Not my forte and I keep seeing references to it being used to comb through state's voter rolls to find phantom voters and bad registrations (such as in vacant lots, strip malls, schools, etc.)

Video #1: HERE

Video #2: HERE

Video #3: HERE

How much confidence should be given to their results? Would really appreciate some insight on this from those who know much more about this stuff than I do. TIA.

AI should actually be getting pretty good at that sort of data mining and analysis. You can be sure the same type of mining is being used to identify disinterested but otherwise eligible voters in target areas whose ballots can be harvested to maximum effect in the bigger political picture. That way activists can be sure to get them registered and then later deliver or arrive in coordination with ballot mailings, and "help" them vote, "thank" them for their civic responsibility with the necessary award, and ensure the ballot with the desired outcome is delivered as the goal of the activist dictates.

Yeah, it can harm election security as well as help it.

Thanks. So I take it there will be an ongoing process back and forth.

Dueling use of the technology, yes. Before too long, it won't much matter that you can vote anonymously or choose not to vote. AI will be able to make a very good guess based on the information about you how you voted, and eventually, how you will vote. Then it will spend time manipulating you subtly months in advance of a vote if it detects you might be useful to manipulate on any particular issue in any particular election on behalf of whoever as the controlling interest in an AI by manipulating what information in media you see and don't see.

They're already subtly doing the latter in big corporate social media, but it is still more generally targeted at population groups and categories and not customized to individuals and refined by feedback.

MouthBQ98 said:

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Dueling use of the technology, yes. Before too long, it won't much matter that you can vote anonymously or choose not to vote. AI will be able to make a very good guess based on the information about you how you voted, and eventually, how you will vote. Then it will spend time manipulating you subtly months in advance of a vote if it detects you might be useful to manipulate on any particular issue in any particular election on behalf of whoever as the controlling interest in an AI by manipulating what information in media you see and don't see.

They're already subtly doing the latter in big corporate social media, but it is still more generally targeted at population groups and categories and not customized to individuals and refined by feedback.

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I do not believe that this is the case. I think it very much is being done on an individual basis based on machine learning.

US data collection pipes were left open 2016 for BHO 'organizations' that can datamine every US citizens and pull a list of citizens that absolutely will not vote in person or mail. Hit print on the mail-in ballot machine... don't even need a true ai

Here is an alarming thought: it very well may be possible that TikTok's search and suggestion and filtering algorithms can swing any close federal election with the influence on what Americans in the 18-30 age range find themselves selectively exposed to or driven to by its selection and promotion algorithms. The influence of selective exposure to media and information is now that substantial.

China would be able to have the deciding vote, in effect.

TRADUCTOR said:

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US data collection pipes were left open 2016 for BHO 'organizations' that can datamine every US citizens and pull a list of citizens that absolutely will not vote in person or mail. Hit print on the mail-in ballot machine... don't even need a true ai

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We have a winner!

Change laws that allow "legally" harvesting votes and you instantly get thousands upon thousands of Urban voters who would have voted democrat if they had taken the time.

Game over!

Here's the concern with future elections when they are very close with a slim margin of victory that is smaller than the faulty registrations. Cast Vote Records (where available) following an election being compared to fractal results of that state's voter rolls would become the way to challenge?

Is this tech solid enough for admissibility in court? Would that be persuasive evidence?

It's getting more granular all the time but they are restricted by certain data gathering and use laws that require anonymous data , so it takes longer for an aI to reverse engineer which data probably belongs to which individual. If it can achieve the desired influence at a less granular level, than it will save the processing resources for more targeted influence for where it gets the biggest result.

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I do not believe that this is the case. I think it very much is being done on an individual basis based on machine learning.

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I don't know how many companies are doing 1:1 personalization, but they're definitely doing it at a cluster level.

Here's a graphic to help explain the process...

https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/content/v1/5bdb8dfb372b964413afe790/1542156393850-VP66XVKE6HN3JVML7YQO/Spy%2BLab.jpg

Thanks to everyone for giving their perspective here. Really helps to filter out the noise about what is possible and what is just a smokescreen. As many of you know, I have long been a critic of ERIC but being critical without solid evidence of how FOS they are in how they manage voter rolls, is appreciated.

