Reprehensible. The first guys in should have died trying to get to him. I also watch weapon handling very closely when I am around someone with a weapon. Notice the first officers do not stack, they just wander around the hallway. If you watch closely, these guys are flagging each other a bunch. About 10 mins in the officer that takes up the right side with his patrol rifle rests the flash suppressor on his hand. These guys keystone copped this whole ordeal and their lack of training shows. Still, balls and the amount of firepower they had on hand would have won the day in the first 5 minutes of this event.

I don't know who the guy is that got grazed in the head, but he showed some initiative and gravitas going down the hall a couple of times. IF HE HAD LED, he could have mad a difference by coordinating this group of unorganized guys and made a move on the shooter.

Just piss poor all the way around. God bless those children and teachers. I hope the shooter is burns in hell for eternity.

It's being released Sunday to the people of Uvalde, Then to the rest of us. Thankfully, just the hall film, no classroom footage.

Nm

CM Trump Voter said:

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bay fan said:

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Thank god the one guy used the hand sanitizer to be sure amidst a school massacre he didn't get Covid. He should plan to move.

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While most of it shocked me, the hand sanitizer thing was just mindblowing.

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Yes. At first thought it was a school intercom of some kind-then as you watch....

Questions:
1) Did the school ever go into lockdown mode when the guy started shooting in the parking lot or with the staff member talking to 911.
2) Did the guy shoot the classroom door open, or did he walk in?

AggDogg61 said:

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Questions:
1) Did the school ever go into lockdown mode when the guy started shooting in the parking lot or with the staff member talking to 911.
2) Did the guy shoot the classroom door open, or did he walk in?

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Regarding #2, McCraw has said multiple times, and even told Congress in Austin I believe, that he simply just walked in the classroom. Apparently, it was impossible to lock the classrooms from the inside.

So can anyone make any sense as to how this all happened ? I question how all this was simply allowed to go on and no one went in and stopped it… is there something more sinister behind this ?

Incompetence and cowardice.

Can't imagine how those in the video sleep at night.

flakrat said:

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Can't imagine how those in the video sleep at night.

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My 14 year old and I just watched the entire video. His comment was, "Why didn't they just go and keep going until they got him?"

I cannot fathom how they just stood there like stooges. How did the two guys that were "148 yards" away from him not close the distance fast and engage? This ahole just strolled into the school and picked his target without any pressure on him at all. I really have a hard time understanding all of this.

This is the equivalent of the ramp dropping on D-Day or Iwo Jima and the soldiers/Marines going nope and hauling ass back to the ships.

How much of this can be contributed to our country crapping on cops for the last several years?

BattleGrackle said:

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Rapier108 said:

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The media wants photos and videos of dead children to drive the anti-gun narrative.

That footage should never be released.

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No. Release the footage except for when they enter the classrooms. Simple enough no bodies shown, but we can see exactly what the cops did for an hour.

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That's what I was talking about. Anything else is fair game.

2468 said:

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How much of this can be contributed to our country crapping on cops for the last several years?

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By looking at their body language and faces about 0% in my opinion. These guys were scared and disorganized. There is a difference between neglecting to pull over some shady looking dudes on the highway and letting innocent children bleed out.

Some cops just like the thought of being cops and not doing the job required of cops when the chips are down. I know for certain what I would have done in that situation. I would have met my maker with a smile on my face or shot his ass and trust me I am no tacticool badass.

fullback44 said:

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So can anyone make any sense as to how this all happened ? I question how all this was simply allowed to go on and no one went in and stopped it… is there something more sinister behind this ?

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https://alerrt.org/
the ALERRT center has a report on their home page you can download. It lays out the timeline and events.

I haven't watched the video yet, but as a proactive cop, an ALERRT trained Active Shooter Trainer and an active shooter instructor at my previous agency, I can tell you this event was a gross failure on so many levels. Primarily a lack of leadership and a lack of intestinal fortitude.

Pareto's principle is in full effect in LE.

Most of the training classes I have been to, 90% which were optional (not required by the trainees departments), the students I trained with would not have stood by and let this happen. But guys who go to classes on their own time and own dime, are a very small percentage of cops. They weren't in Uvalde, at least until someone showed up and took the initiative.

Embarrassing for any cop who actually cares.

fullback44 said:

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So can anyone make any sense as to how this all happened ? I question how all this was simply allowed to go on and no one went in and stopped it… is there something more sinister behind this ?

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In this case probably not at all. It would be real tricky to make sure you had a group of cowards in a small town. Second, the heros in this actually were the BP, feds, showing up.

Despite everything wrong with this tragedy, one thing it doesn't look like - is in any way --let's call it `engineered'. This was not engineered. Just two cents though.

2468 said:

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How much of this can be contributed to our country crapping on cops for the last several years?

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Not much.

The badge and credentialed welfare system has always been there. Smart cops are getting out of the profession in urban areas. The Uvalde area is still pretty pro LE, so no reason to change professions.

Many dedicated cops are staying in the profession, because it's not just a job. These guys were the welfare cops.

