Don't derail this thread. You already have a new fraud thread to post on until your heart is content.

https://texags.com/forums/16/topics/3414898

Tibbers said:

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Phatbob said:

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Why does it matter? Because these are the same people who will run around insisting that Trump lost based on fraudulent ballots. If this is the kind of "proof" that they will buy for something as stupid as DeSantis' boots, do you think it makes the other claims sound reasonable? People's eyes have already started rolling before they even finished opening their mouths, and you want them to take you seriously about election fraud?

If you want the serious issues to be taken seriously, don't put the freaking clowns in charge.

---

But election fraud did happen.

"I would watch the ballots go by, and there were odd patterns. 7 of those ballots were for Biden, 1 for Trump, 7 for Biden, 1 for Trump, 7 for Biden, 1 for Trump. That clearly doesn't .. that's not statistically possible." (Fake ballots were found) - https://t.co/uIpNIDNRbT pic.twitter.com/nAHbDbxcL9

— Rasmussen Reports (@Rasmussen_Poll) October 28, 2023

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Well it was never proven in court and the election is long over. So the question is where you go forward. You can still address election issues but it's a loser issue in '24 to talk about '20.

You're talking to a guy who supports Vivek, an indian with a haircut that looks like a helmet. I could care less about image. Vivek's policies win the day. That being said, when someone found a clip of Vivek rapping back in college, instead of hide from it, he embraced it. Dude spit some lines in Iowa. It was hilarious. He's human. Desantis claiming he's never heard of this or was not informed just doesn't ring true to me. It's stupid stuff like this that reveal character is all. And part of winning over an electorate, as the world doesn't exist in a vacuum, is winning over based on personality.

It's like the Nixon/Kennedy debate. This isn't new.

aggie93 said:

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Tibbers said:

---

Phatbob said:

---

Why does it matter? Because these are the same people who will run around insisting that Trump lost based on fraudulent ballots. If this is the kind of "proof" that they will buy for something as stupid as DeSantis' boots, do you think it makes the other claims sound reasonable? People's eyes have already started rolling before they even finished opening their mouths, and you want them to take you seriously about election fraud?

If you want the serious issues to be taken seriously, don't put the freaking clowns in charge.

---

But election fraud did happen.

"I would watch the ballots go by, and there were odd patterns. 7 of those ballots were for Biden, 1 for Trump, 7 for Biden, 1 for Trump, 7 for Biden, 1 for Trump. That clearly doesn't .. that's not statistically possible." (Fake ballots were found) - https://t.co/uIpNIDNRbT pic.twitter.com/nAHbDbxcL9

— Rasmussen Reports (@Rasmussen_Poll) October 28, 2023

---

Well it was never proven in court and the election is long over. So the question is where you go forward. You can still address election issues but it's a loser issue in '24 to talk about '20.

---

That's why I back all of us to get involved in becoming a poll worker. Particularly if you live in a major county in a swing state. It isn't a losing issue though as it resonates and is still incredibly important to be proactive for 2024 and this isn't a thread derail rapier.

Tibbers said:

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You're talking to a guy who supports Vivek, an indian with a haircut that looks like a helmet. I could care less about image. Vivek's policies win the day. That being said, when someone found a clip of Vivek rapping back in college, instead of hide from it, he embraced it. Dude spit some lines in Iowa. It was hilarious. He's human. Desantis claiming he's never heard of this or was not informed just doesn't ring true to me. It's stupid stuff like this that reveal character is all. And part of winning over an electorate, as the world doesn't exist in a vacuum, is winning over based on personality.

It's like the Nixon/Kennedy debate. This isn't new.

---

Except Kennedy was actually a great communicator. Trump talks like a moron and is now making dumb mistakes almost daily, which unfortunately also endears him to a small percentage of the population who barely pays attention to politics, has no idea what the issues actually are, and will go away once Trump is finally gone.

There may be too many of them and too much name recognition to overcome for this primary but that doesn't mean DeSantis should stoop to their level. He'll be ready to run again in 2028 when Trump is long forgotten and things are back to where they were before he hijacked the party.

Edit: and if Trump and his handlers thought he was the Kennedy in this equation they wouldn't be hiding from the debates. They know the contrast would finally start to wake people up who aren't really paying attention yet.

Quote:

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And part of winning over an electorate.... is winning over based on personality.

---

While there's accuracy here, how many Trump voters, myself among them, chided folks for voting for personality over policy?

Now that's being abandoned by folks that claim to have principles

J. Walter Weatherman said:

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Tibbers said:

---

You're talking to a guy who supports Vivek, an indian with a haircut that looks like a helmet. I could care less about image. Vivek's policies win the day. That being said, when someone found a clip of Vivek rapping back in college, instead of hide from it, he embraced it. Dude spit some lines in Iowa. It was hilarious. He's human. Desantis claiming he's never heard of this or was not informed just doesn't ring true to me. It's stupid stuff like this that reveal character is all. And part of winning over an electorate, as the world doesn't exist in a vacuum, is winning over based on personality.

