Really excited about this. In the next several years we are going to see Ram offering this engine in their HD lines. More options is the best way to let the market work to find the right solution everyone says they are chasing. We need something other than EV to do that. Looking forward to see how this develops.
Ram is bringing a Hydrogen Cummins to market
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Last: 2 yr ago by peacedude
Really excited about this. In the next several years we are going to see Ram offering this engine in their HD lines. More options is the best way to let the market work to find the right solution everyone says they are chasing. We need something other than EV to do that. Looking forward to see how this develops.
Ok. Color me intrigued.
There are some very impressive developments in the hydrogen market. Refueling is still going to be a big issue.
Our socialists will find something wrong with it
Oh the huge manatee
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More ways for a Dodge to catch fire!
Owlagdad said:
Our socialists will find something wrong with it
Our socialists haven't insider-traded it
Hydrogen is a TERRIBLE fuel. Why would they waste their time?
One problem: most of our hydrogen on earth is bound to oxygen, sulfur, carbon, etc. it takes energy to liberate it from those chemical bonds, more than you get reacting it again when you include thermal losses.
Hydrogen is a great clean fuel if you can get a lot of it as H2.
Hydrogen is a great clean fuel if you can get a lot of it as H2.
Inb4 the engineer and his team who invented this engine is found dead with two bullet holes in the back of his head and the cause of death ruled a suicide
Is there a recent movie on that?GeorgiAg said:
Oh the huge manatee
This is true. But is it better than strip mining rare earth minerals for all those batteries? My guess is it would take less energy than all of that production and transportation. Not to mention we wouldn't have the landfills full of useless batteries going forward.
There are issues, mainly in fuel supply, but I really like that there are options coming forth.
There are issues, mainly in fuel supply, but I really like that there are options coming forth.
Big O&G Foundations have been pushing the hydrogen agenda for exactly ... since Biden won the election.
A flipped switched and they realized "we need something new to keep making money"
A flipped switched and they realized "we need something new to keep making money"
Not that I'm aware of
I believe Toyota is now marketing a hydrogen-fueled vehicle that actually has a fuel cell powering an electric motor.
Hydrogen is the most abundant element on earth.aTmAg said:
Hydrogen is a TERRIBLE fuel. Why would they waste their time?
Don't worry XOM will make it commercial in due time.
I've seen YouTube videos of hydrogen stations in southern California where the hydrogen is supposedly generated on site. Generating it from electrolysis of water doesn't make sense, certainly not in California. Best as i can tell, the hydrogen is generated from natural gas.MouthBQ98 said:
One problem: most of our hydrogen on earth is bound to oxygen, sulfur, carbon, etc. it takes energy to liberate it from those chemical bonds, more than you get reacting it again when you include thermal losses.
Hydrogen is a great clean fuel if you can get a lot of it as H2.
Yes have not watched this video but they are bringing it to market quick!!
They can break it out of methane or hydrocarbons. Rarely, unbounded hydrogen gas is one of the vent gases in a well itself.
The problem is it takes added energy to break those chemical bonds and release the hydrogen and then collect and compress it so that it is at a useful density for transportation. A nuclear powered plant might be able to do that continuously at scale.
The problem is it takes added energy to break those chemical bonds and release the hydrogen and then collect and compress it so that it is at a useful density for transportation. A nuclear powered plant might be able to do that continuously at scale.
According to some people, the problem with the Hindenburg was not the hydrogen but the doping used on the fabric skin. It's very similar to the fuel in a solid rocket motor.GeorgiAg said:
Oh the huge manatee
Toyota's been selling hydrogen vehicles in California for a while. The issue is there are basically no where near enough stations to fill up at, and refilling is cumbersome (TLDW: much more so than with BEV's even, as the nozzles freeze etc).
A pricey conversion of an existing product for Cummins bro's probably makes sense to sell to take some sort of market share in green energy/get some sort of subsidy etc., but it's just PR really, nothing significant to note.
