Israel/Hamas going at it

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Rossticus
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In reply to aggiehawg • 2:25p, 10/10/23
The thing that concerns me is if this does result in mass civilian casualty in Gaza then you could be looking at actual legitimate nations of the Arab world finally getting the "justification" to declare a proper war on Israel that they've been salivating over, to which we'd get drawn in. The holy war against the "infidels" that would fulfill prophesy. And then things get really complicated with Russia and China weighing the benefits to themselves of tagging in and creating an all out 3 front WW3.

Hoping that this is just projection of force and fear for effect.
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Gyles Marrett
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In reply to Rossticus • 2:26p, 10/10/23
Rossticus said:
The thing that concerns me is if this does result in mass civilian casualty in Gaza then you could be looking at actual legitimate nations of the Arab world finally getting the "justification" to declare a proper war on Israel that they've been salivating over, to which we'd get drawn in. The holy war against the "infidels" that would fulfill prophesy. And then things get really complicated with Russia and China weighing the benefits to themselves of tagging in and creating an all out 3 front WW3.
I think there's many war mongers in powerful positions in our government that want exactly that....
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ConstructionAg01
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In reply to LMCane • 2:27p, 10/10/23
AG
Respectfully, everything you are posting has been posted/said a dozen times already, some of it 2-3 days ago.
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ABATTBQ11
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In reply to P.H. Dexippus • 2:27p, 10/10/23
AG
P.H. Dexippus said:
will25u said:
Israel knows a thing or two about war crimes tribunals. Use some common sense, this is clearly not going to be their ROE.

Israel is not going to do anything to their own soldiers. What they know of war crimes tribunals is that they're effectively toothless. The Nazis and Japanese committed countless horrific attrocities that went unpunished. Officers acting of their own accord who tortured and murdered civilians were convicted and given slaps on the wrist instead of execution. The number of people held responsible for the Holocaust is surprisingly small.

There's no reason for Israel not to tell their soldiers that ROE is shoot whatever you want
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CDUB98
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2:27p, 10/10/23
AG
Is there a live webcam link to the Northern Israeli border?
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Independence H-D
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In reply to CDUB98 • 2:30p, 10/10/23
CDUB98 said:
Is there a live webcam link to the Northern Israeli border?


Probably. But there isn't one anymore for Mia k.....


Hey now!
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Who?mikejones!
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2:30p, 10/10/23
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2:31p, 10/10/23
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2:33p, 10/10/23
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Who?mikejones!
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2:34p, 10/10/23
It's appears camera 2 and 3 are roughly pointed at each other as the same explosions are seen from both cameras
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Stat Monitor Repairman
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2:35p, 10/10/23
Are we about to see Israel level the whole place?
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Sea Speed
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In reply to will25u • 2:36p, 10/10/23
AG
will25u said:


I REALLY doubt they are going to anchor. That is how you lose an aircraft carrier.
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In reply to txags92 • 2:37p, 10/10/23
AG
txags92 said:
will25u said:
Quote:
and anchor off the coast of Israel.

Tell me you have no idea how carrier groups operate without telling me...


I see you beat me to it.
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LMCane
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In reply to Rossticus • 2:39p, 10/10/23
Rossticus said:
The thing that concerns me is if this does result in mass civilian casualty in Gaza then you could be looking at actual legitimate nations of the Arab world finally getting the "justification" to declare a proper war on Israel that they've been salivating over, to which we'd get drawn in. The holy war against the "infidels" that would fulfill prophesy. And then things get really complicated with Russia and China weighing the benefits to themselves of tagging in and creating an all out 3 front WW3.

Hoping that this is just projection of force and fear for effect.
Eh. that's not a concern

this isn't 1967 or 1948 anymore

Jordan, Egypt, UAE, Abu Dhabi, Bahrain, Morocco have peace treaties with Israel. Sudan has relations with Israel.

Lebanon of course is not a real country but is part of the Iranian Caliphate controlled by Hizbullah. So far Hiz is staying out of it.