It's like the Nixon/Kennedy debate. This isn't new.

---

Except Kennedy was actually a great communicator. Trump talks like a moron and is now making dumb mistakes almost daily, which unfortunately also endears him to a small percentage of the population who barely pays attention to politics, has no idea what the issues actually are, and will go away once Trump is finally gone.

There may be too many of them and too much name recognition to overcome for this primary but that doesn't mean DeSantis should stoop to their level. He'll be ready to run again in 2028 when Trump is long forgotten and things are back to where they were before he hijacked the party.

---

Remember when I said half the posts here are simply mocking Trump?

Desantis could have easily run for office in 2028 without running in 2024. Whomever talked him into doing so really messed up. He can't run again as Governor, so what will he do? Sit out for two years as his name and legacy fade away? All he did by running now is piss off the die hard trump folks. You think they are going to forget? Just odd. Like I said, the only path forward for Desantis at this point is if Trump is behind bars. One way he could have played this is to back Trump, help him with the Presidency, get a cabinet level position to say within government and then run in 2028. That ship has sailed now.

Tibbers said:

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J. Walter Weatherman said:

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Tibbers said:

---

You're talking to a guy who supports Vivek, an indian with a haircut that looks like a helmet. I could care less about image. Vivek's policies win the day. That being said, when someone found a clip of Vivek rapping back in college, instead of hide from it, he embraced it. Dude spit some lines in Iowa. It was hilarious. He's human. Desantis claiming he's never heard of this or was not informed just doesn't ring true to me. It's stupid stuff like this that reveal character is all. And part of winning over an electorate, as the world doesn't exist in a vacuum, is winning over based on personality.

It's like the Nixon/Kennedy debate. This isn't new.

---

Except Kennedy was actually a great communicator. Trump talks like a moron and is now making dumb mistakes almost daily, which unfortunately also endears him to a small percentage of the population who barely pays attention to politics, has no idea what the issues actually are, and will go away once Trump is finally gone.

There may be too many of them and too much name recognition to overcome for this primary but that doesn't mean DeSantis should stoop to their level. He'll be ready to run again in 2028 when Trump is long forgotten and things are back to where they were before he hijacked the party.

---

He could have easily done that without running in 2024. Whomever talked him into doing so really messed up. He can't run again as Governor, so what will he do? Sit out for two years as his name and legacy fade away? All he did by running now is piss off the die hard trump folks. You think they are going to forget? Just odd. Like I said, the only path forward for Desantis at this point is if Trump is behind bars.

---

The bolded is your opinion only.

The idea that Trump is somehow owed the nomination is one of the more asinine points that is raised on here. Last I checked he doesn't get to decide who run against him, and anyone who thinks they can win can and should run against him since he's a guaranteed loser in '24.

And it won't matter that his diehards won't forget. They won't be in politics anymore after '24 (other than trying to continue to blame unproven cheating for a year or 2 in a desperate attempt to continue to feed his ego), and they will likely be shamed enough for supporting a circus clown and handing the dems all three branches on a silver platter that no one will care what they think anyways.

4 years is an eternity in politics and if DeSantis loses the primary and Trump gets dominated by Biden (again) or Newsom he will have the best I told you so case in recent American history.

Tibbers said:

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J. Walter Weatherman said:

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Tibbers said:

---

You're talking to a guy who supports Vivek, an indian with a haircut that looks like a helmet. I could care less about image. Vivek's policies win the day. That being said, when someone found a clip of Vivek rapping back in college, instead of hide from it, he embraced it. Dude spit some lines in Iowa. It was hilarious. He's human. Desantis claiming he's never heard of this or was not informed just doesn't ring true to me. It's stupid stuff like this that reveal character is all. And part of winning over an electorate, as the world doesn't exist in a vacuum, is winning over based on personality.

It's like the Nixon/Kennedy debate. This isn't new.

---

Except Kennedy was actually a great communicator. Trump talks like a moron and is now making dumb mistakes almost daily, which unfortunately also endears him to a small percentage of the population who barely pays attention to politics, has no idea what the issues actually are, and will go away once Trump is finally gone.

There may be too many of them and too much name recognition to overcome for this primary but that doesn't mean DeSantis should stoop to their level. He'll be ready to run again in 2028 when Trump is long forgotten and things are back to where they were before he hijacked the party.

---

Remember when I said half the posts here are simply mocking Trump?

Desantis could have easily run for office in 2028 without running in 2024. Whomever talked him into doing so really messed up. He can't run again as Governor, so what will he do? Sit out for two years as his name and legacy fade away? All he did by running now is piss off the die hard trump folks. You think they are going to forget? Just odd. Like I said, the only path forward for Desantis at this point is if Trump is behind bars. One way he could have played this is to back Trump, help him with the Presidency, get a cabinet level position to say within government and then run in 2028. That ship has sailed now.