A pricey conversion of an existing product for Cummins bro's probably makes sense to sell to take some sort of market share in green energy/get some sort of subsidy etc., but it's just PR really, nothing significant to note.
In the video I saw, the guy fueled up after a ~300 mile trip. He had to fiddle with the nozzle and yes everything was iced up. However it took about five minutes and cost $60, comparable to gasoline.notex said:
Toyota's been selling hydrogen vehicles in California for a while. The issue is there are basically no where near enough stations to fill up at, and refilling is cumbersome (TLDW: much more so than with BEV's even, as the nozzles freeze etc).
A pricey conversion of an existing product for Cummins bro's probably makes sense to sell to take some sort of market share in green energy/get some sort of subsidy etc., but it's just PR really, nothing significant to note.
This is part of why I want Texas to build a ton of Nuclear power plants. With secure and excess electricity, things like electrolysis and desalination become viable solutions.MouthBQ98 said:
One problem: most of our hydrogen on earth is bound to oxygen, sulfur, carbon, etc. it takes energy to liberate it from those chemical bonds, more than you get reacting it again when you include thermal losses.
Hydrogen is a great clean fuel if you can get a lot of it as H2.
Just got done with this video...Good overview between hydrogen engines/ICB and Hydrogen fuel cells. Also goes into hydrogen production a little. Evidently Toyota is looking at a way to use manure to get it from the methane from that and other means as well. I'm intrigued.AgBQ-00 said:
Yes have not watched this video but they are bringing it to market quick!!
Some youtuber will buy one and immediately convert it back to diesel.
Seems like Ram of all companies would think twice before messing with the most flammable gas there is.
EDIT: Corrected LNG to CNG Compressed, not Liquified
The video guy is a little confused. Hydrogen fuel cells and tanks holding hydrogen to burn are two completely different things. At one point he says that, then he confuses the two several places.
Regarding the burning of hydrogen, sure it's clean, and you can do it with a normal internal combustion engine. Really don't need to develop a special engine to do so. It does appear that Cummins is working on a hydrogen engine specific to semi trucks.
I think the more interesting thing is that they are developing an engine that shares a common block, but can be built with different heads and intakes, to burn diesel or gas or other fuels.
Hydrogen, propane, or liquified natural gas, all burn very clean. The problem always has been and will be, two fold. Tanks and refilling.
It takes high pressure tanks for propane, and extremely high pressure tanks for H2 and CNG. That means weight, space, and safety concerns.
Then the problem becomes refilling. There is one CNG terminal in Amarillo, I have no idea where there is another. Propane is pretty common, but mainly for 5 gallon bottles. And as the video says, the only H2 stations are in California.
Hydrogen adds another problem. If you're not making it by refining fossil fuels, you make it by electric hydrolysis of water.
Our electric grid is at capacity now. Are we going to add millions of electric cars, and thousands of H2 plants?
It will only be possible if we start building nuclear power plants again.
The video guy is a little confused. Hydrogen fuel cells and tanks holding hydrogen to burn are two completely different things. At one point he says that, then he confuses the two several places.
Regarding the burning of hydrogen, sure it's clean, and you can do it with a normal internal combustion engine. Really don't need to develop a special engine to do so. It does appear that Cummins is working on a hydrogen engine specific to semi trucks.
I think the more interesting thing is that they are developing an engine that shares a common block, but can be built with different heads and intakes, to burn diesel or gas or other fuels.
Hydrogen, propane, or liquified natural gas, all burn very clean. The problem always has been and will be, two fold. Tanks and refilling.
It takes high pressure tanks for propane, and extremely high pressure tanks for H2 and CNG. That means weight, space, and safety concerns.
Then the problem becomes refilling. There is one CNG terminal in Amarillo, I have no idea where there is another. Propane is pretty common, but mainly for 5 gallon bottles. And as the video says, the only H2 stations are in California.
Hydrogen adds another problem. If you're not making it by refining fossil fuels, you make it by electric hydrolysis of water.
Our electric grid is at capacity now. Are we going to add millions of electric cars, and thousands of H2 plants?
