to the canal itself, the Panamanians have done a terrible job maintaining it I have read, which is part of the reason for all the delays. Mexico is closing in on its 'inter-oceanic corridor' which is a rail line intended to handle millions of containers a year. Hopefully that works/competes well.
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