---

Forget what? You really think he owes Trump? You forget, Trump has said a whole bunch of crap about a whole bunch of people and his apologists just slurp it up, and then when he changes his tune a year and a half later, it was all 4D chess. You forget what they have already had to forget to think Trump has been consistent for more than a month.

J. Walter Weatherman said:

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Tibbers said:

---

J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

Tibbers said:

---

You're talking to a guy who supports Vivek, an indian with a haircut that looks like a helmet. I could care less about image. Vivek's policies win the day. That being said, when someone found a clip of Vivek rapping back in college, instead of hide from it, he embraced it. Dude spit some lines in Iowa. It was hilarious. He's human. Desantis claiming he's never heard of this or was not informed just doesn't ring true to me. It's stupid stuff like this that reveal character is all. And part of winning over an electorate, as the world doesn't exist in a vacuum, is winning over based on personality.

It's like the Nixon/Kennedy debate. This isn't new.

---

Except Kennedy was actually a great communicator. Trump talks like a moron and is now making dumb mistakes almost daily, which unfortunately also endears him to a small percentage of the population who barely pays attention to politics, has no idea what the issues actually are, and will go away once Trump is finally gone.

There may be too many of them and too much name recognition to overcome for this primary but that doesn't mean DeSantis should stoop to their level. He'll be ready to run again in 2028 when Trump is long forgotten and things are back to where they were before he hijacked the party.

---

He could have easily done that without running in 2024. Whomever talked him into doing so really messed up. He can't run again as Governor, so what will he do? Sit out for two years as his name and legacy fade away? All he did by running now is piss off the die hard trump folks. You think they are going to forget? Just odd. Like I said, the only path forward for Desantis at this point is if Trump is behind bars.

---

The bolded is your opinion only.

The idea that Trump is somehow owed the nomination is one of the more asinine points that is raised on here. Last I checked he doesn't get to decide who run against him, and anyone who thinks they can win can and should run against him since he's a guaranteed loser in '24.

And it won't matter that his diehards won't forget. They won't be in politics anymore after '24 (other than trying to continue to blame unproven cheating for a year or 2 in a desperate attempt to continue to feed his ego), and they will likely be shamed enough for supporting a circus clown and handing the dems all three branches on a silver platter that no one will care what they think anyways.

4 years is an eternity in politics and if DeSantis loses the primary and Trump gets dominated by Biden (again) or Newsom he will have the best I told you so case in recent American history.

---

and yet the speaker of the House is a MAGA supporter...I don't think America First lives and dies with Trump alone.

Tibbers said:

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J. Walter Weatherman said:

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Tibbers said:

---

J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

Tibbers said:

---

You're talking to a guy who supports Vivek, an indian with a haircut that looks like a helmet. I could care less about image. Vivek's policies win the day. That being said, when someone found a clip of Vivek rapping back in college, instead of hide from it, he embraced it. Dude spit some lines in Iowa. It was hilarious. He's human. Desantis claiming he's never heard of this or was not informed just doesn't ring true to me. It's stupid stuff like this that reveal character is all. And part of winning over an electorate, as the world doesn't exist in a vacuum, is winning over based on personality.

It's like the Nixon/Kennedy debate. This isn't new.

---

Except Kennedy was actually a great communicator. Trump talks like a moron and is now making dumb mistakes almost daily, which unfortunately also endears him to a small percentage of the population who barely pays attention to politics, has no idea what the issues actually are, and will go away once Trump is finally gone.

There may be too many of them and too much name recognition to overcome for this primary but that doesn't mean DeSantis should stoop to their level. He'll be ready to run again in 2028 when Trump is long forgotten and things are back to where they were before he hijacked the party.

---

He could have easily done that without running in 2024. Whomever talked him into doing so really messed up. He can't run again as Governor, so what will he do? Sit out for two years as his name and legacy fade away? All he did by running now is piss off the die hard trump folks. You think they are going to forget? Just odd. Like I said, the only path forward for Desantis at this point is if Trump is behind bars.

---

The bolded is your opinion only.

The idea that Trump is somehow owed the nomination is one of the more asinine points that is raised on here. Last I checked he doesn't get to decide who run against him, and anyone who thinks they can win can and should run against him since he's a guaranteed loser in '24.

And it won't matter that his diehards won't forget. They won't be in politics anymore after '24 (other than trying to continue to blame unproven cheating for a year or 2 in a desperate attempt to continue to feed his ego), and they will likely be shamed enough for supporting a circus clown and handing the dems all three branches on a silver platter that no one will care what they think anyways.

4 years is an eternity in politics and if DeSantis loses the primary and Trump gets dominated by Biden (again) or Newsom he will have the best I told you so case in recent American history.

---

and yet the speaker of the House is a MAGA supporter...I don't think America First lives and dies with Trump alone.

---

From a policy standpoint I think you'd be hard pressed to find much of anything Johnson and DeSantis disagree on. It's not surprising he currently supports the defacto leader of the party, but Trump won't be the leader anymore after he causes Republicans to lose for the 4th election in a row.