Saudi Arabia just invited Israeli Cabinet Ministers to conferences in Riyadh the last two weeks.

yes there are jihadis around the Middle East, but even Iraq is not interested in going to war with Israel anymore.
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plain_o_llama
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In reply to Who?mikejones! • 2:40p, 10/10/23
Agthatbuilds said:
It's appears camera 2 and 3 are roughly pointed at each other as the same explosions are seen from both cameras
The explosions seem to be in pairs, 10-15 seconds apart.
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Harry Stone
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2:41p, 10/10/23
AG
My business partner served in the Israeli Army and at times was stationed along the Gaza border. I hadn't really had a chance to talk to him until today because he's been spending most of the last 72 hours talking to his sister just outside Tel Aviv.

Interesting to hear his POV, which is not much different than a lot of people here. He says Israel should set up refugee camps near Gaza to allow civilians to leave unharmed and then decimate the entire region.

He said that Israel should not and does not care what the rest of the world thinks about full invasion and annihilation of Gaza, but to do it now and worry about any consequences later.
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LMCane
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In reply to Who?mikejones! • 2:41p, 10/10/23
Agthatbuilds said:
really not a fan of this Israeli practice for YEARS to park their AFVs close to each other in an open field

as if they don't realize someday Hizbullah will use drones to target and open fire on them.

again, the overconfidence of the IDF is sometimes appalling.
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Who?mikejones!
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In reply to LMCane • 2:42p, 10/10/23
I presume the staging locations are probably a fair distance from enemy forces
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LMCane
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In reply to Harry Stone • 2:43p, 10/10/23
Harry Stone said:
My business partner served in the Israeli Army and at times was stationed along the Gaza border. I hadn't really had a chance to talk to him until today because he's been spending most of the last 72 hours talking to his sister just outside Tel Aviv.

Interesting to hear his POV, which is not much different than a lot of people here. He says Israel should set up refugee camps near Gaza to allow civilians to leave unharmed and then decimate the entire region.

He said that Israel should not and does not care what the rest of the world thinks about full invasion and annihilation of Gaza, but to do it now and worry about any consequences later.
the problem is that while it sounds good hypothetically, in reality how do you do that?

the IDF is not going to demolish every single structure in the Gaza Strip and kill two million Palestinians

so how do you go into very crowded cities where the Hamas terror leaders are living in undeground bunkers about 4 levels below a school or a hospital?

in the real world, how do you send an army into a 20x25 mile area filled with 3 million people in crowded streets and refugee shanties?
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Who?mikejones!
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In reply to Harry Stone • 2:44p, 10/10/23
Harry Stone said:
My business partner served in the Israeli Army and at times was stationed along the Gaza border. I hadn't really had a chance to talk to him until today because he's been spending most of the last 72 hours talking to his sister just outside Tel Aviv.

Interesting to hear his POV, which is not much different than a lot of people here. He says Israel should set up refugee camps near Gaza to allow civilians to leave unharmed and then decimate the entire region.

He said that Israel should not and does not care what the rest of the world thinks about full invasion and annihilation of Gaza, but to do it now and worry about any consequences later.


I agree with him. I think it'd be a politically savvy move to set up un/red cross run camps to fill with Palestinian women and children, and then lay waste to gaza.