InfantryAg said:

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fullback44 said:

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So can anyone make any sense as to how this all happened ? I question how all this was simply allowed to go on and no one went in and stopped it… is there something more sinister behind this ?

---

https://alerrt.org/
the ALERRT center has a report on their home page you can download. It lays out the timeline and events.

I haven't watched the video yet, but as a proactive cop, an ALERRT trained Active Shooter Trainer and an active shooter instructor at my previous agency, I can tell you this event was a gross failure on so many levels. Primarily a lack of leadership and a lack of intestinal fortitude.

Pareto's principle is in full effect in LE.

Most of the training classes I have been to, 90% which were optional (not required by the trainees departments), the students I trained with would not have stood by and let this happen. But guys who go to classes on their own time and own dime, are a very small percentage of cops. They weren't in Uvalde, at least until someone showed up and took the initiative.

Embarrassing for any cop who actually cares.

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Are you still involved in this? If so can you give me some means of getting some of our local LEO's involved in this type of training? I am sure our Mayor and City Manager would be happy to foot the bill for it. I know and shoot with a lot of these guys and they would probably do it on their own dime also.

My wife (a teacher) was in active shooter training last week and it was pretty eye opening. Most of her training centered around stop the bleed and proper tourniquet application. We purchased out of our own pocket enough stop the bleed kits and tourniquets for her wing of the school (Not cheap). I want to do anything I can do to help protect her and her kids along with my freshman son.

Thanks.

I co-own an LE training company. I firmly believe that 95% of the people we train absolutely would not have let this happen and there is a lot of outrage in the various group chats I'm in. One of my friends responded to Parkland (he was with an agency that arrived after Broward County had camped out, too afraid to make a move) and he said that this was much, much worse than what happened there. In that case I think there were only a couple of SROs present initially. Here you have several well-equipped guys from multiple agencies just standing around like morons. I honestly do not know how any of them can live with themselves.

As you said, there is a difference between cops who are dedicated to their profession and invest time and effort into training vs those who just meet the minimum standards. I consider myself fortunate to mostly know the former kind and not very many of the latter.

JB!98 said:

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InfantryAg said:

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https://alerrt.org/
the ALERRT center has a report on their home page you can download. It lays out the timeline and events.

I haven't watched the video yet, but as a proactive cop, an ALERRT trained Active Shooter Trainer and an active shooter instructor at my previous agency, I can tell you this event was a gross failure on so many levels. Primarily a lack of leadership and a lack of intestinal fortitude.

Pareto's principle is in full effect in LE.

Most of the training classes I have been to, 90% which were optional (not required by the trainees departments), the students I trained with would not have stood by and let this happen. But guys who go to classes on their own time and own dime, are a very small percentage of cops. They weren't in Uvalde, at least until someone showed up and took the initiative.

Embarrassing for any cop who actually cares.

---

Are you still involved in this? If so can you give me some means of getting some of our local LEO's involved in this type of training? I am sure our Mayor and City Manager would be happy to foot the bill for it. I know and shoot with a lot of these guys and they would probably do it on their own dime also.

My wife (a teacher) was in active shooter training last week and it was pretty eye opening. Most of her training centered around stop the bleed and proper tourniquet application. We purchased out of our own pocket enough stop the bleed kits and tourniquets for her wing of the school (Not cheap). I want to do anything I can do to help protect her and her kids along with my freshman son.

Thanks.

---

ALERRT is free for cops, they just need to reach out and sign up, or host a course. Not sure how busy they are these days but they used to teach all over the country. The conference is great and had geared more towards a combined response (police, fire, EMS) and managing incidents. Used to be in TX every year, but in DC this year.

Most/ many local/state agencies receive some sort of training, I think. On the fed side, everyone does. Still have to have the will. There are lot's of resources, many free, but I haven't kept up as much as I would like. I will try to see if I can find more resources.

ALERRT is the gold standard as they standardize training so people from different agencies can operate on the same page. They also teach CRASE, civilian response to active shooter events

https://alerrt.org/Upcoming

https://alerrt.org/HostingRequests/startHostingRequest

JB!98 said:

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This is the equivalent of the ramp dropping on D-Day or Iwo Jima and the soldiers/Marines going nope and hauling ass back to the ships.

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It's much, much, much worse than that. There were literally dozens of them with equipment up the wazoo and there was only one gunman. I understand the point you're making, but even that is giving it way too much credit.

Also, there weren't children bring executed on the beach at D-Day.

InfantryAg said:

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JB!98 said:

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InfantryAg said:

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https://alerrt.org/
the ALERRT center has a report on their home page you can download. It lays out the timeline and events.

I haven't watched the video yet, but as a proactive cop, an ALERRT trained Active Shooter Trainer and an active shooter instructor at my previous agency, I can tell you this event was a gross failure on so many levels. Primarily a lack of leadership and a lack of intestinal fortitude.

Pareto's principle is in full effect in LE.

Most of the training classes I have been to, 90% which were optional (not required by the trainees departments), the students I trained with would not have stood by and let this happen. But guys who go to classes on their own time and own dime, are a very small percentage of cops. They weren't in Uvalde, at least until someone showed up and took the initiative.