I think that a certain number of ballots can be harvested, or in effect stolen from disinterested voters without them ever knowing, but eventually AI can also help secure the vote as well.

The problem is at a bigger level: outright manipulation of the perceptions and beliefs of the population in targeted and sophisticated fashion so they are carefully curated to vote certain ways, believe certain things, engage in certain activities, etc. it will be s manipulation of the ideology and knowledge of the individual, affecting how they will vote, not if a particular voting activity. It really works. It's been developed and deployed regarding advertising for economic snd consumption of target populations but elements within these same massive monopolistic information and media corporations can also swing political outcomes and thus the political business environment in their own favor or in favor of whom ever the corporate management prefers.

MouthBQ98 said:

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Here is an alarming thought: it very well may be possible that TikTok's search and suggestion and filtering algorithms can swing any close federal election with the influence on what Americans in the 18-30 age range find themselves selectively exposed to or driven to by its selection and promotion algorithms. The influence of selective exposure to media and information is now that substantial.

China would be able to have the deciding vote, in effect.

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I would contend it is already happening.

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I would contend it is already happening.

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Meaning the protests supporting the Palestinian attacks on Israel?

PA24 said:

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TRADUCTOR said:

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US data collection pipes were left open 2016 for BHO 'organizations' that can datamine every US citizens and pull a list of citizens that absolutely will not vote in person or mail. Hit print on the mail-in ballot machine... don't even need a true ai

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We have a winner!

Change laws that allow "legally" harvesting votes and you instantly get thousands upon thousands of Urban voters who would have voted democrat if they had taken the time.

Game over!

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So why don't the Republican do the same thing and please spare me that they are above that? Both parties will do whatever it takes to win.

Kansas Kid said:

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PA24 said:

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TRADUCTOR said:

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US data collection pipes were left open 2016 for BHO 'organizations' that can datamine every US citizens and pull a list of citizens that absolutely will not vote in person or mail. Hit print on the mail-in ballot machine... don't even need a true ai

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We have a winner!

Change laws that allow "legally" harvesting votes and you instantly get thousands upon thousands of Urban voters who would have voted democrat if they had taken the time.

Game over!

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So why don't the Republican do the same thing and please spare me that they are above that? Both parties will do whatever it takes to win.

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There is a huge difference between ballot harvesting and ballot manufacturing. Harvesting can include legitimate votes. Manufacturing them by definition are not legitimate. There may be an actual person that exists but they didn't vote.

aggiehawg said:

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Kansas Kid said:

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PA24 said:

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TRADUCTOR said:

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US data collection pipes were left open 2016 for BHO 'organizations' that can datamine every US citizens and pull a list of citizens that absolutely will not vote in person or mail. Hit print on the mail-in ballot machine... don't even need a true ai

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We have a winner!

Change laws that allow "legally" harvesting votes and you instantly get thousands upon thousands of Urban voters who would have voted democrat if they had taken the time.

Game over!

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So why don't the Republican do the same thing and please spare me that they are above that? Both parties will do whatever it takes to win.

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There is a huge difference between ballot harvesting and ballot manufacturing. Harvesting can include legitimate votes. Manufacturing them by definition are not legitimate. There may be an actual person that exists but they didn't vote.

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I agree but again, if the Dems do it, why don't the Republicans? They could even manufacture that ballot for a non voting Dem.

BREAKING: A Federal Judge in Pennsylvania has ruled that undated mail in ballots can be counted in the 2024 election despite a state law that clearly prohibits it. This means mail in ballots with no dates or incorrect dates will be counted

This is yet another example of the… pic.twitter.com/Ij8DO8y5mX

— George (@BehizyTweets) November 22, 2023

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Mail-in ballots in Pennsylvania without accurate handwritten dates on their exterior envelopes must still be counted if they are received in time, a judge ruled Tuesday, concluding that rejecting such ballots violates federal civil rights law.

The decision has implications for the 2024 presidential election in a key battleground state where Democrats have been far more likely to vote by mail than Republicans.