Tibbers said:

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J. Walter Weatherman said:

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Tibbers said:

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J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

Tibbers said:

---

You're talking to a guy who supports Vivek, an indian with a haircut that looks like a helmet. I could care less about image. Vivek's policies win the day. That being said, when someone found a clip of Vivek rapping back in college, instead of hide from it, he embraced it. Dude spit some lines in Iowa. It was hilarious. He's human. Desantis claiming he's never heard of this or was not informed just doesn't ring true to me. It's stupid stuff like this that reveal character is all. And part of winning over an electorate, as the world doesn't exist in a vacuum, is winning over based on personality.

It's like the Nixon/Kennedy debate. This isn't new.

---

Except Kennedy was actually a great communicator. Trump talks like a moron and is now making dumb mistakes almost daily, which unfortunately also endears him to a small percentage of the population who barely pays attention to politics, has no idea what the issues actually are, and will go away once Trump is finally gone.

There may be too many of them and too much name recognition to overcome for this primary but that doesn't mean DeSantis should stoop to their level. He'll be ready to run again in 2028 when Trump is long forgotten and things are back to where they were before he hijacked the party.

---

He could have easily done that without running in 2024. Whomever talked him into doing so really messed up. He can't run again as Governor, so what will he do? Sit out for two years as his name and legacy fade away? All he did by running now is piss off the die hard trump folks. You think they are going to forget? Just odd. Like I said, the only path forward for Desantis at this point is if Trump is behind bars.

---

The bolded is your opinion only.

The idea that Trump is somehow owed the nomination is one of the more asinine points that is raised on here. Last I checked he doesn't get to decide who run against him, and anyone who thinks they can win can and should run against him since he's a guaranteed loser in '24.

And it won't matter that his diehards won't forget. They won't be in politics anymore after '24 (other than trying to continue to blame unproven cheating for a year or 2 in a desperate attempt to continue to feed his ego), and they will likely be shamed enough for supporting a circus clown and handing the dems all three branches on a silver platter that no one will care what they think anyways.

4 years is an eternity in politics and if DeSantis loses the primary and Trump gets dominated by Biden (again) or Newsom he will have the best I told you so case in recent American history.

---

and yet the speaker of the House is a MAGA supporter...I don't think America First lives and dies with Trump alone.

---

The Speaker was Trump's what, 3rd Choice and yet he tried to take credit for it in typical Trump fashion. Not all of us buy the hype.

I think the thing you miss on DeSantis is he sincerely isn't doing this stuff for the pomp and circumstance, he actually cares about making a difference. Thus he ran. Why? Trump will lose in '24 and we can't afford to have 4 more years of Democrat control. Simply sitting back and waiting while the country burns wasn't what he wanted to do even if it may have been politically expedient. That of course assumes 100 things btw trying to predict 5 years in the future. DeSantis has a hard core base though of intellectual conservatives and he has the highest favorables of any candidate. He's got plenty of future.

DeSantis is never going to be the cool guy, that's just not who he is. He doesn't like playing the game of celebrity. Trump and Vivek LOVE that part of it, they love the attention and adoration. DeSantis wants the job. It's all about what you value, a lot of folks like the shiny object.

I know you say you like Vivek on issues and I get it, though I think Vivek is surface level deep on those issues and that's the problem. I know you disagree and that's fine too but the reality is Vivek didn't care much about politics until a few years ago and as smart as he is he still is mainly book smart and is drastically lacking in experience. That's another topic really though.

Now I've heard it all. Vivek loves being the cool guy and is surface level with his policies? Alrighty!

Tibbers said:

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Now I've heard it all. Vivek loves being the cool guy and is surface level with his policies? Alrighty!

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Dude was a rapper in college for fun and his biggest talent is getting people to invest in his companies. It's not a bad thing, it's a big asset as a politician.

As for "surface level" I mean you can't both be an outsider and a policy wonk. Pick one.

Tibbers said:

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Now I've heard it all. Vivek loves being the cool guy and is surface level with his policies? Alrighty!

---

You're close. Ramaswamy loves trying to be the cool guy. Nobody, lol, nobody, thinks he is the cool guy. And yes, he's desperate for adoration, along with power and fame.

Ron DeSantis is the only Republican candidate that will bring a reckoning to the COVID tyrants in the federal government.

The other candidates don’t care about accountability — that’s why they never talk about it. pic.twitter.com/JBPdatD44L

— DeSantis War Room 🐊 (@DeSantisWarRoom) October 30, 2023

I really wish other candidates were talking about this.

PBD podcast was great. He needs to do more of these long form podcast

Posobiec is a clown of the highest order, only behind Loomer and Lake in his undying devotion to Trump.

But he get headlines in the only Trump media such as "Posobiec put DeSantis and Haley on Blast".

