literally unbelievable that before the Lehman collapse the debt to GDP ratio was around 40%

in another 10 years it will be over 134%.

Lehman was only 15 years ago, with the two wars we were then in now OVER for the last 5 years.

Debt to GDP ratio in World War Two fighting the Nazi Empire and the Japanese Empire= 114%

CDUB98 said:

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We are so ****ed.

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I really feel badly for those with young children

it will be like the final years of the Roman Empire, the British Empire in 1947, the Dutch empire in the 1600s..

WT FOX said:

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LMCane said:

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WT FOX said:

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End entitlement spending.

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that will never happen until the final collapse is upon us

likely right when I can start to draw social security benefits at age 62.

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Then we have no further need to continue discussing the debt to gdp ratio because that is the only cure to the problem.

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are you saying that the only cure is total collapse?

or dealing somehow with social security and medicare?

LMCane said:

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literally unbelievable that before the Lehman collapse the debt to GDP ratio was around 40%

in another 10 years it will be over 134%.

Lehman was only 15 years ago, with the two wars we were then in now OVER for the last 5 years.

Debt to GDP ratio in World War Two fighting the Nazi Empire and the Japanese Empire= 114%

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RFK Jr was just on Newsmax, and unlike CNN, they let him talk. He brought this up and said within 10 years 100% of the Taxes we collect will go to paying interest on the debt.

WT FOX said:

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I'm saying the only cure is ending entitlement spending, You said the only thing triggering that is a total collapse.

There is zero reason to continue worrying or talking about the debt if cutting entitlement spending is off the table.

We should instead be discussing prepping options to mitigate the coming collapse. I lean towards canned food and shotgun shells. You?

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I agree. that's why I am leaving Maryland suburbs of DC and moving to Florida in latter 2026.

What to do isn't the problem. Who will do it is the problem.

Argentina says 'hi'

MouthBQ98 said:

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SS is an entitlement because it is a defined benefits plan and it is paid out by plan terms regardless of the input for those eligible. It is also paid using present revenue dollars such that current contributors are providing the funds used for current recipients, and there is no holding or investment of the contributions.

People routinely receive far more than they ever contribute, hence the problem. SS also pays disability to non contributors.

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It used to be a hedge. Pay a little in and if u live long enough the government helps u. And only 65% of people lived to see significant benefits so you may not ever see much of what u put in. But u didn't put in alot to begin with so u didn't feel it much in ur paycheck.

Not a great plan but it was more of (live longer than my retirement preparation holds out) insurance.

But now its....pay a significant portion of ur income and ur employer will too because we are gonna make u.

Personally I would rather have gotten more money off the top from my employer and invested that into an index fund.

with survivor's benefits and others, like disability it has changed to....everyone takes out more than they put in and ur wages are depressed because of the forced employer contribution


Which isn't even a plan....just robbery at gunpoint.

And yeah...boomers implemented alot of these poorly thought out changes and refused to revamp it when Bush proposed privatizing it.

So thanks boomers.

SS is a Ponzi scheme. I know because have been receiving a check every month for 10 years now. Paid FICA every paycheck of my life but no way I paid enough for all I am going to receive assuming I live for another 15 years or so.

Back in 1935 when FDR started it there were maybe 40 folks paying for every person who received anything. The ratio now is likely 4 to 1 or so. Maybe I die first before it all explodes/defaults but it cannot continue forever like this.

There is an excellent Scalia attribution about how different charity and welfare contrast, in both the payer and the payee.

Recipients taking more than they put in was an inevitable outcome of wage growth not shadowing inflationary cost increases.

The ONLY thing that is somewhat of a reassurance, is that the rest of the world will be worse off when the chickens finally come home to roost.

The scariest thing is potentially losing USD global reserve status. That means we can no longer QE ourselves out of domestic crisis, or wage economic war on foreign adversaries. We will be subjected to either BRICS dictators or a bunch of Bitcoin tycoons.

This is why we will see a hard fight for CBDC within our gov and fed, with a simultaneous campaign against bitcoin. Only question is how far away are we, and how with the Bitcoin community react.

WBBQ74 said:

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SS is a Ponzi scheme. I know because have been receiving a check every month for 10 years now. Paid FICA every paycheck of my life but no way I paid enough for all I am going to receive assuming I live for another 15 years or so.