It will only be possible if we start building nuclear power plants again.
Methane is CH3. Strip the H3, you are left with carbon, which is what they are trying to eliminate. What do they do with it?Quote:
Evidently Toyota is looking at a way to use manure to get it from the methane from that and other means as well.
It was just a part of a segment talking about different ways that are being looked at to produce hydrogen. No specifics other than that.
If you are generating H2 from methane, then you are reforming. The end product is CO2 and H2.CanyonAg77 said:Methane is CH3. Strip the H3, you are left with carbon, which is what they are trying to eliminate. What do they do with it?Quote:
Evidently Toyota is looking at a way to use manure to get it from the methane from that and other means as well.
This is still considered "green" because the carbon originated from a non-fossil fuel source. It is therefore "carbon neutral" (or close to it). The CO2 in this instance is part of the "carbon cycle".
But there's not enough manure to go around.
ETA: The CO2 would likely be vented, although it could be sequestered as it will be concentrated in the process.
Something out of the box to consider. It will seem especially so in the wake of the Covidian reaction.
Lets assume there is some real concern about the polluting character of something, like strip mining or take your pick. Pollutant, harmful, etc. So you are trying to limit impact.
By contrast, how important is absolute safety if it is not polluting? Until the TV age and before excessive insurance mankind pretty much just rolled the dice on whatever people chose to do. No one would have considered any form of travel `safe' compared to not leaving at all.
If Hydrogen incidents remain rare, maybe a clean energy like that (from what reading) would be worth the payoff.
Yes I think realistically hydrogen is about as cheap as gasoline to produce, given a reasonable electrical cost. It makes a lot more sense as such vs. BEV's which only deplete a very finite resource of precious metals for each one built.
Yet again, a choice would need to be made as to which type of structure for fueling/transportation society wishes to embrace if moving away from the much demagogued fossil fuels. Hydrogen makes a lot more sense, logically, but geopolitically there is less advantage for China/graft for politicians in moving to this vs. the precious metals/imbalances BEV's facilitate. A year ago there were less than 50 hydrogen fuel stations, period, in the entirety of the US.
In a 'reality' of truth, AGW is a BS scam and there's no need to move from cheap, reliable, locally sourced fossil fuels anyway, but at least hydrogen would also mean automakers continuing to invest in ICE engines.
Anyway, Cummins seems to be led by a woke CEO who is also prone to blathering about fuel cells/zero carbon by 2050 blah blah blah so I certainly would steer clear of any direct investments in them moving forward;
Yet again, a choice would need to be made as to which type of structure for fueling/transportation society wishes to embrace if moving away from the much demagogued fossil fuels. Hydrogen makes a lot more sense, logically, but geopolitically there is less advantage for China/graft for politicians in moving to this vs. the precious metals/imbalances BEV's facilitate. A year ago there were less than 50 hydrogen fuel stations, period, in the entirety of the US.
In a 'reality' of truth, AGW is a BS scam and there's no need to move from cheap, reliable, locally sourced fossil fuels anyway, but at least hydrogen would also mean automakers continuing to invest in ICE engines.
Anyway, Cummins seems to be led by a woke CEO who is also prone to blathering about fuel cells/zero carbon by 2050 blah blah blah so I certainly would steer clear of any direct investments in them moving forward;
DC will be the new energy capital of the world.AgBQ-00 said:Just got done with this video...Good overview between hydrogen engines/ICB and Hydrogen fuel cells. Also goes into hydrogen production a little. Evidently Toyota is looking at a way to use manure to get it from the methane from that and other means as well. I'm intrigued.AgBQ-00 said:
Yes have not watched this video but they are bringing it to market quick!!
Hydrogen Cummins is my porn name. I've already trademarked it and they are in for a fight.
H2O is a greenhouse gas.
All the H2O emissions from H vehicles would destroy the planet!
We must convert to coal produced electricity to charge batteries that end up as toxic waste.
All the H2O emissions from H vehicles would destroy the planet!
We must convert to coal produced electricity to charge batteries that end up as toxic waste.
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