Tibbers said:

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J. Walter Weatherman said:

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Tibbers said:

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You're talking to a guy who supports Vivek, an indian with a haircut that looks like a helmet. I could care less about image. Vivek's policies win the day. That being said, when someone found a clip of Vivek rapping back in college, instead of hide from it, he embraced it. Dude spit some lines in Iowa. It was hilarious. He's human. Desantis claiming he's never heard of this or was not informed just doesn't ring true to me. It's stupid stuff like this that reveal character is all. And part of winning over an electorate, as the world doesn't exist in a vacuum, is winning over based on personality.

It's like the Nixon/Kennedy debate. This isn't new.

---

Except Kennedy was actually a great communicator. Trump talks like a moron and is now making dumb mistakes almost daily, which unfortunately also endears him to a small percentage of the population who barely pays attention to politics, has no idea what the issues actually are, and will go away once Trump is finally gone.

There may be too many of them and too much name recognition to overcome for this primary but that doesn't mean DeSantis should stoop to their level. He'll be ready to run again in 2028 when Trump is long forgotten and things are back to where they were before he hijacked the party.

---

Remember when I said half the posts here are simply mocking Trump?

Desantis could have easily run for office in 2028 without running in 2024. Whomever talked him into doing so really messed up. He can't run again as Governor, so what will he do? Sit out for two years as his name and legacy fade away? All he did by running now is piss off the die hard trump folks. You think they are going to forget? Just odd. Like I said, the only path forward for Desantis at this point is if Trump is behind bars. One way he could have played this is to back Trump, help him with the Presidency, get a cabinet level position to say within government and then run in 2028. That ship has sailed now.

---

Trump will probably die in the next year, when the iron is hot you dont decide to wait for years

aggie93 said:

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Tibbers said:

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Now I've heard it all. Vivek loves being the cool guy and is surface level with his policies? Alrighty!

---

Dude was a rapper in college for fun and his biggest talent is getting people to invest in his companies. It's not a bad thing, it's a big asset as a politician.

As for "surface level" I mean you can't both be an outsider and a policy wonk. Pick one.

---

come on now. Part of Vivek's charm as a candidate and the reason I support him is the fact that he actually has gone far beyond just being "surface level" on policy. It's amazing that you would make a statement like that. Well maybe not because out of Desantis, I don't think you've done a deep dive. I highly recommend you do so. The dude is extremely impressive on policy. He lays out exactly what he would change, how he would do so, etc. There are so many examples of this and for all the love of long form debates (of which I think is the best way to understand any candidates' position), you must admit the amount of content any candidate has put forth in long form debates, Vivek is the champion of this.



Hell, Shawn Ryan highlights this. Vivek sits down for two hours while Desantis talks for 15 minutes. Desantis speaks with Maher for what, 5 minutes? Vivek speaks with him for an hour. There are countless more examples. If you want a policy driven candidate, there really is no contest of content than Vivek.



https://www.vivek2024.com/america-first-2-0/

I get that y'all won't take the time to listen, but come on man. Your criticism is burying your head in the sand.

astros4545 said:

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Tibbers said:

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J. Walter Weatherman said:

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Tibbers said:

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You're talking to a guy who supports Vivek, an indian with a haircut that looks like a helmet. I could care less about image. Vivek's policies win the day. That being said, when someone found a clip of Vivek rapping back in college, instead of hide from it, he embraced it. Dude spit some lines in Iowa. It was hilarious. He's human. Desantis claiming he's never heard of this or was not informed just doesn't ring true to me. It's stupid stuff like this that reveal character is all. And part of winning over an electorate, as the world doesn't exist in a vacuum, is winning over based on personality.

It's like the Nixon/Kennedy debate. This isn't new.

---

Except Kennedy was actually a great communicator. Trump talks like a moron and is now making dumb mistakes almost daily, which unfortunately also endears him to a small percentage of the population who barely pays attention to politics, has no idea what the issues actually are, and will go away once Trump is finally gone.

There may be too many of them and too much name recognition to overcome for this primary but that doesn't mean DeSantis should stoop to their level. He'll be ready to run again in 2028 when Trump is long forgotten and things are back to where they were before he hijacked the party.

---

Remember when I said half the posts here are simply mocking Trump?

Desantis could have easily run for office in 2028 without running in 2024. Whomever talked him into doing so really messed up. He can't run again as Governor, so what will he do? Sit out for two years as his name and legacy fade away? All he did by running now is piss off the die hard trump folks. You think they are going to forget? Just odd. Like I said, the only path forward for Desantis at this point is if Trump is behind bars. One way he could have played this is to back Trump, help him with the Presidency, get a cabinet level position to say within government and then run in 2028. That ship has sailed now.

---

Trump will probably die in the next year, when the iron is hot you dont decide to wait for years

---

Why do you think Trump will die in the next year? That's an odd statement.

astros4545 said:

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Tibbers said:

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J. Walter Weatherman said:

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Tibbers said:

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You're talking to a guy who supports Vivek, an indian with a haircut that looks like a helmet. I could care less about image. Vivek's policies win the day. That being said, when someone found a clip of Vivek rapping back in college, instead of hide from it, he embraced it. Dude spit some lines in Iowa. It was hilarious. He's human. Desantis claiming he's never heard of this or was not informed just doesn't ring true to me. It's stupid stuff like this that reveal character is all. And part of winning over an electorate, as the world doesn't exist in a vacuum, is winning over based on personality.