Back in 1935 when FDR started it there were maybe 40 folks paying for every person who received anything. The ratio now is likely 4 to 1 or so. Maybe I die first before it all explodes/defaults but it cannot continue forever like this.

There is an excellent Scalia attribution about how different charity and welfare contrast, in both the payer and the payee.

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Paid in since I was 15, there is no way I will ever get the amount of money back that I would have if the 15% the government has garnished was put into an index fund instead. You know who has been screwed the hardest by SS, yeah the "boomers" who have watched Congress loot the SS system.

Tex117 said:

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The Boomers really effed this country didn't they?

They really...and I mean...REALLY...liked doling out those entitlements and spending like there was no tomorrow.

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They were not in power when it was all implemented. They certainly did nothing to reform it when they took power, but boomers did not take complete control of political power until the 1990s. Even then it was shared power between them and the GI Generations from the 1970s-2000.

SSA was formed in 1935. The GI generation were young adults and teenagers when it was created. Their children were the Silents and Boomers that would not come of age until the 1960s and early 70s. So their political power would not truly happen until the 1990s when they started to reach middle age.

FDR was born in 1882. I don't even know if we have a name for this generation but the presidency and congress was held by the GRANDPARENTS of the Boomers when SS was passed. The Great Grandparents of boomers when the Federal Income Tax was created.

The first boomer President was 1992. The first Boomer Speaker of the House was 1994. They shared power with Senate leaders that were part of the GI generation.

Medicare was passed in 1965. The oldest boomers were just turning 19. The people passing that legislation were born 1900-1920.

Like I said, boomers did nothing to stop this runaway train when they could have, but they certainly did not start the train rolling.

Turn of the century Progressives like Wilson and the Roosevelt created the perfect socialist traps. What generation is going to be the one that pulls the entitlement rug out from under their parents and grandparents? It has to be done to save the Republic, but it will be nearly impossible to do because of the emotional blackmail.

MouthBQ98 said:

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SS is an entitlement because it is a defined benefits plan and it is paid out by plan terms regardless of the input for those eligible. It is also paid using present revenue dollars such that current contributors are providing the funds used for current recipients, and there is no holding or investment of the contributions.

People routinely receive far more than they ever contribute, hence the problem. SS also pays disability to non contributors.

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However, that is due to poor management by the Gov't. If they put that money into our 401Ks including the Company required match, getting paid back more wouldn't be a problem, and would be what you expect.

Also, in determining what you get paid, they look at the 35 highest years of income, which would be linked to how much you and your employer required contributed given its a fixed % of Salary.

As far as disability, I have no comment on that one.

Nothing will be done until the voting population has to directly deal with some painful consequences. I fear that the slow boil we're seeing only serves to delay that tipping point and that the timing / size of the response will be too little, too late.

Entitlement spending and interest on debt, and interest on the debt will be a bigger slice of the pie and growing even more pretty soon.

Nothing else matters.

LMCane said:

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WT FOX said:

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End entitlement spending.

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that will never happen until the final collapse is upon us

likely right when I can start to draw social security benefits at age 62.

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When do you turn 62.....like to know how much time we have to plan.

Viper16 said:

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LMCane said:

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WT FOX said:

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End entitlement spending.

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that will never happen until the final collapse is upon us

likely right when I can start to draw social security benefits at age 62.

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When do you turn 62.....like to know how much time we have to plan.

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from all the studies I have been seeing, Social Security scheduled to run out of funding in 2032.

which is when I am able to take early distributions, but of course everyone knows that in 2031 they will simply raise the age to get back our payments until age 68.

LMCane said:

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WT FOX said:

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LMCane said:

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WT FOX said:

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End entitlement spending.

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that will never happen until the final collapse is upon us

likely right when I can start to draw social security benefits at age 62.

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Then we have no further need to continue discussing the debt to gdp ratio because that is the only cure to the problem.

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are you saying that the only cure is total collapse?

or dealing somehow with social security and medicare?

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Apparently that is the only way anything can be fixed anymore. All signs are that we are headed for collapse in multiple areas, financially, politically, our society... But no, we can't do a thing about it until it's a much bigger problem.