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In the latest lawsuit filed over a 2019 state voting law, U.S. District Judge Susan Paradise Baxter ruled that county boards of election may no longer reject mail ballots that lack accurate, handwritten dates on their return envelopes. Baxter said the date which is required by state law is irrelevant in helping elections officials decide whether the ballot was received in time or whether the voter is qualified to cast a ballot.

The GOP has repeatedly fought in court to get such ballots thrown out, part of a campaign to invalidate mail-in ballots and mail-in voting in Pennsylvania after then-President Donald Trump baselessly claimed in 2020 that mail balloting was rife with fraud.

The judge, a Trump appointee, sided with several Pennsylvania groups represented by the American Civil Liberties Union, which argued that refusing to count such ballots "because of a trivial paperwork error" disenfranchises voters and violates provisions of the U.S. Civil Rights Act of 1964, which states that immaterial errors or omissions should not be used to prevent voting.

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In Pennsylvania's case, elections officials do not use the date on the outer envelope to determine whether the vote should be counted, the judge said.

"The important date for casting the ballot is the date the ballot is received. Here, the date on the outside envelope was not used by any of the county boards to determine when a voter's mail ballot was received in the November 2022 election," Baxter wrote.

In that election, more than 7,600 mail ballots in 12 counties were tossed because the outer envelope lacked a date or had an incorrect date, according to the decision. Those counties were among the defendants in the suit.

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The status of ballots without properly dated envelopes has been repeatedly litigated since the use of mail-in voting greatly expanded in Pennsylvania under a state law passed in 2019.

In November 2022, the state Supreme Court unanimously barred officials from counting such votes, directing county boards of elections to "segregate and preserve" those ballots. But the justices were split over whether making the envelope dates mandatory under state law would violate provisions of federal civil rights law the issue at play in Tuesday's federal court ruling.

The Department of State has said the state court decision to bar mail-in ballots without accurate handwritten dates resulted in otherwise valid votes being thrown out. The agency said more than 16,000 mail-in ballots in the 2022 midterm election were disqualified by county officials because they lacked secrecy envelopes or proper signatures or dates.

Democratic voters made up more than two-thirds of the total cancelled ballots.

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Hmm.

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The 3rd U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals ruled in May 2022 that the dates are not mandatory, but the U.S. Supreme Court then deemed that decision moot, prompting the lawsuit that was decided Tuesday.

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Of course, SCOTUS punted on a recurring issue.

LINK

Kansas Kid said:

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PA24 said:

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TRADUCTOR said:

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US data collection pipes were left open 2016 for BHO 'organizations' that can datamine every US citizens and pull a list of citizens that absolutely will not vote in person or mail. Hit print on the mail-in ballot machine... don't even need a true ai

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We have a winner!

Change laws that allow "legally" harvesting votes and you instantly get thousands upon thousands of Urban voters who would have voted democrat if they had taken the time.

Game over!

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So why don't the Republican do the same thing and please spare me that they are above that? Both parties will do whatever it takes to win.

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Because the rules of the game are (D)ifferent.

Republicans get thrown in solitary confinement for trespassing during their protests.
Democrats get congresspeople to pay for their bail during their protests.

The requirement to follow the law only applies to one side of the isle. To deny this is to expose a certain amount of ignorance and tone deafness. To use the absence of GOP crimes as proof that the Dems do not perform the same crimes is demonstrably false.

The answer is to require in person registration and have voter registrations expire after 5 years or on your decennial birthday if 5 years is too short.

lb3 said:

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The answer is to require in person registration and have voter registrations expire after 5 years or on your decennial birthday if 5 years is too short.

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Not disagreeing with that idea but the best way to effectuate that is to completely purge the entire state's voter rolls and start over with new regstrations. Something I can easily see the federal courts blocking, due to disparate impact upon older voters, among other things.

Maybe a differentiation by age at that time such a state act passes? Say, 3 years for those 45 and younger, 5 years for those 46-65, 7 years for those over 65?

lb3 said:

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The answer is to require in person registration and have voter registrations expire after 5 years or on your decennial birthday if 5 years is too short.

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Make it applicable just like driver's license, every 5 years by your birthday.

Lie cheat steal Democrats. Eff doing that to win. Just need to run those squealing swine off the cliff.