It's like the Nixon/Kennedy debate. This isn't new.

---

Except Kennedy was actually a great communicator. Trump talks like a moron and is now making dumb mistakes almost daily, which unfortunately also endears him to a small percentage of the population who barely pays attention to politics, has no idea what the issues actually are, and will go away once Trump is finally gone.

There may be too many of them and too much name recognition to overcome for this primary but that doesn't mean DeSantis should stoop to their level. He'll be ready to run again in 2028 when Trump is long forgotten and things are back to where they were before he hijacked the party.

---

Remember when I said half the posts here are simply mocking Trump?

Desantis could have easily run for office in 2028 without running in 2024. Whomever talked him into doing so really messed up. He can't run again as Governor, so what will he do? Sit out for two years as his name and legacy fade away? All he did by running now is piss off the die hard trump folks. You think they are going to forget? Just odd. Like I said, the only path forward for Desantis at this point is if Trump is behind bars. One way he could have played this is to back Trump, help him with the Presidency, get a cabinet level position to say within government and then run in 2028. That ship has sailed now.

---

Trump will probably die in the next year, when the iron is hot you dont decide to wait for years

---

I don't wish either on Trump but I'd say he is more likely to die than to go to jail first though both are possible in the next few years. He looks terrible. I wish he would just go back to MAL and support America First candidates and raise money for the cause. He'd rather burn it all down than leave power voluntarily though.

Tibbers said:

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astros4545 said:

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Tibbers said:

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J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

Tibbers said:

---

You're talking to a guy who supports Vivek, an indian with a haircut that looks like a helmet. I could care less about image. Vivek's policies win the day. That being said, when someone found a clip of Vivek rapping back in college, instead of hide from it, he embraced it. Dude spit some lines in Iowa. It was hilarious. He's human. Desantis claiming he's never heard of this or was not informed just doesn't ring true to me. It's stupid stuff like this that reveal character is all. And part of winning over an electorate, as the world doesn't exist in a vacuum, is winning over based on personality.

It's like the Nixon/Kennedy debate. This isn't new.

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Except Kennedy was actually a great communicator. Trump talks like a moron and is now making dumb mistakes almost daily, which unfortunately also endears him to a small percentage of the population who barely pays attention to politics, has no idea what the issues actually are, and will go away once Trump is finally gone.

There may be too many of them and too much name recognition to overcome for this primary but that doesn't mean DeSantis should stoop to their level. He'll be ready to run again in 2028 when Trump is long forgotten and things are back to where they were before he hijacked the party.

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Remember when I said half the posts here are simply mocking Trump?

Desantis could have easily run for office in 2028 without running in 2024. Whomever talked him into doing so really messed up. He can't run again as Governor, so what will he do? Sit out for two years as his name and legacy fade away? All he did by running now is piss off the die hard trump folks. You think they are going to forget? Just odd. Like I said, the only path forward for Desantis at this point is if Trump is behind bars. One way he could have played this is to back Trump, help him with the Presidency, get a cabinet level position to say within government and then run in 2028. That ship has sailed now.

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Trump will probably die in the next year, when the iron is hot you dont decide to wait for years

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Why do you think Trump will die in the next year? That's an odd statement.

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Life expectancy is 76 and Trump is 77 and a half. Both of his brothers have already died of natural causes. His father lived into his early 90s but had Alzheimers. Trump doesn't drink but he doesn't exercise except golf and he has a McDonalds diet. People get old and die, nothing can stop that.

You really find it odd that a 79 year old man that's not in the best of health and already outlived the average lifespan could die in the next year?

It's just an odd argument overall. Hell my great grandmother smoke and drank and lived into her late 90s. Outlived all her friends, sisters, etc. Point is, there's no way to ever actually know any of that crap. Not a debate worth having tbh. Policy is far more important.

Tibbers said:

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It's just an odd argument overall. Hell my great grandmother smoke and drank and lived into her late 90s. Outlived all her friends, sisters, etc. Point is, there's no way to ever actually know any of that crap. Not a debate worth having tbh. Policy is far more important.

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Coherent policy and the ability to get it implemented is even more important.

Tibbers said:

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astros4545 said:

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Tibbers said:

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J. Walter Weatherman said:

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Tibbers said:

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You're talking to a guy who supports Vivek, an indian with a haircut that looks like a helmet. I could care less about image. Vivek's policies win the day. That being said, when someone found a clip of Vivek rapping back in college, instead of hide from it, he embraced it. Dude spit some lines in Iowa. It was hilarious. He's human. Desantis claiming he's never heard of this or was not informed just doesn't ring true to me. It's stupid stuff like this that reveal character is all. And part of winning over an electorate, as the world doesn't exist in a vacuum, is winning over based on personality.