Embarrassing for any cop who actually cares.

---

Are you still involved in this? If so can you give me some means of getting some of our local LEO's involved in this type of training? I am sure our Mayor and City Manager would be happy to foot the bill for it. I know and shoot with a lot of these guys and they would probably do it on their own dime also.

My wife (a teacher) was in active shooter training last week and it was pretty eye opening. Most of her training centered around stop the bleed and proper tourniquet application. We purchased out of our own pocket enough stop the bleed kits and tourniquets for her wing of the school (Not cheap). I want to do anything I can do to help protect her and her kids along with my freshman son.

Thanks.

---

ALERRT is free for cops, they just need to reach out and sign up, or host a course. Not sure how busy they are these days but they used to teach all over the country. The conference is great and had geared more towards a combined response (police, fire, EMS) and managing incidents. Used to be in TX every year, but in DC this year.

Most/ many local/state agencies receive some sort of training, I think. On the fed side, everyone does. Still have to have the will. There are lot's of resources, many free, but I haven't kept up as much as I would like. I will try to see if I can find more resources.

ALERRT is the gold standard as they standardize training so people from different agencies can operate on the same page. They also teach CRASE, civilian response to active shooter events

https://alerrt.org/Upcoming

https://alerrt.org/HostingRequests/startHostingRequest

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That is great. Thank you very much. I will make sure that this happens in our community.

JB!98 said:

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This is the equivalent of the ramp dropping on D-Day or Iwo Jima and the soldiers/Marines going nope and hauling ass back to the ships.

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Nah, that is WAY more understandable. WAY more. I can wrap my brain around that scenario.

JB!98 said:

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That is great. Thank you very much. I will make sure that this happens in our community.


Completely my pleasure, I try to spread the word.

Also, comms is a problem, I am trying to implement one of these apps that 1st Responders can sign up for to receive notification of an active shooter.

https://www.guard911.com/services/schoolguard/

http://www.asralertsystems.com/crisis-notification-to-police-first-responders-asr-alert-systems

I don't know these two particularly, but I know there are free ones for 1st Responders. If you're off duty you may not know about an event till it's too late.

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Clown Baby said:

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JB!98 said:

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This is the equivalent of the ramp dropping on D-Day or Iwo Jima and the soldiers/Marines going nope and hauling ass back to the ships.

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It's much, much, much worse than that. There were literally dozens of them with equipment up the wazoo and there was only one gunman. I understand the point you're making, but even that is giving it way too much credit.

Also, there weren't children bring executed on the beach at D-Day.

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Concur. May have been a bad comparison. I just cannot understand the lack of testicular fortitude in that group. Like I said, that dude in the tie showed some but seemed to just wander around. I just don't get it.

The bortac agent who shot the guy walks in at the 1:19:03 point (12:47). He looks fairly calm and collected. Seems ironic that the guy dressed like the average joe ends up going in while the guys dressed like GI joe stand around for over an hour.

The door to the right of where all the officers were bunched up was locked. Probably half way thru the video you see them try to open it and it is locked. They finally convince the person inside to unlock it and one person scampers out. They then search the room and then come out.

Nada! Cowardice. Do you really thing those cowards standing in that hallway were thinking about how they have been perceived these last few years? I will answer for you. They were scared ****less!

This just so disgusting, and the image of the shooter just entering classroom nonchalant to do his evil, just
want to provide the image.

Provide teachers with two or three shot small flamethrowers. No real accuracy needed--the pain will probably neutralize such a shooter most of the time. What gave the idea is the possibility of using a fire extinguisher's gas as a weapon on him.

Most of the dudes in that hallway should suck start their pistol.

bay fan said:

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Thank god the Beto voter used the hand sanitizer to be sure amidst a school massacre he didn't get Covid. He should plan to move.

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Fify

titan said:

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This just so disgusting, and the image of the shooter just entering classroom nonchalant to do his evil, just
want to provide the image.

Provide teachers with two or three shot small flamethrowers. No real accuracy needed--the pain will probably neutralize such a shooter most of the time. What gave the idea is the possibility of using a fire extinguisher's gas as a weapon on him.

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Hell at this point just let them be armed with something. There are typical teacher days where my wife comes home and hates everyone and everything because of how her kids act. I guarantee you that if you put her in a position where she had to defend those same kids she would die trying.

2468 said:

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How much of this can be contributed to our country crapping on cops for the last several years?

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If woke corporate culture can negatively impact talent recruitment, I'm sure national cop hating can motivate quality candidates to seek employment elsewhere.

There is no excuse for the initial hesitancy during gunfire. After that I assume they determined it was a hostage situation. That's only thing I can think of. Hopefully this video will ensure the fake cops move out of the way for real cops in the next school shooting.

lol...what tactics were so special here that needed to be kept secret?

Uvalde mayor is damn close to Arredondo level of stupid.

Will Twitter let me post this.... pic.twitter.com/BmAtoQ6HHy

— waffles? (@VoteComet2024) July 13, 2022