Allowing men in might be okay if they could be properly vetted.
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deddog
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In reply to Who?mikejones! • 2:44p, 10/10/23
AG
Agthatbuilds said:
It's appears camera 2 and 3 are roughly pointed at each other as the same explosions are seen from both cameras
That incessant drone also doubles as a serious psyops instrument as well
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Biz Ag
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2:45p, 10/10/23
AG
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Rossticus
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In reply to LMCane • 2:45p, 10/10/23
Nope. But it only takes Iran, with the rest deciding to sit on their hands. Syria WANTS to play but is being discouraged (but if Iran jumps so will they, with Russia's encouragement IMO), and as you said, Hezbollah in Lebanon is holding but ultimately they're a coin flip. We've seen recently that just because it's the 21st century doesn't mean that countries won't go to war if they think they can secure a large enough W.
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Nitro Power
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In reply to LMCane • 2:46p, 10/10/23
AG
I trust their judgement and decision making much more than internet posters who think they understand the strategy based on intel they received from 3rd and 4th hand accounts on twitter.
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Who?mikejones!
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In reply to deddog • 2:46p, 10/10/23
Sure has gotten much darker. Someone turned off most the lights
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Nagler
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2:46p, 10/10/23
AG
If you had a bucket of stagnant water by your back porch and the mosquitos breeding there keep biting you. Are you going to ask them nicely to stop or kick the bucket over?
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Biz Ag
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2:46p, 10/10/23
Biz Ag
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2:47p, 10/10/23
AG
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Who?mikejones!
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2:47p, 10/10/23
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Harry Stone
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In reply to LMCane • 2:47p, 10/10/23
AG
LMCane said:
Harry Stone said:
My business partner served in the Israeli Army and at times was stationed along the Gaza border. I hadn't really had a chance to talk to him until today because he's been spending most of the last 72 hours talking to his sister just outside Tel Aviv.

Interesting to hear his POV, which is not much different than a lot of people here. He says Israel should set up refugee camps near Gaza to allow civilians to leave unharmed and then decimate the entire region.

He said that Israel should not and does not care what the rest of the world thinks about full invasion and annihilation of Gaza, but to do it now and worry about any consequences later.
the problem is that while it sounds good hypothetically, in reality how do you do that?

the IDF is not going to demolish every single structure in the Gaza Strip and kill two million Palestinians

so how do you go into very crowded cities where the Hamas terror leaders are living in undeground bunkers about 4 levels below a school or a hospital?

in the real world, how do you send an army into a 20x25 mile area filled with 3 million people in crowded streets and refugee shanties?


He did say that they have little training in combat within densely populated cities so it could be a problem to send the military in there.
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deddog
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In reply to Stat Monitor Repairman • 2:47p, 10/10/23
AG
Stat Monitor Repairman said:
Are we about to see Israel level the whole place?
No.
Their attacks continue to be very targeted.
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aggiehawg
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In reply to Rossticus • 2:48p, 10/10/23
AG
Rossticus said:
The thing that concerns me is if this does result in mass civilian casualty in Gaza then you could be looking at actual legitimate nations of the Arab world finally getting the "justification" to declare a proper war on Israel that they've been salivating over, to which we'd get drawn in. The holy war against the "infidels" that would fulfill prophesy. And then things get really complicated with Russia and China weighing the benefits to themselves of tagging in and creating an all out 3 front WW3.

Hoping that this is just projection of force and fear for effect.
Same here. Either it is fake, as in he never said that or it was for psyops for the enemy. The one thing Hamas could trust was that the IDF would not go against them in the same manner they went against Israeli citizens, matching atrocity for atrocity. Hamas might get shot, they might get captured but they are not going to be tortured and drawn and quartered. Maybe a little doubt that they might be treated the way they treated others might make them less likely to fight and to run away? To where, I'm not sure.

But if history is any guide, wars have been started for less than what was said there on no ROE. Scary.
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Rossticus
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In reply to Harry Stone • 2:48p, 10/10/23
That's how you'd equalize the situation if you're Hamas. Hopefully Israel has enough sense to avoid such a situation, level it from distance and above, then roll in for cleanup.
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deddog
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In reply to Who?mikejones! • 2:49p, 10/10/23
AG
Agthatbuilds said:
Sure has gotten much darker. Someone turned off most the lights
I find it amazing that they don't have a complete blackout. Like you don't even have to turn your lights out, just cover the window panes wth paper. I think many of the Palestinians have also gotten comfortable with Israelis minimizing collateral damage and going out of their way to not target civilians.
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Not a Bot
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2:49p, 10/10/23
AG
Flurry of concentrated bombings over the last few minutes. Appear to be the northern part of Gaza but hard to say based on the feed. Difficult to find a point of reference.

One of the feeds appears to show the large hospital fully lit up and appears to be filmed from the south facing north.
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