It's like the Nixon/Kennedy debate. This isn't new.

---

Except Kennedy was actually a great communicator. Trump talks like a moron and is now making dumb mistakes almost daily, which unfortunately also endears him to a small percentage of the population who barely pays attention to politics, has no idea what the issues actually are, and will go away once Trump is finally gone.

There may be too many of them and too much name recognition to overcome for this primary but that doesn't mean DeSantis should stoop to their level. He'll be ready to run again in 2028 when Trump is long forgotten and things are back to where they were before he hijacked the party.

---

Remember when I said half the posts here are simply mocking Trump?

Desantis could have easily run for office in 2028 without running in 2024. Whomever talked him into doing so really messed up. He can't run again as Governor, so what will he do? Sit out for two years as his name and legacy fade away? All he did by running now is piss off the die hard trump folks. You think they are going to forget? Just odd. Like I said, the only path forward for Desantis at this point is if Trump is behind bars. One way he could have played this is to back Trump, help him with the Presidency, get a cabinet level position to say within government and then run in 2028. That ship has sailed now.

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Trump will probably die in the next year, when the iron is hot you dont decide to wait for years

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Why do you think Trump will die in the next year? That's an odd statement.

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Just the way the world works
Old people tend to die

Dude is massively obese, under tremendous stress and old. He could pop any second.

Tibbers said:

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It's just an odd argument overall. Hell my great grandmother smoke and drank and lived into her late 90s. Outlived all her friends, sisters, etc. Point is, there's no way to ever actually know any of that crap. Not a debate worth having tbh. Policy is far more important.

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Of course we don't "know" but it is definitely worth discussing when we have a dementia riddled idiot in the Oval now and Trump is showing signs of decline and will be the same age if elected, actually older by the time he leaves. Sorry it is an inconvenient fact of life but it is what it is.

My Dad was the strongest badass man I've ever known. Head Yell Leader. Served 3 Tours in Nam. Insane work ethic and could light up a room. He was still very sharp into his 70s. Late 70s he started declining. The last few years before he died at 83 we had essentially reversed roles, you could see the spark here and there but he was nothing like he was before. My wife's Dad was an All State Football Player and as strong as an ox. He was sharp as a tack and died of a heart attack at 71 2 years ago. That's very typical. You hit your late 70s and you are on borrowed time, the odds of not having significant health issues or death after 80 are very small, especially among men who don't take care of themselves physically.

Maybe Trump is one of the lucky few but the odds are heavily stacked against him and the signs are all over the place that he isn't doing well even if you choose to ignore them. Yesterday in one speech he forgot the name of the town he was in, he said Hungary borders Russia, and he had the "losers" comment. That's with teleprompter help. You think this will get better?

J. Walter Weatherman said:

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Trump has brought a full Jerry Springer experience to politics, and unfortunately there are still a ton of morons in this country (and on this board) who like that type of entertainment and are now excited to be able to see it in politics too. They'll laugh at the jr. high level insults without realizing they are single-handedly handing all three branches of the government to the left in '24.

I still have hope they just represent a very small but vocal online minority of both complete idiots and shameless grifters like Poso and Kari Lake and the primaries surprise us, but who knows.

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I am coming to the conclusion even from the Trump supporters on this board that we are not dealing with serious people.


some just want the entire system to collapse, others enjoy being a victim and being able to blame unseen forces for their own problems, others just want to feel they are fighting the power, and then there are the grifters and the hangers on and the ignorant.

I am coming to the belief that many of the Trump supporters WANT Biden or Newsome to win another term- just so they can whine and moan about their lives for another 5 years and play the victim.

Tibbers said:

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It's just an odd argument overall. Hell my great grandmother smoke and drank and lived into her late 90s. Outlived all her friends, sisters, etc. Point is, there's no way to ever actually know any of that crap. Not a debate worth having tbh. Policy is far more important.

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why is there an age limit to join the military?
why is there mandatory retirement at many companies and unions?

aggie93 said:

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The Speaker was Trump's what, 3rd Choice and yet he tried to take credit for it in typical Trump fashion. Not all of us buy the hype.

I think the thing you miss on DeSantis is he sincerely isn't doing this stuff for the pomp and circumstance, he actually cares about making a difference. Thus he ran. Why? Trump will lose in '24 and we can't afford to have 4 more years of Democrat control. Simply sitting back and waiting while the country burns wasn't what he wanted to do even if it may have been politically expedient. That of course assumes 100 things btw trying to predict 5 years in the future. DeSantis has a hard core base though of intellectual conservatives and he has the highest favorables of any candidate. He's got plenty of future.

DeSantis is never going to be the cool guy, that's just not who he is. He doesn't like playing the game of celebrity. Trump and Vivek LOVE that part of it, they love the attention and adoration. DeSantis wants the job. It's all about what you value, a lot of folks like the shiny object.

I know you say you like Vivek on issues and I get it, though I think Vivek is surface level deep on those issues and that's the problem. I know you disagree and that's fine too but the reality is Vivek didn't care much about politics until a few years ago and as smart as he is he still is mainly book smart and is drastically lacking in experience. That's another topic really though.

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so this is the only thing I have ever disagree with Ags93 about

DeSantis actually IS a cool guy.

would love to have a beer with him and watch some college football.

you don't become a two term Governor of a swing state and finish at least 2nd in a Presidential contest without being a bit cool.

people confuse being a clown and carnival barker like Trump with being "cool"

"cool" is a leader that other people want to follow.

I'd rather follow Eisenhower than Obama.

LMCane said:

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aggie93 said:

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The Speaker was Trump's what, 3rd Choice and yet he tried to take credit for it in typical Trump fashion. Not all of us buy the hype.

I think the thing you miss on DeSantis is he sincerely isn't doing this stuff for the pomp and circumstance, he actually cares about making a difference. Thus he ran. Why? Trump will lose in '24 and we can't afford to have 4 more years of Democrat control. Simply sitting back and waiting while the country burns wasn't what he wanted to do even if it may have been politically expedient. That of course assumes 100 things btw trying to predict 5 years in the future. DeSantis has a hard core base though of intellectual conservatives and he has the highest favorables of any candidate. He's got plenty of future.

DeSantis is never going to be the cool guy, that's just not who he is. He doesn't like playing the game of celebrity. Trump and Vivek LOVE that part of it, they love the attention and adoration. DeSantis wants the job. It's all about what you value, a lot of folks like the shiny object.

I know you say you like Vivek on issues and I get it, though I think Vivek is surface level deep on those issues and that's the problem. I know you disagree and that's fine too but the reality is Vivek didn't care much about politics until a few years ago and as smart as he is he still is mainly book smart and is drastically lacking in experience. That's another topic really though.

---

so this is the only thing I have ever disagree with Ags93 about

DeSantis actually IS a cool guy.

would love to have a beer with him and watch some college football.

you don't become a two term Governor of a swing state and finish at least 2nd in a Presidential contest without being a bit cool.

people confuse being a clown and carnival barker like Trump with being "cool"

"cool" is a leader that other people want to follow.

I'd rather follow Eisenhower than Obama.

---

Responding to aggie93, we are supposed to like career politicians more than johnny-come-lately's?

LMCane said:

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aggie93 said:

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The Speaker was Trump's what, 3rd Choice and yet he tried to take credit for it in typical Trump fashion. Not all of us buy the hype.

I think the thing you miss on DeSantis is he sincerely isn't doing this stuff for the pomp and circumstance, he actually cares about making a difference. Thus he ran. Why? Trump will lose in '24 and we can't afford to have 4 more years of Democrat control. Simply sitting back and waiting while the country burns wasn't what he wanted to do even if it may have been politically expedient. That of course assumes 100 things btw trying to predict 5 years in the future. DeSantis has a hard core base though of intellectual conservatives and he has the highest favorables of any candidate. He's got plenty of future.

DeSantis is never going to be the cool guy, that's just not who he is. He doesn't like playing the game of celebrity. Trump and Vivek LOVE that part of it, they love the attention and adoration. DeSantis wants the job. It's all about what you value, a lot of folks like the shiny object.

I know you say you like Vivek on issues and I get it, though I think Vivek is surface level deep on those issues and that's the problem. I know you disagree and that's fine too but the reality is Vivek didn't care much about politics until a few years ago and as smart as he is he still is mainly book smart and is drastically lacking in experience. That's another topic really though.

---

so this is the only thing I have ever disagree with Ags93 about

DeSantis actually IS a cool guy.

would love to have a beer with him and watch some college football.

you don't become a two term Governor of a swing state and finish at least 2nd in a Presidential contest without being a bit cool.

people confuse being a clown and carnival barker like Trump with being "cool"

"cool" is a leader that other people want to follow.

I'd rather follow Eisenhower than Obama.

---

I think you misunderstand my meaning. It's not about someone like me or you it's about "cool" as in someone that is a big personality or would be popular or a celebrity even if they weren't in politics. Bill Clinton was cool with playing his sax. Obama and Vivek both have the cool persona that is shaped by very careful imaging and an extroverted personality. Trump is just a one of a kind personality. DeSantis is more of a regular guy who just happens to be really great at policy and politics. It's a job for him he is good at and he would probably rather spend all day working through developing legislation or policy than doing speeches and glad handing, he will do the latter because that's part of it but he's more focused on the former.

I agree with you that I'd rather hang out and have a discussion on life and policy with DeSantis over a beer than go to Mar a Lago and be wowed with pageantry but I also recognize we are unusual in that aspect and that hanging out with Trump is more "cool".

Good Morning ☀️ #TeamSanity

There are several indicators that Trump isn’t doing as well in Iowa as the polls suggest. Here are my top 3:

1. He’s spending a lot of money, running ads against DeSantis.

2. He’s… pic.twitter.com/29S8q8nXJl

— Jill Anthony (@JillSAnthony) November 1, 2023